I don’t think those two terms work well anywhere these days. So many ‘traditional’ estates have embraced ’ modern’ ‘polished’ techniques and styles but are still producing wines of terroir and ‘classical’ distinction. Plus, classical and tradition are loaded terms anyway that fall apart with a bit of inspection, because styles always evolve over time, so the ‘tradition’ from late 1800s is not the same as early 20th c, mid-20th century, etc.
If you want to understand the Loire, or any region, you have to learn all these different currents, and of course it takes time!
If this is your first trip, then just pick a range of wineries, enjoy exploring, and build for future trips.
And while Loire pinot noir may not be the first choice for a deep dive geek obsession, no need to avoid it. It can be delightfully delicious and perfect for casual outdoor sessions in the region. Keep an open mind.
Thanks so much, I would love that, but financially it’s not within my budget, I’m afraid. That’s why I’m annoying you with all of these questions (; I have successfully explored regions on my own in this way and i wasn’t that familiar with them beforehand (but did my research).
Thanks, that’s definitely on my to do.
I tried some already. I still feel a little bit in the dark wrt sb (this was good but not great: 2022 Domaine Henry Pellé Menetou-Salon Morogues, i sampled sbs from other regions, especially enjoyed those from Friuli)/cf (I enjoyed this for instance, 2016 Charles Joguet Chinon Les Charmes), but concerning (dry) cb I like the more concentrated, exotic stuff that’s not afraid of a little rs. However, I don’t mind visiting producers whose style I don’t fancy because I still enjoy the educational aspect of it (and it’s an opportunity to change one’s opinion).
We did that before our trip, and what we found is that the Loire wines sold in our local wine stores in the US were not that representative of what is on offer in the region. We ate at local restaurants for lunch and dinner (food was great!) and visited a wine bar, and I did not seen any of the labels commonly imported anywhere on the menus. The local wines we did drink typically did not have a varietal listed on the bottle, and for the most part the reds were softer and less tannic than those sold in the US.
Read this thread, Paul. I see only one person has clicked on the link Howard posted; hopefully that one click was yours. That is the thread on Wine Berserkers regarding the red wines of the Loire Valley.
And this thread, as far as I know, is the thread on Wine Bererkers for the white wines of the Loire Valley.: Your Classification For Loire Whites
Read these two threads, take Howard’s suggestion to buy and taste, and then post your impressions and specific questions in those threads.
I promise this will yield far better information than the questions you’re currently asking.
This is the merchant I’m usually ordering from (Lobenbergs gute Weine).
Three questions:
Can other berserkers recommend different German merchants with a good loire selection?
Here’s the list of Loire producers available at this merchant sorted by grape variety. I’m recognizing a lot of names from WB Loire threads, so I think this should work. Would you say this suffices for a sample package?:
CB
Huet
Pierre Menard
Domaine FL Fournier Longchamps
Domaine des Roches Neuves
Bouvet Ladubay
Chateau de Plaisance
Domaine Baumard
Nicolas Joly
Domaine Filliatreau
Domaine du Collier
Chateau Yvonne
La Grange Tiphaine
La Grange aux Belles
Anne Claude Leflaive - Clau de Nell
SB
Vincent Gaudry
Domaine Vacheron
Claude Riffault
Patrice Moreux
Domaine Pellé
Alphonse Mellot
Domaine Didier Dagueneau
Caves de Pouilly
Domaine Jean Max Roger
Domaine des Corbillieres
Domaine des Huards
Pierre Menard
CF
Domaine des Roches Neuves
Domaine de Pallus
Bouvet Ladubay
Anne Claude Leflaive - Clau de Nell
Domaine Filliatreau
Domaine du Collier
Pierre Menard
Chateau du Plaisance
Chateau Yvonne
Domaine des Huards
La Grange Tiphaine
La Grange aux Belles
Domaine Fl Fournier Longchamps
Domaine des Corbillieres
Muscadet
Domaine de Bellevue Jerome Bretaudeau
Landron Chartier
Chateau du Coing
I was thinking of getting 2 bottles of CF, SB, and Muscadet roughly following Phil Trotter’s taxonomy of producer styles. Additionally, I’d like to order four bottles of CB. Two dry ones, a demi-sec and a moelleux. Let me know your thoughts.
Only had one Ecu red and while it was ok, it wasn’t exceptional and seemed very much for early consumption. My sample size of 1 conforms very much to your conclusions.
Thanks again Brian. I checked the thread on Loire whites and a couple of others. I was wondering if there’s a designated sancerre/pouilly-fume thread. Also, wrt cb I found great info about both terroirs and producer styles. With sb from the loire I struggle to find good material on the latter (I thought phil’s comments in this thread were very helpful). Can you recommend other threads? I know the wine doctor has been mentioned and i ordered the recommended loire wine book. I’m currently figuring out which wines to order from my merchant for a little sampling case.