When does flipping become selling at the market price?

WINE TALK
1

The whole Saxum thing got me thinking (no easy task). Say I have the mag of Bone for a year, and for whatever reason, decide I am going to sell it instead of drink it. Cost me $150. I can get $300 on the “market”. Does selling it for $300 make me a “flipper” or is that term defined by original intent - to buy it solely with the intention of making a profit?

Now, I need to get out of the house and do something productive.

2

for me, the “original intent” determines the matter … or a regular course of dealing

3

Intent is a big factor in my opinion. No matter if you sit on it for a year, 2, or 5; if you bought it thinking “I’m definitely going to sell it”, then, my friend, you’re a flipper.

Granted, it’s not as bad as the tonnage of Carlisle that was immediately put on CC yesterday, minutes after the mailer came out.

4

IMO, If you don’t offer it first to friends at cost then it makes you a flipper.

5

Dammed Yankees fans.

6

Like this?

7

It’s not always bad to be a Flipper…

8

Very simple. When you do it, it’s flipping. When I do it, it’s selling at a reasonable price. [bow.gif]

9

You are selling it after it came to the market fairly recently…for a profit…definition=flipper.

10

OK. When (if ever) would it not be flipping? 2, 5, 10 years? I just threw out 1 year because it was the first thing that came to mind.

Tastes change, and while I’ve always let things go cheap or at cost (although I did sell one bottle at a profit (like 20 bucks) because someone offered me that for it), I was just thinking about at what point does it become reasonable to sell for more than you bought if that is what the going price is?. I’d have a hard time calling anyone selling their 15 year old Bordeaux bottles- because they no longer like them- a flipper.

11

Most people would not define 15 years as “fairly recently” Paul. In any case, don’t take these opinions personally. It’s not like you’re trafficking human beings, right? Some flippers can actually be semi-decent people. [wink.gif]

12

Or even semi-conscious.

13

yeah, if you sell it after 10 years, you become an esteemed “collector”
day trader vs. investor… as long as you are making money, I don’t see any difference.

14

Flipping is the practice of buying an allocated wine and then more or less immediately reselling it, at cost or for a profit (though for a profit’s more common). I’d say a year or 2 after purchase… but it’s more intent than time. You have no interest in the wine, you’re just buying it to make money (keep your position on the list) etc.

Now back to the Elle Macpherson photo…

15

Or semi-productive even.

16

Oh, people I never sell. I keep them locked up in my “cellar”.

I can’t take it personally because I’ve never done it. So, is the criteria “fairly recently”, or intent, or what? I’m kinda on the side that if I bought them to drink them, and I don’t know anyone who would want them at cost (or I would enjoy opening them for), why leave $$ on the table to a stranger (who could turn around and sell them for more)?

17

18

sometimes I wonder about the economics of flippers/collector.
You have to buy many different producers, different cuvee, in many vintages to finally have a home run like 2007 Saxum JBV. Can the cost be recuperated? It is not like you are a venture capitalist: you can still make money with only 10% hit rate because that one hit could be Google.
If we don’t have any negative preconception about flippers, we might get one to share his/her thought!

19

Jan - Flippers are, I think, much more scarce than few years ago when you could buy allocated CA cults and sell t hem for double, triple or more of the price.

Serge - Some people might still hold the 2000 Pavie that they bought on futures since it’s sunk cost and the like the wine. Some might sell off a bit to basically cover the cost of the rest. Some might decide they don’t like that style or where the wine is headed. Meh.

20

Ask Jordan and Tyler, they know the answer grouphug .