I’m not sure outside of a rare mention on here, I ever hear anything at all about Greek wine. Where are you hearing it be overrated or overhyped?
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Oh man, this was slick. It took me a second to get it 
I think he was just responding to Jay’s question on where retsina is made.
Ah my bad. So hard to follow those sub-conversations on this board when the replied-to post is not quoted.
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Although not intended, you have unleashed one of the greatest (to be) grocery store wine names ever. 2 cases of Dreaming Beagle please!
Is that Dreagle, for short?
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Fixed
Coming in to pick up his allocation
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A few things that struck me when I explored a bunch of high-end Oregon PNs recently: The flavor signature most common is an earthly, loamy quality. Jammy fruity is rarely on the menu here. Perhaps this is what can be mistaken for bitterness. But in the better wines this comes along with great complexity and depth, much like in an excellent craft beer.
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Other than the ones already mentioned (some of which I agree on, some of which I don’t), I would say Priorat and Canadian Icewine.
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Sometimes I think that the best “Napa Cabernet” come from the Santa Cruz Mountains (Ridge, Mount Eden).
Seems like you are making a case that Piedmont Nebbiolo used to be underpriced and underrated and that they are now no longer the values they used to be (although I can sometimes look at the prices for old Nebbiolo at Chambers Street and really wonder if that is true). But, I don’t see where you have made the case that they are overrated because at no point do you question the quality of the wines.
I don’t think he needs to make the case that the quality isn’t there. Just that he isn’t finding the same quality for price anymore (I can personally disagree, but that’s also the entire point of this thread).
When people say that Napa Cab is overrated, it theoretically comes down to price. Right? People aren’t finding what they want from Napa for the price they pay. Whilst many others clearly have zero issue with paying big prices for Napa Cab.
This whole thread is subjective as we are talking generally about regions that make excellent wine on the whole.
Um, no. First, I was replying to TGibson’s post. There are wines across the price spectrum that I think are worth the price. It’s more that it’s a minefield with a lot of badly made wines that get high ratings and command a high price. That’s the same with Napa.
I do have strong opinions about Nebbiolo. Plenty of benchmarks. Producers group meetings where we’re tasting through wines with the winemakers and growers, listening to the talk about the wines, then fielding questions. Have hands-on experience making it from '09 to current, 6 vineyards, 3 wineries plus ho’made. To me if it’s too ripe it loses touch with what it is, and tends to be disgusting. It’s very sensitive to oak, which can easily dominate and show from pretty to pretty disgusting. I think a lot of what I’ve tasted from the recent and current era is producers trying to fight the acid and tannin in a very amateurish manner to try to make wines that appeal young. I know a lot of people like the ones I don’t, but when ones I like are on the table alongside those, those more tolerant people seem to prefer the ones I like.
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Who is raving about the glories of Canadian Icewine? Your post is the first reference to Canadian Icewine I have seen since Hector was a pup. Where is it “rated?”
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My wife is from Buffalo. She mentioned that Niagara region Ice wine was a bit of a tourist attraction. When we were back there, we decided that the Finger Lakes region sounded more interesting.
Historical perspective: the original ranking rating of wine was the Bordeaux 1855 Classification, based on price realized in the marketplace. Burgundy followed suite.
With pricing established as a rating basis, any region where greed runs rampant and the limits of what the market will bear are pushed to the limit “just because they can” is
overrated.
Question for you Wes:
Are the Barolo / Barbaresco wines that you like also getting more drinkable young than they used to
Or is it all / mostly those styles you don’t like that are developing the early appeal?
I hold almost all the ones I buy for maturity and thus don’t taste many young, but someone served me blind a 19 and 20 of a good producer recently (I’m blanking but could probably find out) and I was amazed how easy they were to drink.
Edit: it was Vajra Bricco Della Viole 19 and 20
It’s not as overrated as pinotage
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