Let's talk Chambolle

[Alex_Valdes]

Friends,

Thev reaction to this thread is overwhelming and quite rightly so. To my amazement there was someone who did not like MUSIGNY??? Has the world gone bonkers? has Trump really brainwashed atoo many Americans?? Sorry just skip this last one but better join me in a near future when me and certain friends once again devour Musigny by ROUMIER? CD Vogüé and Mugnier. Heavenly bliss. Bonnes Mares better??? Roumier’s sometimes…!!!

SINCERELY JOHAN

Looking forward to an invite! I will contribute

[Greg_K]

I think Chambolle is in a slightly interesting place because outside of Mugnier and Roumier most winemakers who make the best Chambolle are not really “Chambolle” producers - i.e. Mugneret-Gibourg and Tremblay (Feuselottes), Hudelot-Noellat (Charmes), Fourrier (Gruenchers), Baudes (Drouhin, Lignier), etc… I like what I’ve had from recent Felettig vintages and am curious to try more Amiot-Servelle, but a lot of Chambolle is held by de Vogue, so…shrug.

[Peter_Chiu]

Johan…you misunderstood the contents of this thread - for example : Michael did not enjoy Musigny that much because of its high price. He would rather spend his wine money on other wines due to QPR factor.

Here is what Matt Kramer ( an American ) said in his book : Making Sense Wine. A great connoisseur ( in red burgundy wines ) is a person, beside having the knowledge, immense experience, should also coupled with his right approach.

What it mean is : he must yield freely to the fact that greatness ( in a red burgundy wine ) is not just the province of a few plots of famous plots of land in CdOr.

[Gaudissabois_Johan]

Hallo Pzzter,

Thank you for your always very informative comments. But is MUSIGNY by Roumier really that expensive? It surely is on the secondary market. But Christophe himself has always been reasonable. Compared to LEROY most great Burgundies are bargains. But that’s another discussion… Meanwhile Peter : keep up the good work and keep posting here.

SINCERELY JOHAN

[Peter_Chiu]

Johan…thanks for your comments.

I was not going to post about my habits but since you mentioned about Musigny by Leroy.

I will post.

I owned multiple bottles of 4 Musigny which were available to be purchased rom vintage 1995. Here are the details :

Leroy - Musginy 95 4 bottles (814475 $646 )
De Vogue - Musigny v.v. 95 12 bottles
Drouhin - Musigny 95 13 bottles
J. Prieur - Musigny 95 6 bottles


You will notice that I did not keep a record of the prices for the other 3 Musigny as they were not that important. But I remembered clearly…they were at around 18 to 25 % of that of the Leroy. DRC - La Tâche 95 was at ( 08905 $695)

I invited my wine-friends ( without asking them to pay for anything except the food-cost) and did many single blind tasting with the above 4 wines at an interval of few years apart…for example : when young, for at 8, and then for sure at 10. Whenever I served the Leroy, I always put it against all the other 3.

At the end of my many tastings I personally ended up with the conclusion I preferred Prieur.

Later to give face to one of my friends…I gave away my Leroy Musginy 1995.

Another part of this sad store, the sole agent for the importation of Leroy wines - for vintage 1994, 1995 and 1996 - to Quebec, Canada…did not do well and he gave up business.


Leroy - Les Beaux Monts 94 4948 btls
Leroy - CdVougeout 94 719849 $210
Leroy - Richebourg 94 718831 $368 1740 btls
Leroy - Romanée St.Vivant 94 719773 $368 2040 btls

Leroy - Musigny 95 814475 $646 584 btls
Leroy - Richebourg 95 813899 $597 1164 btls
Leroy - CdVougeout 95 879262 $229
Leroy - Les Genevriéres 95 813717 $116 1168 btls

Leroy - Les Fremiéres 96 906941 $125 1755 btls
Leroy - Les Genevriéres 96 906933 $89 2048 btls
Leroy - Aux Laviéres 96 906925 $85 2632 btls
Leroy - Aux Allots 96 906891 $85 2048 btls
Leroy - Les Narbantons 96 906917 $65 2342 btls

[MChang]

I think Chambolle is in a slightly interesting place because outside of Mugnier and Roumier most winemakers who make the best Chambolle are not really “Chambolle” producers - i.e. Mugneret-Gibourg and Tremblay (Feuselottes), Hudelot-Noellat (Charmes), Fourrier (Gruenchers), Baudes (Drouhin, Lignier), etc… I like what I’ve had from recent Felettig vintages and am curious to try more Amiot-Servelle, but a lot of Chambolle is held by de Vogue, so…shrug.

Barthod…

[MChang]

Friends,

Thev reaction to this thread is overwhelming and quite rightly so. To my amazement there was someone who did not like MUSIGNY??? Has the world gone bonkers? has Trump really brainwashed atoo many Americans?? Sorry just skip this last one but better join me in a near future when me and certain friends once again devour Musigny by ROUMIER? CD Vogüé and Mugnier. Heavenly bliss. Bonnes Mares better??? Roumier’s sometimes…!!!

SINCERELY JOHAN

Musigny is fine but I prefer Chambertin and the Vosne grand cru as I stated above. I’ve found the majority of Bonnes Mares I’ve had lately are better than the Musigny I’ve had, from similar producers (Roumier, Marchand Tawse, etc).

[MChang]

Hallo Pzzter,

Thank you for your always very informative comments. But is MUSIGNY by Roumier really that expensive? It surely is on the secondary market. But Christophe himself has always been reasonable. Compared to LEROY most great Burgundies are bargains. But that’s another discussion… Meanwhile Peter : keep up the good work and keep posting here.

SINCERELY JOHAN

Cellar door pricing is really irrelevant because most people aren’t buying directly from the domaine. Last time I checked Roumier musigny was 5-6x the cost of his Bonnes Mares.

[Scott_Brunson]

I think Chambolle is in a slightly interesting place because outside of Mugnier and Roumier most winemakers who make the best Chambolle are not really “Chambolle” producers - i.e. Mugneret-Gibourg and Tremblay (Feuselottes), Hudelot-Noellat (Charmes), Fourrier (Gruenchers), Baudes (Drouhin, Lignier), etc… I like what I’ve had from recent Felettig vintages and am curious to try more Amiot-Servelle, but a lot of Chambolle is held by de Vogue, so…shrug.

Barthod…

Consider yourself thanked twice.
Love Barthod with time in the bottle.
That crazy Bourgogne is often magical for the $

[jason_stein]

I think Chambolle is in a slightly interesting place because outside of Mugnier and Roumier most winemakers who make the best Chambolle are not really “Chambolle” producers - i.e. Mugneret-Gibourg and Tremblay (Feuselottes), Hudelot-Noellat (Charmes), Fourrier (Gruenchers), Baudes (Drouhin, Lignier), etc… I like what I’ve had from recent Felettig vintages and am curious to try more Amiot-Servelle, but a lot of Chambolle is held by de Vogue, so…shrug.

Barthod…

Consider yourself thanked twice.
Love Barthod with time in the bottle.
That crazy Bourgogne is often magical for the $

I’m not a buyer of most of Barthod’s range but I consider the bourgogne to be a consistently great value.

[Peter_Chiu]

Barthod will be the next Roumier, if not now - as Roumier will out-sale himself in the secondary markets.

As the Barthod domaine owns 9 1er curs in Chambolle + 1.76 ha of the village; so I would take a guess that their crazy Bourgogne should be declassified juice from the young-vines.

One should be honored to drink it …as a QPR.

[brodie_thomson]

I think Chambolle is in a slightly interesting place because outside of Mugnier and Roumier most winemakers who make the best Chambolle are not really “Chambolle” producers - i.e. Mugneret-Gibourg and Tremblay (Feuselottes), Hudelot-Noellat (Charmes), Fourrier (Gruenchers), Baudes (Drouhin, Lignier), etc… I like what I’ve had from recent Felettig vintages and am curious to try more Amiot-Servelle, but a lot of Chambolle is held by de Vogue, so…shrug.

I am big fan of the Bruno Clavelier Combe d’Orveau. Lovely depth ages very well.

Brodie

[jason_stein]

Barthod will be the next Roumier, if not now - as Roumier will out-sale himself in the secondary markets.

As the Barthod domaine owns 9 1er curs in Chambolle + 1.76 ha of the village; so I would take a guess that their crazy Bourgogne should be declassified juice from the young-vines.

One should be honored to drink it …as a QPR.

Their Bourgogne is actually from the Bons Batons vineyard just over the border from Chambolle. Really great wine.

[Hank_Victor]

I know that the Drouhin wines get love but are any of the Jadot C-M wines worth trying?

[Scott_Brunson]

Barthod will be the next Roumier, if not now - as Roumier will out-sale himself in the secondary markets.

As the Barthod domaine owns 9 1er curs in Chambolle + 1.76 ha of the village; so I would take a guess that their crazy Bourgogne should be declassified juice from the young-vines.

One should be honored to drink it …as a QPR.

Their Bourgogne is actually from the Bons Batons vineyard just over the border from Chambolle. Really great wine.

Yep
And yep

[MChang]

Laurent Barthod/boillot is gonna have quite the portfolio in time

[Peter_Chiu]

Barthod will be the next Roumier, if not now - as Roumier will out-sale himself in the secondary markets.

As the Barthod domaine owns 9 1er curs in Chambolle + 1.76 ha of the village; so I would take a guess that their crazy Bourgogne should be declassified juice from the young-vines.

One should be honored to drink it …as a QPR.

Their Bourgogne is actually from the Bons Batons vineyard just over the border from Chambolle. Really great wine.

Merci …

[Peter_Chiu]

I think Chambolle is in a slightly interesting place because outside of Mugnier and Roumier most winemakers who make the best Chambolle are not really “Chambolle” producers - i.e. Mugneret-Gibourg and Tremblay (Feuselottes), Hudelot-Noellat (Charmes), Fourrier (Gruenchers), Baudes (Drouhin, Lignier), etc… I like what I’ve had from recent Felettig vintages and am curious to try more Amiot-Servelle, but a lot of Chambolle is held by de Vogue, so…shrug.

I am big fan of the Bruno Clavelier Combe d’Orveau. Lovely depth ages very well.

Brodie

I would not doubt it.

Jasper Morris reported ( in his Book - Inside Burgundy page 224 ) that according Bruno Clavelier’s view his parcel 0f 0.82 ha - lied in the lieu-dit : Combe d’Orveau - would have been classified in 1929 as a Musigny Grande-Cru Controlled - same as the whole parcel of 0.77 ha which also lied in the lieu-dit : Combe d’Orveau and owned by J. Prieur.

[Peter_Chiu]

So I’ve noticed over the past several months that I’m really digging good reds from Chambolle-Musigny. Every bottle I open just sings with my palate. Looking at my cellar I wonder why I don’t have more wines from this appellation?

I literally have a handful of Musigny 1er/GC and at the same time my cellar is buldging with reds from VR, GC, etc. I love a great Chambertin and of course VR is amazing, but there’s something extra satisfying from CM with the sweet, floral nose and deep earthy palate. But for some reason I just haven’t bought it.

Anyone else also digging CM? What are your favorite CM options? I’m interested in everything: village, 1er and also Musigny.

I just re-read above and I also re-read Dr.Jules Lavalle’s book ( in 1855 ) - Histoire et Statistique et des Grande Vins de la CdOr in which he rated some First Class vineyards in Cd’Or.

Here is my final thoughts - paying special attentions to the comments by my friends Johan ( for his love of Musigny ) and Michael ( for his shy-away from Musigny due to its current prices), I would suggest to the red burgundy lovers the following : look closely for CdV made by your preferred producers who happened to own their land at the up-part of the CdV.

My reasons are : their sites are close enough to gthe AC Musigny ( perhaps may be added a firmness similar to Chambertin *; and the price for CdV are mostly likely : right ( with the except from Leroy).

Dr. Lavelle rated CdV as the number 4th - in the dicentiing order - in first class : needless to say the 1st was RC; Chambertin came 2nd and the third was : Richeboug ( another favour AC by Johan). CdV was No 4; before No. 5 RStV and No. 6 La Tache and finally : Les St. Georges at the final spot : N.7,

Surpirisng Dr. Lavelle rated : Chambolle as a Second Class. That being he did mentioned that Musginy as a vineyard of First Class and as equal of La Tache, St. Georege and Corton.

[Jay_Miller]

I know that the Drouhin wines get love but are any of the Jadot C-M wines worth trying?

While I personally prefer the Drouhin style many of Jadot’s wines from their own vines can be sensational. In particular I like their Baudes and their Amoureuses.

Speaking of which, Drouhin’s Baudes is tied for me with their Amoureuses as my favorite 1er Cru from them.

I’ve avoided talking it up over the years but I’m not really buying any more…

I’d say I prefer Jadot’s Amoureuses to Drouhin’s and vice versa for the Baudes. But I’d drink any of them with joy.

I prefer Drouhin’s Musigny hands down to Jadot’s (based on only one bottle of 1993 of the latter however so take it with a grain of salt).

Over the general range I like Drouhin hands down, from the village Chambolle, the 1er Cru, etc.

In the late '90s and early 2000s Fourrier made some remarkably beautiful Chambolle-like wines. Some of them came from Gevrey .

My problem with Barthod is I never get the timing right. If someone else opens one it is a beautiful ethereal wine. If I open one it’s shut down tight as a drum. I eventually gave up.