William Kelley on PreMox

Great video from our guy @William_Kelley . Super interesting and very well done.

Side note…i can just listen to William talk all freaking day. I’m pretty sure he could tell me something absolutely ridiculous like ‘the earth is flat’, or ’ @Robert.A.Jr is more handsome and in better shape than i am’ and I’d just smile and nod.


Haha, for sure, it’s the whole setting. The roaring fire. Marble accents. Cashmere sweater. Nerdy hipster horn-rimmed glasses. Attire slightly wrinkled so as not to look packaged for television. Polysyllabic, obscure words mellifluously flowing from his tongue. Accented-speak to add that air of elitism. He brings British snobbery back to cool! I cannot recall the subject of the videoclip, but rate it 5 stars.

Now I must address the shout out. You will need to bring your A+ game, and speedo, when you ever dare come to my turf!


Fantastic video by WK as always!

I was waiting for the twist at the end when Wk tells us that what’s in his glass isn’t premox. It’s actually a well aged d’auvenay chevalier and if you have a few cases at home, no harm cracking one open tonight! :smiley:

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For those of us who are impatient,

  1. what goes he think the cause was
  2. is he confident it’s over
  3. are there still Burgundy producers still denying the issue exists/ existed

It’s less than ten minutes!

You won’t spend a better ten minutes understanding wine.


100%! Come on Barry…you’ve got this :rofl:

I love William and his contributions, but other than using a screwcap or diam closure, I’m not sure he offered anything new to the premox discussion, other than a nice summary of some things that might or might not be contributors. That’s not really a criticism, because I have yet to hear anything definitive on the subject after all these years.


I think he made clear that there is no one reason but a bunch of. And I guess he is right.


Once again, the dreaded Premature Moxidation raises its ugly head in WB.


Great info! The only thing that could have made it better was a Corgi sitting on his lap!


2 and 3 weren’t answered. As for causation, it’s as we all concluded years ago in the premox thread and on wiki, but nicely summarized: less sulfur, batonnage issues, too gentle pressing, all coupled with cork variability.


And I know that this is probably been questioned before, but why would there be such variation in those corks and not any other corks at the same time? Is there proof that there were special corksthat were produced for burgundy and nowhere else? And I truly am curious about this. Thank you for any information you or anyone anyone else can provide on this.

With regards to the other explanations, that makes a great deal of sense. Or, at least you can understand some of the causation. Not all of it though.


it’s a fact that cork quality is now less—producing at a younger bark age—and that was the fuse that allowed the combination of batonnage, lower sulfur, new pressing techniques (gentler) to explode and cause premox. Red wine has more antioxidants and the Burgundy white winemaking changes weren’t universal in either other white wine areas (sometimes affected) or red wine. Proof of the cork factor is the complete lack of premox in screwcapped wines.

No special corks in Burgundy and variable oxygen permeability in corks weren’t really an issue till the other factors came into play.


Or who don’t do Instagram……
(Don’t get me started….)

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Hey Richard I don’t have an insta account and the video plays for me-just click it and give it a try.


Oh you must be one of the cool kids though … you said “insta” :rofl:

At the risk of thread drift … the nadir of “insta” and food & wine had to be a cooking competition show I saw part of a while back where the prize was to take on the kitchen at a boutique London hotel (the Langham? I forget). One of the criteria the judges kept using was whether the food was ‘instagrammable’. Yikes! :scream:


One thing— Bâttonage if done right shouldn’t be an issue. It should be done as we top barrels— remove bung, place baton in barrel, fill with topping wine, stir, remove baton, fill and bung. That’s the technique I have devised. Takes a bit more time but worth it


Producing at a younger age leads to what ‘deficiency’ in corks? Less dense?

We can ‘assume’ lots of things but just looking for facts if possible.



supposed to be harvested every 9 years. I’ve read somewhere that cheaper corks have been used—either younger or lower quality corks are being used. I don’t know what in cork determines quality.


I get the disdain and cynicism for social media. I really do. But honestly man, Insta isn’t that bad. Overall, much less 'offensive ’ than other platforms I’d say, as it’s mostly visual. Great wine content as well.

Take that with a grain of salt though…as I’m most definitely one of the cool kids :wink: