I don’t prefer new oak taste, but to me Nebbiolo (from Piedmont) does it better. Don’t like it in syrah.
Would you like to buy some of my Aldo Conterno? 
Admittedly, I’ve more than enough (2 bottles of '96 Granbussia), thank you. Have to get a Lala (don’t have nor the desire to have any) into the upcoming Northern R dinner just to see what you guys are talking about in the other thread.
+1 on Riesling for worst white.
I do know that Gaja, and their adherents, uses new oak–but isn’t most traditional Nebbiolo aged in old large chestnut casks (not oak)?
Let’s do it!
In regard to worst grape, I’d say that for any grape there can be too much new oak at some level. Is the question basically asking are there grapes where the threshold is zero? And mutatis mutandis for best grape?
Chardonnay is interesting. Because it’s so neutral, a little oak can be terrific if balanced with other elements and awful in excess.
Against my better judgment I am making a few comments.
1/It’s not just new oak what what kind of new oak. For example, the idea of American oak and Zinfandel–the American grape variety it is sometimes said–is popular. But I think the high alcohols of Zinfandel can pull some unpleasantness and extreme obviousness out of the barrel. European oak is much better for Zinfandel. We see on this website a lot of love for Bedrock, Scherrer and Carlisle. In order to afford new French or Hungarian oak the wine has to sell for over $35, a difficult price for Zinfandel. I love older Ridge Zin.
2/Sangiovese seems to repel 60 gallon barrels but I have seen wonderful results with 400 L and 500 L barrels.
3/Aromatic whites and new oak?? Counterproductive for most.
4/Nebbiolo?? The best results I have seen here are with 500 L. This is a weird variety with little colors, lots of tannin and acid…are we crazy?? Why do we bother.
5/Barbera…French oak works well here.
6/Chardonnay…a friend used to compare chicken to Chardonnay…it’s all how you grow it, make it…it’s kind of a blank slate variety but we all love well-aged barrel fermented sur lies Chardonnay…as long as there is no premox!
7/Pinot Noir…usually a no no for American oak, very popular with French and Hungarian…I could go on for ten pages on this subject so will spare all of you
8/Bordeaux reds…the advantage of these varieties is you can always tell the buyer to age it.
9/Syrah…everyone has an opinion of what they like here. I have a lot of older Qupe Syrahs aged in a high percentage of new french oak. They have turned out well. As alluded to earlier, Guigal’s wines inspire hate and love.As the French say, A chacun son egout.
Re chestnut:
If you make a barrel or tank with chestnut the wine you age in it will be almost nastily astringent. So usually the interior is coated with paraffin or something else to neutralize the roughness. I sold some uncoated chestnut barrels to Mondavi around 1984. The results reminded me of unripe persimmons. A friend working there told me the wine was drinkable after five uses or so.
I am not an authority of the Piedmont but on my last visit I saw more 60 gallon French than anything else.
The last I heard of Gaja he was buying his own wood several years in advance.
I expect that all of us regularly buy, drink, and enjoy wines at see new oak. Including those of us who make the most noise about hating oak.
It’s really a question of how well or poorly it works with the wine in question overall. Does it stick out too much, or excessively obscure the character of the grapes, or make the win too heavy or rich or harsh.
It’s kind of like salt in food. At some point, and in some food, it gets to be too much. But most of the time, it adds something positive and we don’t even realize it.
It’s a good thread anyway. It is quite interesting how different varieties respond differently.
Thanks, and as someone who has bitten into a native unripe persimmon, I appreciate that reference.
My Nebbiolo producers mostly use large barrels, some puncheons. A producer in the Valtellina is using chestnut for half of his Nebbiolo, I believe uncoated, but I’ll have to check.
Nel,
Great notes, and on point.
I’d like to add that even French oak varies greatly, and a barrel from cooper X, medium toast, for example, may be “oakier” than barrel from cooper Y. 2 years’ air drying, 3, 4, different grain tightness (forest/climate), there is a great deal of variability no matter how one slices it. One can sometimes figure out which cooper was used just by a nose in wine, many have a “signature” of their own. Even adding a perception of “sweetness” to dry wine with some.
So, when one says “French oak” used, it may mean not much in the grand scheme of things, if that oak is on the aggressive side to begin with.
I recently laughed at a tasting note on Cellartracker that a Château Bel Air-Marquis d’Aligre (which is raised in concrete tanks), “had too much new oak poking out.”
Worst: Grenache
Oh, man! You should of known better…
+1 Other grapes may strive to reach the depths of an oaky Grenache, but none can surpass it.
+2. I was surprised I had to scroll down as far as I did before someone mentioned it. Nothing trashes a red grape like new oak trashes Grenache.
I’ve been unable to keep from cringing at CdP estates I otherwise love when tasting their special cuvee from barrique. I actually begged a co-op in Spain to please stop using new oak “for the American market.”
Site matters a lot. Some sites can take 100% new oak and not show it, while with others even a small percentage will glare out, awkwardly.
Cooperage matters a huge amount. Some oak that’s always a mismatch for PN can suit another variety well, Most PN producers I know think a little new oak makes the wine better. My favorites use very subtle oak that contributes a supportive spiciness which doesn’t dominate in any way.
I guess that would more-or-less encompass 2007 Chateauneuf du Pape in magnum