Some Keller Rieslings victims of speculation

WINE TALK
41

Thanks for the post, Juergen.
It’s years that this hype machine is working and to a level which for me is very difficult to understand (why and how).
I have tasted the wines a few times, blind and not. Neither I nor those I tasted with were of the opinion that they were “in a class of their own”. In the few blind tastings where I had them they did not stand out.
Very limited statistics, I’ll be the first to say, and I do not want to convince anybody that this is how it should be. If your experience has been different, great!
The fact that their price keeps increasing makes them now completely uninteresting to me.

Unfortunately this kind of phenomena happens all the time in the wine world and I fully agree with Juergen that every time it happens it is a bad day for wine lovers.

42

I looked back over old email offers and the price (at least in NYC) for hubacker and kirschpiel are literally unchanged since the 2010 vintage. Sort of blows up this story…yes prices for the higher gg are probably up if you can find them. But imagine if coche meursault was the same release price as 7 years old?

43

Does that make Donnhoff the Prada of Riesling?

44

It’s really the Gmax that’s jumped significantly in price. Similar to how Coche CC has jumped LEAPS and bounds in price.

45

If the marketplace thinks the whites are such a step above…wait until they finally come around to taste and try to find the pinots/spats.

46

Not exactly true. Pettenthal, Hipping and Morstein as well- basically all the kiste only GGs.

47

i’m not sure where you were getting your keller, but sounds like crush? wallys offered 15 kirchspiel at $50 a bottle. i have paid as little as $90 for mags of kirchspiel, only within the past couple of years. how has the price not moved? convive had 15 and 16 kirchspiel at $62 which was as high as i have paid for it.

48

I don’t know that I could identify a Keller specifically…but I bet if you throw 10 GG’s that are from 2007 Keller is going to be at the top of my preference in the group. That’s not to say that there aren’t other wines I like…but even those are getting hard to find.

49

It depends on the importer, distributor, and retailer and how much each of them are marking up the wines. Sounds like Keller isn’t getting marked up at Wally’s like they are at other places…that’s awesome. I know I get great pricing from where I buy them and they’re more expensive that that by a long shot…but I think buying from the same place is going to be really important until they’re outside of my comfort zone in pricing…

50

Lots of talk about dry wines here, but to my mind Keller are producing Kabinett in a style rarely found these days, alongside Julian Haart and one or two others. I adore the style and see no reason why the wines should obey the traditional pricing hierarchy.

The BA/TBAs aren’t bad either!

51

I had to chuckle at this one as well. Alan, I don’t think you’d have a tough time choosing between Keller and SQN with a little more taste testing.

52

Oh, I’d take the Keller every time [wow.gif]

53

A couple of data in order to dedramatize the topic
Coche-Dury Aligote (cheapest white?) is much more expensive than e.g. Von der Fels
Von der Fels often is much better than many GG @ double pricing
Also Kellers red are better to Coche-Dury reds neener
Try the fantastic 2016 Frauenberg [cheers.gif] (cheaper than the cheapest Coche-Dury Pinot and far superior)

54

I really have a problem with the thread because of the negative slant - Klaus-Peter is as genuine a person and as big a wine geek as any of us on this Board. Look at his instagram thread he loves wines from the Jura, Beaujolais etc. and is constantly exploring. He makes great wines at extremely fair prices including Silvaner, Grauburgunder and of course his other worldly Scheurebe (that sells for $20 this wine is much, much better that Coche Aligote which sells for $200+ in the U.S. admittedly because of the 3 tier system and not because of the domain). He has also mentored many young winemakers (e.g. Julian Haart). I see him on other wine boards talking up and complimenting his fellow German winemakers.

Why cast the winery and his name in a such a negative light because someone paid a crazy price for one bottle and his one high end wine G-Max occasionally sells for high prices.

55

Ultimately this thread shows the usual trend of:

  • Beloved producer is spoken of in less than fawning manner
  • Fans of producer react as if someone said something about their mother
  • Chaos & bad feelings ensue
56

Isn’t that the whole purpose of wine message boards?

57

Don’t forget release announcements.

58

Totally. Those Pettenthal Kabinetts’ haunt my memories. The icy, cool profile freaks out my taste buds- in the best of ways. The Schubertslay is about to raise the kabinett awareness significantly.

As mentioned above, for those sore about the GG market dynamics, the Von der Fels is currently a young vine baby GG of outstanding value so… all good. Crack some trocken.

59

That’s not really what’s going on here. The OP isnt attacking the producer. He’s saying that the people who like the wines are basically morons who can’t be trusted to accurately judge whether they really enjoy what they are tasting, and are instead label whores who are chasing status. Jurgen’s complaint isn’t so much with Keller as it is with those of us who still buy it and claim to like it.

60

Perhaps you are right Alex. However I still feel a negative thread attached to a producer is unfair especially when it involves a hard working small family run operation.

David not exactly the same but it is similar to when you jumped in to defend the Skurniks because you know them personally.