Santa Cruz Mountain Chardonnay is the New World equivalent of Chablis

[Justin_S1]

I enjoy the Arnot Roberts chards. From what I recall, the Trout Gulch bottling is more similar to Chablis in style than say Mount Eden, but both are distinctly Californian. This is a timely thread because I was recently looking at adding more Chablis to my cellar.

[Jay_Miller]

I love both Rhys and Mount Eden chardonnays but I’ve never understood people comparing them to Chablis.

[Mel_Knox]

Some Rhys chardonnays could be compared to Chablis but not Mt Eden.Land and farming costs in the Santa Cruz Mtns don’t make for wine that is priced under $30 or so.
It makes sense to me that Oregon could make Chablis style wines. Maybe even that region just north of Vancouver Washington could work.

I have read winery promotional material that says they are aiming for a Chablis style and I wonder if they have ever drunk the real thing.

[Eric_Lundblad]

I love Chardonnay from all over, but I’ve never had one that made me think of Chablis, other than Chablis of course. Doesn’t make the others any less (or better).

Heck, sometimes Chablis doesn’t taste like Chablis…usually that’s when it’s young and primary, not always tho.

[Gabe_Berk]

SC Mountain Chard is a leaner style than say Russian River or Napa, but they are still a poster child of new world fruitier versions of Chardonnay in comparison to mineral driven, higher acid Chablis. Perhaps Oregon/Washington would be closer stylistically than SC Mountains.

I don’t know if you mean the bolded part as describing Chablis generally, or if you’re saying that SCM chardonnay doesn’t compare much to that subsection of Chablis which is more minerally and higher acid.

Anyway, my impression is that a growing portion of Chablis and White Burgundy is getting riper, more tropical, with more medium acids, and basically ready to drink young. Though I think many of us think of White Burgundy as being what it was like decades ago when it was different. when young Chablis had searing acids and lean, bony fruit.

I do think I could tell Chablis and Cote de Beaune whites from the new wave SCM chardonnays blind the majority of the time, but I don’t think it would be as easy is many of us think.

I was describing Chablis to generally be more mineral driven and higher acid than SCM Chardonnays. I only base that off of past tastings. I don’t doubt the farming & wine making style in Chablis has changed to produce riper, more tropical, medium acid wines though.

[Wes_Barton]

I enjoy the Arnot Roberts chards. From what I recall, the Trout Gulch bottling is more similar to Chablis in style than say Mount Eden, but both are distinctly Californian. This is a timely thread because I was recently looking at adding more Chablis to my cellar.

I’ll take this to respond to what a few people are saying. The lee side of the Santa Cruz Mountains is definitely warmer, so we should expect those to be richer. My comment about Neely being one of the better producers wasn’t about style (OP Dan has made it clear this thread wasn’t supposed to be about style). The vast majority of the Chard vineyards are on the coastal side. That’s where the potential to regularly make Chablis-styled Chards is, not that trying to mimic something from elsewhere is particularly wise. Taking inspiration and guidance from Burgundy is great, but being myopic and trying to force a wine to be something it can’t be, isn’t.

[John_Glas]

no I like Ridge and Mount Eden but no similarities to me.

[Marcus_Goodfellow]

SC Mountain Chard is a leaner style than say Russian River or Napa, but they are still a poster child of new world fruitier versions of Chardonnay in comparison to mineral driven, higher acid Chablis. Perhaps Oregon/Washington would be closer stylistically than SC Mountains.

I don’t know if you mean the bolded part as describing Chablis generally, or if you’re saying that SCM chardonnay doesn’t compare much to that subsection of Chablis which is more minerally and higher acid.

Anyway, my impression is that a growing portion of Chablis and White Burgundy is getting riper, more tropical, with more medium acids, and basically ready to drink young. Though I think many of us think of White Burgundy as being what it was like decades ago when it was different. when young Chablis had searing acids and lean, bony fruit.

I do think I could tell Chablis and Cote de Beaune whites from the new wave SCM chardonnays blind the majority of the time, but I don’t think it would be as easy is many of us think.

I was describing Chablis to generally be more mineral driven and higher acid than SCM Chardonnays. I only base that off of past tastings. I don’t doubt the farming & wine making style in Chablis has changed to produce riper, more tropical, medium acid wines though.

Both of you may be right. I am sure that most Chablis these days is riper than 20 years ago, although it holds the line better then many other regions. But they used to lose 3 years in 10 to weather issues that are not common at all these days.

That said, I still haven’t had anything from SCM that was in the same vein as modern Chablis. I like some of the wines, but the OP doesn’t seem to be looking for wines we like, rather wines that match a specific and extremely hard to duplicate place.

I’m a homer, and for those looking for more mineral and acid driven Chardonnay, I’d suggest Haden Fig’s “Juliette”, Morgan Long, Walter Scott, Bergstrom Sigrid, Cameron Clos Electrique, Evening Land(specifically 2016), and my wines at Goodfellow(especially the 2017s). There are a lot of good Chardonnays being produced in the Willamette Valley right now, and without disrespect to SCM, I think the wines listed above are more mineral and acid driven than many realize.

[Eric_Lundblad]

I love Chardonnay from all over, but I’ve never had one that made me think of Chablis, other than Chablis of course. Doesn’t make the others any less (or better).

Heck, sometimes Chablis doesn’t taste like Chablis…usually that’s when it’s young and primary, not always tho.

So, to push this one step further…when I taste a west coast Chardonnay that has old world aspirations, it’s almost always (ok, always, I guess), in the Cote de beaune realm…sometimes a high acid, minerally style Cote de beaune…but I’ve haven’t, thus far, had the high acid/minerally style make me think of chablis. Most often, I think Meursault…a good thing imo, cuz I like meursault. For example, last weekend, I tasted a few chards blind, including a 2016 00 VGW Chardonnay, which made me think Meursault (they have VGW and EGW (and others)…Very Good Wine & Exceptionally Good Wine?). I’ve had the Arnot Roberts Trout Gulch Chardonnay a few times…a very interesting high acid and high structured wine, beyond that it didn’t remind me of chablis tho.

[Dan_Kravitz]

to Gabe Berk, you wrote: “I don’t doubt the farming & wine making style in Chablis has changed to produce riper, more tropical, medium acid wines though.” I am sorry to say this, but I disagree to a large extent.

IMO it is global warming that has produced riper, etc. wines more than anything the growers are doing.

Dan Kravitz

[S_Rash]

If you’re talking New vs Old World Chardonnay, I think you have to throw Margaret River Chard into the argument!

[Marcus_Goodfellow]

I love Chardonnay from all over, but I’ve never had one that made me think of Chablis, other than Chablis of course. Doesn’t make the others any less (or better).

Heck, sometimes Chablis doesn’t taste like Chablis…usually that’s when it’s young and primary, not always tho.

So, to push this one step further…when I taste a west coast Chardonnay that has old world aspirations, it’s almost always (ok, always, I guess), in the Cote de beaune realm…sometimes a high acid, minerally style Cote de beaune…but I’ve haven’t, thus far, had the high acid/minerally style make me think of chablis. Most often, I think Meursault…a good thing imo, cuz I like meursault. For example, last weekend, I tasted a few chards blind, including a 2016 00 VGW Chardonnay, which made me think Meursault (they have VGW and EGW (and others)…Very Good Wine & Exceptionally Good Wine?). I’ve had the Arnot Roberts Trout Gulch Chardonnay a few times…a very interesting high acid and high structured wine, beyond that it didn’t remind me of chablis tho.

Plus 1

Meursault is the commune I most commonly associate with very good Oregon Chardonnay as well.

With a few wines I see Puligny, but very little seems to hit the specific character I associate with cool vintage(or normal vintage) Chablis.

[Ian_Brand]

Having made plenty of both, and with nods to sites like Bald Mountain, and the Chardonnay in the Corralitos/Pleasant Valley area, I can pretty definitively say that Monterey Chardonnay fruit is at least equal with the SCM on the top end, destroys it (and everything else on the west coast) for price/quality, and, with other central coast valleys with lots of onshore flow and calcareous/siliceous soils, provides the best opportunity to loosely pursue the Chablisienne/Burgundian ideal. Whether wineries and winemakers take that opportunity is on them. Dan is unfortunately way off base here.

I don’t think our 16 and 17 p’tit paysan chards are perfect iterations by any means, but they do touch on the theme (thank you for noticing, Sean) and I’ve struggled to find much of anything in the style, from California or abroad, that’s competitive at the tariff (please DM me with available examples, I’d like to learn more about where its positioned)… which is great, except it’s such an outlier that convincing restaurants and retailers that this is the California Chardonnay that they want to share with their customers has been more of an uphill battle than I anticipated.