Riesling Trocken: what am I missing?

WINE TALK
21

Certainly, before 1989. After that, it depends on your taste.

22

Baden Rieslings are not going to be easy to find, although probably the two easiest are Salwey and Dr. Heger, who do excellent work. I think John overlooked Franken, (often with the funny Mateus-shaped bottle), producing some of the greatest dry Rieslings in the world, and undoubtedly the greatest Silvaners in the world which you should not pass up if you come across them.

23

Please elaborate. I have not paid a ton of attention to ZH, admittedly…

24

Léonard Humbrecht was responsible through 1988 and made totally uncompromising wines, generally completely dry (occasionally, there was a Pinot Gris vieilles vignes that initially had some r.s., but it dropped with time). Son Olivier took over in 1989 and immediately there was r.s. in many of the wines. I find Olivier’s wines well made, but not what I’m looking for. Léonard’s were some of the very great white wines I have known.

25

Thanks for the info!

26

I recently had the karthauserhof with a 21st century version of salmon mousseline that was amazing.

27

The trockens I’ve tried have all been from the Mosel, which seemed like a natural choice at the time because most of the Riesling I buy is from the Mosel. I love all that acid when it’s balanced by RS, so I guess your comment helps to put things in perspective. I’m still going to pick up that Karthauserhof Feinherb, but while I’m there I’ll see what they have from the Pfalz.

I do like both Alsatian and Austrian rieslings, but I don’t buy very much of either. And although I know Riesling is versatile, I would imagine that the more prominent acid in a dry wine would make its pairing profile a bit different than, say, a Kabinett’s.

28

[winner.gif] The Mosel, being very far north, gives very high acid wines, which is why they go so well with some residual sugar to balance them off, giving the unique sensation. But, except for the lower Mosel, the dry wines are very difficult for most people (at least until recent vintages affected by climate change), especially for one who is not used to drinking wines like that. Look for Franken and Pfalz, above all, but Rheinhessen (main concern there is that you take very top producers only), Rheingau, and Nahe can produce great dry wines, and of course Baden and Württemberg (as though you’ll ever find any!).

29

The Germans themselves have been pushing the Trocken wines for several decades now. The late Erwin Matuschka-Greiffenclau of Vollrads was an early proponent. I thought the early versions had too much schreecy acidity to be pleasurable, probably from too high yields and early picking; but the wines from the past dozen years or so have become much better balanced. I agree the Mosel has the most ideosyncratic versions. If you like the leaner versions from Alsace, you’ll probably like the current wines. Remember, the Pfalz is just across the Rhine from Alsace.

30

Enjoy a young Trocken for the crispness and easy drinkability, but if you prefer a little more balance, body, and substance in a Trocken, the following are three great examples opened and brief observations:

2008 Wittmann Morstein Westhofen Riesling Trocken GG - The wine was out of this world delicious and loaded with rich minerality, distinct lemon and citrus flavors with crisp acidity perfectly in balance with the fruit. Give the wine a few years of cellar aging, and you will be well rewarded. Generally prefer 07 to 08 German Riesling, but this wine was an exception!

2007 Keller Dalsheim Hubacker Troken and 2007 Keller Westhofen Kirchspiel Trocken - Did not take notes on either of these wines at the time, but recall they were not tight, high acid wines. Like the Wittmann, both richer more full mouthfeel wines. A lot of 2007 wines, including both Keller, tasted better and showed more complexity the next day!

31

This is my first foray into dry Riesling…I grabbed these from an online retailer, they weren’t exactly cheap, does anyone have any perspective on these relative to other GGs out there? Are the GGs & ELs worth the tariff compared to Spätlese Trocken.

2007 Dönnhoff Norheimer Dellchen Riesling Trocken Großes Gewächs
2008 Dönnhoff Niederhäuser Hermannshöhle Riesling Trocken Großes Gewächs

32

Wow. That is some start. Both are usually awesome wines from great vineyards. I would hold them for quite some time before drinking them though, especially the 2007, which was really super-tight the last time I tried it. I would suggest a long, long decant, or at least opening the bottle 2-3 days in advance, or maybe both, if you are thinking of popping one of these wines anytime soon.

33

Can someone also clarify what pradikat levels mean with trockens? I would swear I’ve seen things like “Kabinett Trocken” and “Spatlese Trocken” on wine lists.

34

Melissa, I would presume the Pradikat is a reflection of brix or must weight (sugar potential) in the unfermented juice. And I am sure I am mangling my terminology.

35

Melissa – They have been used in the past, with (in theory) Spätlese being from riper grapes than Kabinett, etc. But producers are rapidly recognizing that Prädikat level is meaningless for dry wines (as opposed to the fruity style where different Prädikat levels signify different styles of wine). As a result, producers are increasingly leaving Prädikat levels off for their trocken wines, and indeed the VDP will be requiring all its producers to do so. For now, where you do see it, ignore it, just focus on the trocken (or halbtrocken).

36

The Donnhoff GGs I have tasted have been good, but to me, nowhere near the league of his RS wines.

As to the higher prices commanded by the GGs and ELs - I haven’t tasted any yet that I thought merited such a large price differential. Typically, once prices get that high, I reach for Austria.

37

Thanks-- and if you don’t mind then, I have one more question. Are there any quality standards by which to judge a trocken/halbtrocken/feinherb just from the label? Any way to tell which are natural, which are chaptalised, etc?

38

As a practical matter, all your trocken wines are going to be unchaptalized. (Technically, a wine that doesn’t bear a Prädikat (e.g., Kabinett or Spätlese) can be chaptalized, but that’s not going to happen with a trocken.) Your best guides to quality are producer and, if shown, vineyard. And importer is also a good guide. In theory, Grosses/Erstes Gewächs is the highest quality, but top rate producers who aren’t in the VDP or the state of Hesse can’t produce them (e.g., von Schubert) and some as a matter of principle won’t produce them (e.g., Georg Breuer). And I’ll easily take certain producers’ simplest trocken wines over certain other producers’ Grosses Gewächs wines.

One thing you’ll want to do is look at the stated alcohol (for Germany, it in theory is accurate rounded to the nearest 0.5%.) In vintages like 2003 and 2006 in certain regions, there are going to be some very high alcohol trocken wines. Generally (and of course there are always exceptions), all other things being equal, I’d stick to wines with stated alcohol of 13.5% or less.

39

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40

I love 2006 in the Nahe for trocken and GG wines. Total sleeper.