An '07 Clos St. Jean tasted two weeks ago was a horrible mess. Overwhelmingly hot – someone on CT compared this, with justice, to drinking vodka and grape juice – with a hard and bitter finish. Completely discombobulated. Six hours in a decanter helped, but not much. Hopefully time will iron this out and bring some countervailing elements to balance out the alcohol, but this was awful.
Experience with this wine seems quite varied. CT notes report several similar observations, as well as a group of satisfied customers. I wonder what explains the disparate experiences.
For your sake, I hope you’re right. My impression is based solely off a single glass that I spent a mere 30 minutes with – obviously, not the ideal setting, but I’ll take what I can get. here’s my brief note, in it’s entirety:
– 12/27/2009 –
– tasted a single glass non-blind over approx. 30 min –
Intense ruby color of medium depth. Very new world nose with loads of red fruits; not funky or earthy. Very fruity, and actually a bit candied, on the palate; cherry was dominant fruit; a bit overblown.
My thoughts about the 07 CdPs have remained the same since I first started tasting them in late 2009. In general, NOTE I said “in general”, they’re hot, jammy messes, and they’ve remained that way or gotten worse. Now, there are exceptions to the rule, especially among the lower end, non-special cuvees, but they’re rare.
Call Monkton EMS! Parker read this thread and is suffering from hyperventilation! And worse, he cannot find a paper bag to blow into because he does not taste blind!
Sure, just look at the CT notes for any large-scale Australian Shiraz and see the same disparate results. I never buy deep in CDP but I was unhappy with my few 2007 purchases. Young or not they seemed way too huge for me. In contrast I liked some of the CDR’s I had (though even those I found spotty). Maybe they come around in time, hope springs eternal (I should know, I still have some 2003 Burgs for which I harbor a secret belief that they will one day be amazing).
I fully understand that they are young. I haven’t had too many aged CdP, but I remember how amazing 1981 Clos de Papes was a couple years ago. Or some of the other producers from 1985 and 1989. But I also believe one should be able to find some redeeming qualities in ‘most’ good wines at any stage of their lives. The question here: Does spoof dissipate? I don’t think so. I have had a singing 2000 Mon Aieul. My belief is that the 2007 will not transform into a similar wine, nor was it ever a similar wine(I did not get to taste it on release though). Hell, I’m not sure it will even be drinkable-to me.
It’s been my general practice to age my CdP at least ten years before digging in. But, I have tasted some of the great vintages while the wines were still young. I don’t recall any of the wines from those vintages – 1989, 1990 – tasting like the 2007’s I have tasted so far.
I’ve only popped a few, but what I have tasted so far has me quite worried also.
I’m finding obvious heat and over-ripe black fruit.
Vodka with a little raisin jam.
This is the vintage the convinces me that Parker’s taste buds are shot from years of abuse and why the old lion is found to be doing so much roaring – I think he’s wounded and he knows it.
Charlie - My “it’s 4” comment was that may wines go through awkward stages and that I’m not sure it’s valid to say your negative impressions now are more correct than your initial positive impressions. I suppose the issue is when you like to drink CdP and how these will age. If you prefer your CdP from age 5-10 then perhaps these will be poor wines for your tastes at that age. If you prefer older CdP, then the issue is how these will age… will the continue downhill (to your palate) or will they emerge and be splendid wines in 10 more years? And, of course, do you want to wait that long? If you have more of the 07 than you want to cellar for 10 years, sell some, keep some. At worst, you keep wines that never satisfy (and you’ll still be able to sell them). At best, you still have some wines that turn out to be wonderful and don’t spend the intervening years worrying as much.
07s I hope will evolve akin to the 90s. Lots of bright fruit but those that didn’t fall off balance will age wonderfully. I’m very optimistic about CSJ VV, Pegau, Clos des Papes, Charvin, Mon Aieul and some lovely lesser growths. I’m a little worried about the exuberant examples like Janassee VV, St Cosme Gigondas SVs and some others. The great 07s I’ve tried (Pegau, Clos des Papes, Mon Aieul, Janassee VV) blow away their 03 counterparts which I find too pruney/stewed and off-kilt. I’m a believer but stress that it should be mixed in one’s cellar with 04-06, the more classical representations.
I had the Pegau last month, albeit not from mag, in Vegas and thought it was great. Drunk alongside a Janasee Chaupin that, upon opening, I didn’t much care for but then developed into a very nice wine. My preference was definitely the Pegau, but I was pleasantly surprised by the Janasse too.
When it comes to CdP I’m definitely in the “still learning” camp–quite inexperienced. At a tasting in April 2010 we tried nine examples from this vintage. The ones I liked most were Vieux Telegraphe (I bought six bottles), Beaucastel and Domaine Roger Sabon Cuvee Prestige. I have since purchased a few bottles of the Roger Sabon and Domaine La Milliere CdP VV. Admittedly, I like pronounced fruit in wines (but not raisiny except in Port or Amarone or similar where it is part of the profile.) For the most part I have avoided 2003 wines for fear of overripeness. I have not tried either the Vieux Telegraphe or Roger Sabon since that initial tasting so I’m not sure how they are presenting now or how they will age. Kevin Zraly of Windows on the World fame and wine author and blogger, and Andrew McNamara, Master Sommelier, led the tasting. One of them, I don’t recall which one, said the Beaucastel will age effortlessly for 30 or 40 years. On the Domaine de la Janasse Andrew said good and balanced but not his favorite. Limited length. Needs five years (from 2010). Le Vieux Donjon was a question mark from both panel leaders–not sure if the tannins were balanced. On the Vieux Telegraphe La Crau: Kevin said balanced components and will age another five years. None of these 2007 wines were inky but rather softer and more accessible than some vintages. Mild on the fruit but full. Andrew said more earth and animal coming out on this one but very drinkable. Would prefer to have it with food. Enjoyable now. Wants to see how it drinks in four years. Andrew compared the smoky meatiness to Slim Jims. The consensus seemed to be that this was a more fruit-forward vintage than classical vintages and some of the wines may not be long lived. The Beaucastel may be an exception to that.
A few nights ago, feeling mischievous, I popped a 2007 Vieux Donjon for my neighbors after we’d tasted some more expensive and highly recommended Burgs. (Sorry I don’t remember the producers.) There was no question in anyone’s mind that the Donjon really smoked the Burgs.
Just sayin’.
Me too. After tastings and exploratory bottles, I stuck with my favorites for '07; VT, Donjon, and Vatican’s Cuv Sixtine plus Simian’s regular CdP. I’ve been mostly disappointed with the CdR’s I have opened. Beaucastel’s Coudoulet, d’Andezon’s la Granacha Signargues, and La Garrigue’s Cuv Romaine are just OK but I’ve enjoyed Jaume’s Vinsobres Reference. Much prefer the '04s, '05s, and '06s.
This thread makes me wonder if I have been falsly seduced by 2009 Beaujolais. Many (not all) wines I own are too big for me right now but Ive cellared them with the prediction that the healthy acids will allow them to age gracefully and drop the baby fat. I hope I havn’t subconciously fallen prey to hype.
This is interesting as I find the 07 Reserve Sixtine to epitomize the points made by Michel Abood that you’ve agreed with. I found it hot and jammy (and suffering from its time in barrels as opposed to just tanks). Many of the 07’s are to my liking, but the Sixtine pushes the envelope for my taste (just as it did in 03).