Pinot Vs Pot

[CJ_Beazley]

@Alan Rath

Assuming there is such a thing as terroir, how likely is it that Vitis vinifera and Cannabis thrive best on the same terroir? I guess Cannabis grown in places like Maui, Jamaica, Colombia, Nigeria, etc., is just crap

When I was a kid it grew wild down by the river (Brazos) I always assumed that’s why it’s called weed, it’ll grow anywhere. These new hybrid strains/plants might need to be baby-ed I wouldn’t know about that.

[JIMCOH]

@R M Kriete

@D.Callahan

It doesn’t take much reading about pot to find that pot aficionados are very concerned about terroir in growing pot. It seems to rank at least as high in importance to them as it does to us winos. The difference is that terroir seems to affect the actual kind of high they get and not just the flavor, probably due to the fact that it is inhaled rather than drunk.

And yet, not many single vineyard Pinot aficionados are living in their parent’s basement

Yea, but you live in Florida, so… It’s like the Glass Houses and Stones saying.

[Andrew_Hamilton]

@Rick Allen

This has been a big issue in Yamhill County for at least a year. From everything I’ve read in the local paper, this is not about growing marijuana, it’s about processing the marijuana in a remote setting, with an inadequate road, no water, and no sewer. Much of the marijuana sold in the State is consumed as edibles, not the stuff you smoke. No one really understands what the impact of the THC extraction process is.

I’m no expert by far but from what I understand the process of extracting THC from pot for use in edibles is well understood from a chemical process and by products perspective. I expect Butane Hash Oil (BHO) is the most heavily leveraged process for getting flowers to edibles and from my understanding the Butane just evaporates leaving the BHO behind. How would that processing impact vineyards around the area? It’s not like the Butane would evaporate and then somehow magically condense next door, right?

And the whole argument about foul smelling particles it kinda reminds me of the argument about eucalypt and how those notes find their way into wines. Suspicion is one thing, being able to prove it is another. Some people imply that winemakers here in Australia aren’t above throwing a handful of eucalyptus leaves into the crush to get those notes in their wines. Regardless what I can say is that from my reading the science behind these suspicions has a long way to go before it’s considered conclusive.

[Rick_Allen]

@Andrew Hamilton

@Rick Allen

This has been a big issue in Yamhill County for at least a year. From everything I’ve read in the local paper, this is not about growing marijuana, it’s about processing the marijuana in a remote setting, with an inadequate road, no water, and no sewer. Much of the marijuana sold in the State is consumed as edibles, not the stuff you smoke. No one really understands what the impact of the THC extraction process is.

I’m no expert by far but from what I understand the process of extracting THC from pot for use in edibles is well understood from a chemical process and by products perspective. I expect Butane Hash Oil (BHO) is the most heavily leveraged process for getting flowers to edibles and from my understanding the Butane just evaporates leaving the BHO behind. How would that processing impact vineyards around the area? It’s not like the Butane would evaporate and then somehow magically condense next door, right?

And the whole argument about foul smelling particles it kinda reminds me of the argument about eucalypt and how those notes find their way into wines. Suspicion is one thing, being able to prove it is another. Some people imply that winemakers here in Australia aren’t above throwing a handful of eucalyptus leaves into the crush to get those notes in their wines. Regardless what I can say is that from my reading the science behind these suspicions has a long way to go before it’s considered conclusive.

Well, you certainly know a lot more about it than I do! I do know that it seems like a hash oil explosion shows up on the local news here about once a month. This is primarily a zoning issue. The Wagners wanted a variance to process pot on their agriculturally zoned property, and they didn’t get the variance for a number of reasons (unhappy neighbors, bad road, no utilities, etc).

[Andrew_Hamilton]

@Rick Allen

Well, you certainly know a lot more about it than I do! I do know that it seems like a hash oil explosion shows up on the local news here about once a month. This is primarily a zoning issue. The Wagners wanted a variance to process pot on their agriculturally zoned property, and they didn’t get the variance for a number of reasons (unhappy neighbors, bad road, no utilities, etc).

I’ve seen the process done about 15 years ago when a friend used it. Knowing what I know now I probably wouldn’t stand around while he had liquid Butane off-gassing in his kitchen in some weird PVC contraption he made. And you say it’s a zoning issue and to a certain extent I’d agree. That said wouldn’t you rather have an explosive prone process occurring remotely as possible? I for one would much prefer that sort of process occurring on a semi-rural agriculturally zoned property when compared to a fairly urban industrial zoned area. That said each has obvious risks.

[Rick_Allen]

If you’re going to have a fire, it’s better to have it at a place with a nearby fire department and water. This site is over 10 miles from the nearest fire station, has limited water, and a dirt road that wouldn’t handle a fire truck.

This location is in the middle of nowhere, on top of a hill that is at least a quarter mile from the county road. If the dirt road is wet, there is no way you’re getting a fire truck up there.

[Todd_Hamina]

It is a road improvement issue, fix the road. Have at it again.

[lleichtman]

I think that Maysara and Kelly Fox are also included in this suit. There has been one ruling by a judge in favor of the wineries but there is an appeal. I am very familiar with this case and the specifics for reasons I can’t explain but the law firm for the defendants is the largest Marijuana legal firm in Oregon and they also view this as a landmark case. This may not be isolated to Oregon. I think similar cases will pop up in California. Everyone wants the same land. By the way, from the scholarly articles I have read give little to no credence to the wine growers position.

[Scott_Everson]

We don’t live in a communist country, the government shouldn’t be able to mandate who can grow what where.

[Alan_Rath]

Government sets zoning rules on all kinds of things all the time.

It also seems to me that pot farms have all kinds of security issues that other crops don’t have. Some kid can walk by and grab a hand full of grapes, and no one will care. What happens when a bunch of kids decide to raid a pot farm?

[dsGriswold]

There was a case a few years back where some rustlers harvested a Red Mountain vineyard before the owner went out to pick. It was at the end of the road.

[R_M_Kriete]

@JIMCOH

@R M Kriete

@D.Callahan

It doesn’t take much reading about pot to find that pot aficionados are very concerned about terroir in growing pot. It seems to rank at least as high in importance to them as it does to us winos. The difference is that terroir seems to affect the actual kind of high they get and not just the flavor, probably due to the fact that it is inhaled rather than drunk.

And yet, not many single vineyard Pinot aficionados are living in their parent’s basement

Yea, but you live in Florida, so… It’s like the Glasses Houses and Stones saying.

??? We don’t have basements in Florida

[JIMCOH]

@R M Kriete

@JIMCOH

@R M Kriete

And yet, not many single vineyard Pinot aficionados are living in their parent’s basement

Yea, but you live in Florida, so… It’s like the Glass Houses and Stones saying.

??? We don’t have basements in Florida

There is always the Carriage House.

[John_Cabot]

@Alan Rath

Assuming there is such a thing as terroir, how likely is it that Vitis vinifera and Cannabis thrive best on the same terroir? I guess Cannabis grown in places like Maui, Jamaica, Colombia, Nigeria, etc., is just crap

Humboldt county has a very long history of growing some of the finest cannabis anywhere(as does Mendocino and Trinity… the emerald triangle). What has been discovered over the years is that the highest quality(a huge numbers of factors) is achieved in the very same regions wine grapes are grown. It loves some fog. It loves warm days and cool nights. It prefers the pacific north west because of the warm summers, the temperatures in the fall, proximity to the ocean(fog) and it doesn’t get too hot. You can grow wine grapes anywhere too, but we all know the best wines are made from very specific areas.

The idea that there would be any problem growing these two crops side by side is just Ludacris. The only issue I can see is if visitors to the winery are offended by the sweet smell during the ripening months.

[Blake_Brown]

@John Cabot

@Alan Rath

Assuming there is such a thing as terroir, how likely is it that Vitis vinifera and Cannabis thrive best on the same terroir? I guess Cannabis grown in places like Maui, Jamaica, Colombia, Nigeria, etc., is just crap

Humboldt county has a very long history of growing some of the finest cannabis anywhere(as does Mendocino and Trinity… the emerald triangle). What has been discovered over the years is that the highest quality(a huge numbers of factors) is achieved in the very same regions wine grapes are grown. It loves some fog. It loves warm days and cool nights. It prefers the pacific north west because of the warm summers, the temperatures in the fall, proximity to the ocean(fog) and it doesn’t get too hot. You can grow wine grapes anywhere too, but we all know the best wines are made from very specific areas.

The idea that there would be any problem growing these two crops side by side is just Ludacris. The only issue I can see is if visitors to the winery are offended by the sweet smell during the ripening months.

It`s refreshing to hear from a grape grower that the crops can be symbiotic. I do question the use of chemicals for pot and the intention for some of those neighbours to be free of chemicals in striving to be organic, sustainable and/or biodynamic.

[John_Cabot]

There is no more need to use chemicals growing cannabis than wine grapes. They actually have the exact same issues(powdery mildew and botrytis). Most of the growers I know wouldn’t consider using chemicals on their cannabis. In fact, in Or., cannabis that is to be either sold as flowers or processed into edibles or concentrates HAS to be tested for any chemical residue. If residue is found not only can you not sell it, the state “disposes of it” for you and you wont get it back… True story.

[Rboinski]

There are just as many biodynamic/veganic/organic/TLO soil growing cannabis producers with organic IPM as there are industrial grape growers. Actually I take that back, there is far more industrial grape growing than industrial cannabis. The issue is not the old time growers but rather the black market cartel stuff.

That being said, the issue with rogue/guerrilla grows contaminating waterways or growing on private vineyard land and stealing water from resivoirs needs to be addressed. Properly grown cannabis and vineyards can and will co-exist, and I believe it will be beneficial to both groups. Going after people who are trying to do it the right way as is happening in this article will not be beneficial in the long run.

[John_Cabot]

@Rboinski

There are just as many biodynamic/veganic/organic/TLO soil growing cannabis producers with organic IPM as there are industrial grape growers. Actually I take that back, there is far more industrial grape growing than industrial cannabis. The issue is not the old time growers but rather the black market cartel stuff.

That being said, the issue with rogue/guerrilla grows contaminating waterways or growing on private vineyard land and stealing water from resivoirs needs to be addressed. Properly grown cannabis and vineyards can and will co-exist, and I believe it will be beneficial to both groups. Going after people who are trying to do it the right way as is happening in this article will not be beneficial in the long run.

Exactly. The fees and taxes that are being generated should allow for very strict enforcement of these illegal grows, which are of concern to everyone.

[Blake_Brown]

@Rboinski

There are just as many biodynamic/veganic/organic/TLO soil growing cannabis producers with organic IPM as there are industrial grape growers. Actually I take that back, there is far more industrial grape growing than industrial cannabis. The issue is not the old time growers but rather the black market cartel stuff.

That being said, the issue with rogue/guerrilla grows contaminating waterways or growing on private vineyard land and stealing water from resivoirs needs to be addressed. Properly grown cannabis and vineyards can and will co-exist, and I believe it will be beneficial to both groups. Going after people who are trying to do it the right way as is happening in this article will not be beneficial in the long run.

Good news re the pot growers lack of use of chemicals and certainly different from what I had been told. Also, I was under the impression from friends in Mendocino that they pretty much keep the “rogue/guerilla grows” out except for small isolated plots.

[Alan_Rath]

@John Cabot

@Alan Rath

Assuming there is such a thing as terroir, how likely is it that Vitis vinifera and Cannabis thrive best on the same terroir? I guess Cannabis grown in places like Maui, Jamaica, Colombia, Nigeria, etc., is just crap

Humboldt county has a very long history of growing some of the finest cannabis anywhere(as does Mendocino and Trinity… the emerald triangle). What has been discovered over the years is that the highest quality(a huge numbers of factors) is achieved in the very same regions wine grapes are grown. It loves some fog. It loves warm days and cool nights. It prefers the pacific north west because of the warm summers, the temperatures in the fall, proximity to the ocean(fog) and it doesn’t get too hot. You can grow wine grapes anywhere too, but we all know the best wines are made from very specific areas.

I get that the climate could be good for both, but surely pot wants different/better soil conditions than fine wine grapes?