Notes for Discussion: Krug/Salon, Montrachets (13 Ramonet, 17/18 Drouhin MdL), 82 Bordeaux (La Mission/Mouton), Rousseau Chambertin/Beze/CSJ (96, 2000, 2001, 2012) & La Tache (12, 14)

I wanted to share some detailed notes on a host of wonderful wines I had last week with old friends & a few new friends. Partly for posterity (as many of these vintages I was having for the first time), but also with the hope that we might have some rich discussion about some of them. Especially the 1996, 2000/2001 & 2012/2013 Vintages in Burgundy.

It’s a funny (yet obvious) thing to say, but I don’t really have anyone else to talk about these wine apart from the community :saluting_face:. And I’d like to post something thoughtful here rather than email/text my friends individually.

For karmic reasons I wanted to start my own thread. (Chuckles) Plus, in a stunning upset, Andrew has already out-poetry’d me with his wonderful, poignant post from the weekend :wink:. Hence, maybe we can be a little wine-focused here.

As a caveat: I usually aim to be as honest & truthful about a wine as possible when writing about them. One of the best advantages of drinking high-reputation wines with serious wine friends is to avoid an Emperor’s Clothes phenomenon. Sometimes there’s unanimity, but often times there’s a strong difference of opinion or palates. Particularly on whether a wine is simply ‘very good’ or truly elevating into the spectacular. That verisimilitude is very important to me. Authenticity is a core tenet of my wine joy.

Champagnes

I think very highly of Krug 168 right now in its current phase. This is the third bottle I’ve had this summer. I wouldn’t normally feel the need to emphasize its quality, but given some of the West Coast skepticism (eyebrows raised at you, Rich Brown :kissing_smiling_eyes:) for the top-end potential of a Krug experience, I want to give it its full due. For my palate, Krug GC from an excellent base vintage with 12-15 years of age is a really good sweet spot.

This has a phenomenal balance between warm, rounded fruit & a beautiful structure. I love its ‘mid-palate perfume’, i.e. the combination of verve and energy alongside the subtle aromatics that come up as it plays around the roof of your mouth. I did give this an hour of bottle prep (i.e. pop and hold before pouring). But, honestly, the bottle I had with Michael Chang up in Pittsburgh didn’t get this attention and was still phenomenal at a PnP with a little too much warmth.

2012 Salon is a very intellectual contrast. Same base vintage as the 168, mind you. This showed better than I expected, actually, given it was simple PnP. Lots of austerity in structure, but thankfully lots of minerals as well. I real rapier of a Champagne. Exceptionally long & lots of chalk/stone. Don Cornutt is going to be in my head now with his knowing quip that Salon so often tastes like “Chevalier-Montrachet with bubbles”.

As a singular experience, Salons are always a treat to explore. Keen readers of my notes from the last 4 years will notice that I often see them as complicated, intellectual wines more than pure, explosive joy.

Montrachets

I am not super well-versed in Ramonet Montrachet. Only a handful of examples in my life. Recently, I’ve had much more detailed experiences with the Bienvennues & Batard. I could not believe how effing good & unique this 2013 Ramonet Montrachet was :heart:

The generous human who brought this was increasingly bemused at our conversation. I kept looking up every few minutes in a joyful astonishment with another question about this particular vintage vs. other editions. It is charmingly reassuring that Andrew Monty Klug was similarly blown away.

Just stunning. The contrast of such exotic fruit notes with a linear, tight (but not austere) finish is such a magic trick. I’m curious, for those that have either had a lot of various 2013 Montrachet, or a lot of editions of Ramonet Montrachet, if there are any larger comparisons/thoughts? I was fortunate to try a little taste of the 2015 Ramonet Montrachet in NY in March, but while that was delightful, I would say it was more classic in flavors than exotic.

The 2017 & 2018 Drouhin Marquis de Laguiche were far more ‘classic’ companions. By sheer good fortune, I had a glorious bottle of the 2020 of this Montrachet back in July. Before this summer, though, I had a zero experience with this wine.

I love how well they currently show in this early-drinking window. The 2017 has the most structure. Very tasty, but still some mid-palate Oak & stern grip. There were some around the table that preferred that counter-balancing, though, particularly the longer we sat with these wines. I’m with Andrew in preferring the 2018, just for opulence, class, and easy, breezy enjoyment.

The 2018 was very reminiscent of the 2020 I had in Seattle. Very rounded & open in flavors. Exquisite mouthfeel. Classic floral composition intertwine with maybe some sweet citrus peel, but also maybe some hints of sweet peach. Aromatics really leaping from the glass.

1982 Bordeaux

I was overjoyed that the La Mission Haut-Brion was perfectly in the zone with a two-hour decant. This is not a wine of which I have multiple bottles. This is a classic, elegantly mineral Claret. Not terribly hedonistic, but not austere. Nor clunky in its transitions. And much less tobacco or smoke than one might get from other 82 brethren.

Beautiful graphite. Nice hints of florals and cool, dark fruits. A wonderful pairing with high-end beef. This had a very classic, refreshing mouthfeel & finish. Long without being overbearing. Really elegant wine. As I told the table, sometimes I’m really in the mood for this style of elegant red intermezzo between the Burgundy. Going the sweet wine route is fun in its own way, but I really dug this combination. Even some of the Rousseau connoisseurs at the end of the night were reiterating that both Bordeaux really stuck with you at the end of the night when recounting the lineup.

The 1982 Mouton was a bit softer than other bottles. Some pure fruit, but not the enormous stamina that it’s capable of. For a flight, the lack of power is not big deal. My favorite bottles of this wine have been those followed for 2-4 hours and having the last glass in hour 4 (plus whatever decanting time beforehand) be incredibly beautiful with a train engine of fruit and structure.

The Rousseau Chambertin (96, 00, 09) & Clos de Beze (96, 01) + 2012 CSJ

The most conversational flight. I don’t want to say controversial, as I don’t think we were at tremendous odds at this table. But, I did not rate this group as Five Superstars, which was somewhat revelatory. And instructive.

I’ve been utterly spoiled these last 18 months with a wonderful array of Rousseau experiences. The vast majority of them were not Chambertin, though (or Beze). And, I found the aromatics with these birthday wines more subdued or in hiding compared with what I was expecting. The clear wine of the flight, and contender for wine of the evening, was the 2000 Chambertin. Here the aromatics were rich, voluptuous & explosive. Andrew’s succinct note is en pointe

This would be what I would describe as the archetypal, hopeful Chambertin package of youthful, early prime. I had the 1989 Chambertin in NY this March, and that wine was a wonderful archetype of ‘mature’ phase Chambertin. Exceptionally calm, rounded palate with an immacualte smoothness of mid-palate and finish. Not a hint of brooding.

These 1996s were an eclectic in-between. Neither aromatically bursting, nor in a next phase of calm stateliness. Some slight differences between the Beze and Chambertin, but not huge ones. These are strong wines, with good, rich firm mouthfeel, but not leaping out with front-to-back premium Grand Cru character. Restrained aromatically.

The 1996 vintage is pretty fascinating to me. The easy answer is say ‘wait & see’ for a decade. But, I think there’s some mystery, too, in just how the vintage is keeping some of these revered wines in stasis as they begin their fourth decade of captivity. This is very thought-provoking for me.

The 2001 Clos de Beze was very similar to the one I had with Michael Chang last October. A very classy wine. Not explosive compared to a voluptuous tablemate. A wine with excellent minerality and good texture, but a wine that does feel like it’s still a touch restrained. Albeit, with elegant restraint.

The 2009 Chambertin I would put in a similar category to an 09 Hudellot-Noellat RSV from last December. Outstanding fruit, but the vintage seems to be fighting/hiding the complexity. More mono-dimensional (in my view) until enough years pass to release more qualities. I think the 2009 vintage will continue to be much discussed/experimented with for a long time. Certain wines/winemakers will provoke much conversation. And, hopefully, it’s simply a question of years to strike the balance.

Why am I writing all of this?

Because this is super thought-provoking to me. We want to know our own palates. We want to actually try these legendary wines. And then linking the two of these with Authenticity makes me feel like I’m treating these wines/winemakers with full admiration & respect. Rather than just posting a pic on Instagram and saying “All Bangers.”

To my great surprise: The 2012 Clos St. Jacques was my No. 2 Rousseau of the evening. This was poured alongside the 2009 Chambertin after our first 45 minutes with the Core-4.

Immediately, I connect with this wine. It is so ready to go. So lovely with joyous aromatics. Much lighter in thickness or texture, but so classically in balance. I am blown away by how much I adore this wine. Indeed, if I have a conclusion from this year so far:

The three Rousseau Clos St. Jacques (98, 12, 13) I have had these last six months have been some of the most “Why I love Burgundy” Burgundies of the year for me. Their aromatics, balance, and sexiness have been a delight. From the first smell, to the last taste, I’ve been entranced every time I’ve been fortunate enough to sit with them.

I’ve also loved two Rousseau Ruchottes-Chambertin (98, 14) & a pair of glorious 2013s (Clos de la Roche & Cazetiers). With a similar first smell to last sip adoration.

By contrast:

This lineup of Chambertins & Beze were more intellectual (saving the glorious 2000). Texture-Dominated but not so joyously sexy or full of irrepressible verve. To my palate. Although I had good company. The man who brought the 13 Ramonet (& 2012 La Tache) also had the 2012 CSJ as his number two Rousseau. And I think Andrew joined us, too.

There were one or two voices against the CSJ. A real question of texture & fuller body vs. a lighter, aromatic approach. Although one person went further and basically said late in the evening that he thought the CSJ’s aromatics were distracting (which is insane to me, but we’re all among friends & it is supposed to be a safe space ;).

This is just ‘one tasting’ but obviously a very singular one. I’m very grateful to have these wines. And I’m even more grateful to have had enough really good Burgundies these past few years to feel confident in my palate and my placing of these wines in their quality and their differences compared to some of my very favorites.

DRC La Tache Addendum

The 2014 was more eclectic; the 2012 so easy to love. A sensational wine for the ways that Andrew lays out below. Particularly the roses aromatics & mid-palate verve. Even with a two-decant this still had a touch of spritzy petillance in the glass on first pour, although that immediately smoothed out with a few minutes.

The 2001 La Tache is one of the very best wines of my life. If/when the 2012 adds even more layers & complications, I’d imagine it could be on that level.

Conclusions

Andrew’s Birthday tasting was an awesome blend of high-brow wine exploration and unpressured laughter. As I wrote in my notes about our Atlanta Batard lunch earlier in July: Drinking in familiar groups with good trust is a fantastic conduit for honest assessment of the wines and conducive for a relaxed, special evening.

I welcome anyone’s thoughts on some of these wines or any of the topics my notes keyed up. I really value when we have good, practical discussions on high-end wines. I feel my own palate & experiences have really taken a step up these last 5ish years or so, and I connect that to a lot of the enhanced conversations I’ve had along the way. Over a shared table, out in Burgundy, but also here on the board.

I don’t spend as long as Otto on these write-ups, but nor are they composed without some consideration :).

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Always love reading your writeups. Incredible!!

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As always, here for the Champagne notes! :cheers:

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Brilliant observations. Fantastic notes. It was great to be with you, Nick.

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Love it! So glad you could make it and it couldn’t have turned out better with the lineup and showing - outside of the '14 Tâche that I expected would have been a little more ready like the '14 RC was a few weeks prior.

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Great reflections, Nick. It’s the personal experiences that make this hobby worthwhile, and I love how you capture that. On the wines:

I have not had the 2013 Ramonet Montrachet, but the reaction you describe is ‘typical’ for good vintages and captures how I feel about them (e.g. the 2008 and 2010). I think Ramonet is very special in this regard. It is (sadly) uneven. Bouchard and Drouhin provide more consistency but less passion.

I’m not at all surprised you most preferred the 2000 Chambertin - it’s a beautifully fragrant and harmonious vintage at the upper end. If you primarily like the nose in Red Burgundy then these sorts of vintages are fantastic. They also used to be cheaper than the “great” vintages lol but I expect that ship sailed a long time ago. Have you tried the Bachelet Charmes? It’s a wine with a consistently super-captivating nose. I’ve been a bit doubtful of 1996s coming out and turning great, but some positive experiences this year give me more hope. 2009s at that level are pups; I see lots of upside (though some 1ers are already in top form?). I’ve looked at a couple of 2012s recently and see similarities with your CSJ note - real sweetness on the nose, gentle but present on the palate.

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The best 2012s this summer have been real revelations. The two here & also a Hudelot-Noellat RSV up in Pittsburgh. Charged my evaluation on what’s possible/approachable in the vintage. I’ve started to poke around on some 12s now.

The 1996 that I felt was most at full delivery these past few years was a Lignier Clos de la Roche. I think another bottle is on the Fall Horizon, so will be hopeful for a repeat. Otherwise, a bit tetchy.

The Bachelet 01 & 02 Corbeaux have impressed the hell out of me. But still waiting to try a Charmes.

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Wonderful notes and narrative!

I’m 100% with you on the 2012 Rousseau CSJ. I had it a few months ago and it has really lingered.

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I’ve had up and down experiences with 2000.

2000 La Tache and Rousseau CSJ were magnificent, but I’ve opened several bottles of 2000 Trapet Chambertin that were good but not nearly as good as the 21.

William Kelley has felt 12 will be great and I’m starting to agree.

I’m not sure when and if 96 will ever be ready, although 96 CSJ last year was good, if overshadowed by an even better bottle of 98 that I’d opened in nyc.

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I am a big fan of 2012 Burgundy, especially reds. I haven’t had many on the exalted level in your notes, but I’ve found excellent intensity and balance and think they will be very long lived.

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I haven’t drunk very many 2012s, but a bottle of CdB’s Savigny Les Lavières consumed four years ago was really great - “Lacey texture, lovely fruit.” - a bottle opened seven months later was pretty shut down, however. A bottle of 2012 Grivot Boudots opened two years ago (and subjected to a two hour decant, fwiw) suggested to me the vintage was shutting down. No? Or are some of the wines re-opening?

I have always loved the 1996 red Burgundies. When they first came out, I was trying, buying, and drinking them nonstop. The youthful, beautiful fruit married so well with the relatively high acid nature of many of the wines that almost every one was delicious. Eventually, like - dare I say all? - most vintages of red burgundy, the wines started shutting down. Then people started complaining about the 1996 reds as too high in acid (you’d think these people had RMP’s burgundy palate!), but I have never been convinced of that. People loved the 1988 red burgs and then started dismissing them as too acidic and/or too tannic. But I just hung on to most of my bottles (and backfilled a tiny bit but years ago) and was rewarded with magnificent bottles of mature red burg. I am similarly convinced that most 1996s will be magnificent when the fruit reopens (which might have already happened - have to check on that).

Ok, discuss!

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We had 12 grivot clos vougeot in February and it was wide open (and beautiful) for what that’s worth.

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IKR!

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“… nearly as good as the 21” did you mean 2001? I think 2000 is the “weakest” of the 1999-2002 vintages, but that is some magnificent company. The (good) 2000s are lovely, though most wines are better in 99 / 01 / 02.

1996, I had also posted some recent observations in the “recent vintages” thread. From my experience, wines like Rousseau and DRC just aren’t that great in 1996. They may or may not blossom. I’ve had much more compelling experiences with Les Amoreuses (Mugnier & Vogue), Roumier, and Hudelot Noellat.

Haven’t had either. Not producers I have the privilege of being offered, unfortunately.

What were your favorite 96 Producer/Vineyard combinations, Maureen? Besides Truchot.

Yeah I meant the 01.

I actually quite liked the 96 Rousseau CSJ and 96 La Tache. I think the 96 Richebourg needs much more time. The 96 beze and Chambertin aren’t my favorite wines but may be good in time. 96 Roumier BM was still pretty tight.

Bertheau made great 96s. I bought directly from Kermit Lynch and went thru a lot of th chambolle premier cru, which was priced at a greater discount from the chambolle charmes that the difference in quality warranted. But that was before the burgundy market learned that.

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Oh, oh course the lady with a Bertheau thumb would cite them :). The very best bottles of Bertheau I’ve ever had have come from you (albeit the 2002s). Any others, Maureen?

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I am not surprised that you like the 2000 so much. I have not had any 2000 Burgundies for a while now (it was too hard to keep my hands off of them and I drank mine up a long time ago). Had some wonderful experiences with 2000 Burgundies over the years. I learned a lot from 2000s and over the years have bought more similarly dismissed vintages like 2001, 2007, 2017 and 2021. Very elegant wines and wonderful to drink.

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