[quote="Jay T]I also think this is a mostly legitimate point, but it’s a lot easier to just list some producers/wines that you like than to try to describe the style of a wine to someone who lacks much context with the variety. At the end of the day, other than generalizations about things like acid, oak, tannin, and vinification, you have to get into a pretty deep discussion to get to a place to recommend a wine to someone in a truly helpful way.
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There is a whole spectrum in between listing a producer and giving detailed TNs. For example, I could see a lot of value in a thread about “What zinfandels do you recommend?” to say:
Ridge Geyserville – a blacker, sterner, more claret-like zin blend that ages very well
Ridge Lytton Springs – also ages well, but more open and more zin character than Geyserville, yet still more traditional and not high in ripeness and oak
Turley – more recent vintages have combined big, fresh fruit with modest oak, retaining good brambly zin character and acids despite high listed alcohol
Martinelli – pushes the high limits of concentration, ripeness and oak; those who aren’t fans of that style should probably look elsewhere
Scherrer – zin made in more of a pinot style, red fruited and with great aging potential
Now I could see a lot of value to someone in a quick look through there, without resorting to long tasting notes of multiple vintages and all.
I think the problem with Dolcetto is that it’s very badly promoted; ‘little sweet one’ (literally) and ‘the Beaujolais of Italy.’ I think if one thinks of very good Dolcetto as a deeply colored, strapping, violet/tealeaf/blackberry- tasting red it would have more friends. It goes so well with Piedmontese cooking.
Thanks Chris, I agree perfectly. Listing favorite producers and bottles is good; adding brief descriptions can increase the value quite a lot.
Those other threads in Jay T’s post #9 were quite useful. Thanks guys. Guess my palate is with Oliver, John, and Geir. Will look to Asti and, if I see them around, Monferrato.
I think Gary made a good point about over-extracted wines carrying too much oak. I know that folks tend to believe everything that Roberto Conterno puts out is “grade A”, but at least for my palate, he started pushing the “intervention” meter too far after the 2004/2005 vintage - the 2006 Cascina Francia came across like Franken-Barbera (and if memory serves was something close to 15% in alcohol). Too much of a good thing, IMO.
This thread isn’t about making some list devoid of information. I wanted to learn more about Barbera so I asked. People have offered recommendations with varying levels of additional information. I decided to make a quick list for myself of wines I might want to investigate further. Since I went to the trouble, I added it to the OP because I thought others might benefit. If others don’t find that list helpful, then ignore it and read through the threads yourselves. If you want more information, then ask the posters followup questions.
If I give you all the answers why take the test? My typing skillz are not the best. So I make suggestions for producers. We can talk about a wine all day long, but it comes down to what you find in the glass.
Geir - Thanks, you know American are geographically challenged.
I’m certainly no expert on Barbera, but I had a couple glasses of 1997 Gaja Sitorey (Barbera) earlier this year and it was incredible. Pure and focused with gorgeous aromas and flavors.
Pat, I wasn’t commenting on you or on your posts in this thread at all, I was just following on that conversation with Chuck about threads like this in general and what information is helpful. I apologize if it ended up sounding like a criticism of you; I assure you, I didn’t mean that, and I didn’t have you in mind with my remark.
I understand the background to this criticism, his Barbera is quite big (but the only oak it sees is from big barrels, like the Barolo), but why accusing him of pushing the “intervention” meter? My impression is that the high alcohol levels of Barbera is due to increasing temperatures. IMHO his Barbera 2009 and 10 are both beautiful and well balanced. Also G. Rinaldi’s Barberas are at 14-14.5% ABV. To make another example of a very traditional producer (probably unknown to most people here): Lorenzo Accomasso’s 2009 Barbera is 15% ABV but also lovely and well balanced.
On the other hand an Aldo Conterno Barbera of 1980 I had some months ago was 12.5%…
Gilberto, I used that term because stylistically the wines were so different from one vintage to the next, and you didn’t see the same change in his Barolo over the same time period, so to me that implies a difference in handling the Barbera not accounted for by “natural” factors.
If they have backed away from that style, good for them.
Yes, thanks, interesting point. Unfortunately I cannot answer your question since I haven’t tried their 2006 Barbera or older, but it would interesting to find out. Perhaps somebody here has followed Conterno’s Barbera over many years and wants to comment?
This is the all-time bargain in a drinkable, cheap Barbera ($11-$12). No oak, partial whole berry fermentation, it’s just a lovely little fruit bomb with a nice acid backdrop -
With respect to Vajra I find that the standard Barbera D’Alba is good but there are others that compete well at that price point. It is the fruitier sibling to the Vajra Barbera D’Alba Superiore which I find can be stunningly complex and balanced(2009) or rich and slightly hedonistic(2011). My taste buds sway towards fruit and acid balance whether it be a low tannin non-oaked(drink now) or moderate tannin oaked(drink later). The Sierra Foothills are too rich for my tastes and it has something to do with the long hang time to get the acids to mellow which often leads to over ripe high alcohol wines.
