How far back does the origins of wine go ?
- 8,000 years
- 12,000 years
- 12,000 years - 22,000 years
- 22,000 years - 100,000 years
- 100,000 years - 250,000 years
- 250,000 years - one million
- one million to 3 million years
- 3 million to ten million years
- ten million +
- Not Interested
Lets look at this theory where wine dates beyond 12,000 years…
We now know the wine industry dates back to 10,000 BC… that’s 4,000 years older than what’s taught…
Grape pips have been found throughout France, pre-dating the Greeks and Romans, with some examples found near Lake Geneva dated to 10,000 BC.
source below …
change the map dates and rewrite history again… what if I told you that wine may go back one million years or longer…for now, follow me down this new rabbit hole…
yeast, especially Saccharomyces cerevisiae, has been around for 300 to 600 million years with the potential to ferment … there is a theory that the yeast was found on a grape skin first and utilized in agriculture, bread, beer and wine production … it’s my theory that wines have been made for millions of years or as long as you had a grapevine or another fruit, it’s real simple to understand … all you needed was wild grapes and a forager to collect them, with the yeast that lives on the skin one can conclude that wine was made very early on well before cultivated vines … so we can now go back date wine before the stone age farmers had the tools to farm cultivated vines…
imagine you are collecting wild grapes putting them in your animal skins to hold and after a few hours something magical happens… wine …
I will leave you with some nice articles below… please read with an open mind and you too will learn wine is older than we think…
Cheers !!!
John
Modern vines or cultured vines can be dated to the stone age farming …you need tools to cultivate grapes… the stone age farmers would have the tools… and it looks like they had the cultivated vines too…
DNA analysis suggests it is here that Stone Age farmers first domesticated the wine grape.
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I do think that great work has been done by Patrick McGovern on his ideas on the when and where it first happened is flawed, just a bit… he narrowly concludes that ceramic or earthenware the only vessel to make and hold wine, while this may be true to a point it was not the only way to store wine and ferment… so his study of this method only gives us insight into ceramic winemaking method…
Patrick McGovern does not account for the fermentation method of using skins as the fermenter and the dispenser to make inexpensive wine and or other methods of fermentation…
Patrick McGovern, Vouillamoz has spent nearly a decade studying the world’s cultivated and wild vines.
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to prove my point I reference the Bible and general mythical knowledge passed down from father to son over eons…
The use of leather pouches for storing wine is mentioned in the Bible, and there is a talmudic reference to putting a stone in the wine pouch (chemet yayin - presumably leather - the idea being that the stone will displace the air when the pouch is partially empty, so as to prevent spoilage by oxidation) , but these were presumably small pouches, like the ones you see in France sometimes,
floating pig fermentor … ?.. could be if you wanted it to be…
Merlot Made in a Goatskin? North Carolina enology instructor tests an ancient fermentation vessel
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Wines & Vines
“This procedure is based upon historical and archeological evidence describing a process used over 2,000 years ago by ancient winemakers….Some used animal skins when available in lieu of other fermentation vessels because of their versatility. The skins were less likely to break, easy to transport and cheap,” Mcpherson wrote. “Simple fermentation inside the wineskin and a good palatable finished wine is the objective.” He started with freshly picked and crushed Merlot grapes, allowing them to ferment in the crushing vat for a few hours or even days. A goat was slaughtered “according to approved customs,” and the skin prepared. The juice was separated from the pomace and poured into the wineskin, which was tied shut and hung in a cool place. “Vigorous fermentation is allowed to proceed uninterrupted, causing the sealed skin to expand drastically due to production of carbon dioxide.” When fermentation was complete, the wine aged for three months inside the skin, then filtered through a linen cloth into a “clay fired or glass vessel for storage and 12 months of aging.” Prior to bottling, Mcpherson dosed the wine with 100ppm potassium metabisulphite to prevent spoilage. “I did this for the sake of preserving the wine so the evaluators would receive the wine unspoiled and as near to the ‘ancient’ finished product as possible,” he wrote. As 2009 flew by, somehow we never got around to sampling what we came to refer to as “the goat wine” at our semi-regular Friday tastings. An adventurous new staffer, however, encouraged us to open the bottle: Our holiday party would be the perfect occasion. Several of our columnists came to celebrate with us, and they too were curious, if not exactly eager, to taste this unusual wine. For comparison, we pulled a 2007 Central Coast Merlot from our winerack, and gingerly opened the Wineskin Experiment. Although Mcpherson had enclosed an evaluation chart, we chose simply to note our tasters’ reactions. What was the verdict on the “bag in baaaax” Merlot? The color, we found, was a lovely light garnet with a tint of rust, much paler than the plum-dark commercial exemplar. In body, it was rather thin vs. the commercial comparison. One taster found the aroma a little on the raisin-y side. Stephanie Papadakis, a vegetarian, found it redolent of childhood Greek Easters at Blackberry Farm in San Jose: Fleshy, and reminiscent of smoked goat. Other comments ranged from Cliff Ohmart’s “Not unpleasant;” Glenn McGourty’s “Not undrinkable” and Tim Patterson’s “I’ve made worse,” to web developer Dave Edmister’s “Nice, soft on the palate, almost velvety.” Papadakis and this (carnivorous) writer concurred that the finish was unique: Slightly metallic, like the coppery flavor of blood. However, we also agreed that, even though Merlot probably would not have been the variety used 2,000 years ago, wine drinkers of the day would likely have enjoyed drinking the results of the Wineskin Experiment.
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Wines & Vines
so lets push the dates back a bit more…
The Neolithic Transition was the period from be teen 9000 B.C. and 8000 B.C. when humanity first started to develop agriculture.
source Click On me
below is what we have to date, lets not accept this as the first of any wine production, as it would be very premature…
There is archaeological evidence to suggest that the Celts first cultivated the grapevine in Gaul. Grape pips have been found throughout France, pre-dating the Greeks and Romans, with some examples found near Lake Geneva dated to 10,000 BC.
growing grapevines cultivated vines, the simplest conclusion one has to make, they were making wine using those grapes… it’s that simple… I am sure wine dates back farther than anyone could imagine ,so I just won’t guess…
the below is what they have hard facts on actual wine-making facility or equipment… I tender that the equipment of ancient winemakers was lost to old age just like many other things along the way…
Oldest evidence of wine production known is 8,000 years old in Georgia…
now
‘Oldest known wine-making facility’ found in Armenia
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The world’s earliest known wine-making facility has been discovered in Armenia, archaeologists say.
A wine press and fermentation jars from about 6,000 years ago were found in a cave in the south Caucasus country
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