Is a Great Wine Palate God Given, Learned or Bought?

[A_So]

I’m sorry, what qualifies Jennings as a great taster? A massive number of notes? I’ve found that his notes are about as useful as me throwing darts at the flavour wheel. The correlation between what he writes and my own experience is probably close to 0 (at least with RMP, I have a clear negative correlation). In fact, he is one of the few tasters who I’ve blocked on CT…

[Sc0tt_F_tzgerald]

Why is it so important to be able to describe what you’re tasting? Can’t you just enjoy the wine?

[paul_hanna]

I’ve seen a number of women in particular with little experience, nail things in wine that surprise me often.

My wife (who never drank wine until we met) has a naturally gifted palate for both food and wine, one that I’d say is far superior to mine as far as examining and identifying flavours (as well as aroma). I’m perhaps more technical, looking more at structure, mouthfeel, balance, length.

Also for me, it is probably more about palate/memory recall. I can often nail a wine (and maker/vintage etc) because I remember details about it that line it up for me in my mind…

[Markus_S]

God gives but money can cheapen the transaction. Don’t be a prostitute.

[Henry_Kiichli]

@paul hanna

I’ve seen a number of women in particular with little experience, nail things in wine that surprise me often.

My wife (who never drank wine until we met) has a naturally gifted palate for both food and wine, one that I’d say is far superior to mine as far as examining and identifying flavours (as well as aroma). I’m perhaps more technical, looking more at structure, mouthfeel, balance, length.

Also for me, it is probably more about palate/memory recall. I can often nail a wine (and maker/vintage etc) because I remember details about it that line it up for me in my mind…

Agree. I think many women have a better /finer sense of smell. OTOH, men often have more fun with the information /geeky stuff.

[Bruce_Leiser_owitz]

@Scott Fitzgerald

Why is it so important to be able to describe what you’re tasting? Can’t you just enjoy the wine?

Anyone can “enjoy the wine.” It doesn’t take any sort of trained palate to say you like this wine, but don’t like this one.

Bruce

[Bruce_Leiser_owitz]

@Brian Tuite

@Bruce Leiser_owitz

You can’t have a “great palate” unless you possess the ability to distinguish between violets and crushed violets.

I think the article begs the question somewhat, since you need to ask the purpose of the “great palate.” For example, there’s the ability to taste and identify wines blindly. Some people think that identifying wines blindly is a sign of a “great palate,” but it’s really a parlor game based largely on the taster’s depth of experience with the kind of wine being tasted. And it’s not really a practical skill, unless you live in a place where you will be killed by terroir-ists unless you can correctly identify a wine served blindly.

To me, the first and foremost attribute of a “great palate” is someone who can taste and describe a wine in a fashion that is useful to someone else who isn’t tasting the wine at the same time. This means not simply coming up with 30 different, somewhat abstract descriptors for each wine. Rather, an ability to taste and identify issues such as aroma, fruit/acid balance, mouthfeel, quality/quantity of tannins, etc. in a way that it makes sense to someone else.

Bruce

Great palate or great tasting note writer?

I would say that you can’t write a great tasting note (either as a professional or just someone posting notes online) unless you have a great palate.

Bruce

[Bruce_Leiser_owitz]

@Oliver McCrum

I think a few people are born with a striking ability to taste, and everyone else can improve their tasting ability by practicing a lot.

I think people who can blind taste well are people who can taste well, I don’t understand disparaging that ability. I think it’s a good goal.

From my own perspective, it’s not an issue of disparaging “blind tasting.” It’s just that I don’t think that blind tasting, in and of itself, is the sign of a great wine palate.

Bruce

[david_li]

@David M. Bueker

I had a great palate, then God took it away from me when he crashed my head into that stupid mountain in Argentina. I have been slowly retraining it.

If the god given ability to taste is like a rough diamond, a superior piece won’t be as shiny as a mediocre one with nice craftsmanship. But when same work is receive, the superior one will shine.

[David_Bu3ker]

@maureen nelson

Punishment for hubris?



Sorry, David, couldn’t resist.

Yup. I thought I could rappell.

[Clint_S_Q_U_I_E_R]

To me, there are two ways to describe “great palate”. Those who can easily find the words to describe what they’re smelling/drinking and those who can blind taste. I’m a WAY better blind taster than I am at describing what I’m having. A friend can lay 10 adjectives on a taste, be throttled by the rest of my group’s mocking and then finally sit back and smile as we all sheepishly admit that through reality or suggestive reasoning, he’s right. But stick the bottle in a bag and he has no idea if it’s red or white.

It’s a bit easier to judge the person who can blind taste as that’s 100% objective. The name’s right on the bottle. It’s a little tougher w/ Shakespeare since there are no right or wrong answers, but maybe just who’s more adamant about what they’re sensing.

My wife is getting pretty good, but she doesn’t care. She can blind taste between a 1er and GC burg, but will sum it up to “it’s the more expensive of the slopey bottle reds”. Thanks dear.

[Gerhard_P]

Is a Great Wine Palate God Given, Learned or Bought?<<

It´s not only about the palate (incl. tasting buds on the tongue, lips, the whole inner mouth …), it´s also about nose/smelling abilities, eyes and brain.

Some abilities are God given … some people taste, smell (think) … better than others, some even can´t taste a difference at all …
but provided the necessary abilities a lot can also be learned (e.g. how what you taste/smell is called … and for what it is typical) - the different grapes, regions, vintages …
and if you mean with “bought” that you must buy enough wine to taste … I agree - and the result will be great experience.

All that has to be combined in the brain (!), and another VERY important thing is a good memory … for different tastes, smells, optical appearances - and also a good imagination based on experience, e.g. how a wine can taste 5 or 10 years later when tasted young.

A “great palate” doesn´t necessarily mean that one has to be able to identify wines blind … this is often a question of cirumstances, luck and intelligence far more than of an infallable physical palate.
In many instances it is almost impossible to identify certain wines blind, because it´s a changing thing, and if you are not lucky having tasted the same (or a similar) wine in a similar state of developement (and in a comparable condition) not too far ago you can quickly be completely lost.

For me a good taster can describe what he´s tasting, can give good reasons for his opinions regarding region, varieties, age, style and quality level, is able to make comparisons between similar and different wines … can give reasonable estimates reg. ageabilty and developement … etc.

That doesn´t necessarily mean that he is also a good wine writer (means also creating a “good read”), but the most important qualifications would be at least there …

[craig_v]

I agree. Being comfortable with what you like / love is all that matters. Doesn’t bother me in the least if an expert rates my fav wine 85pts or the guy with the “best” palate likes something I don’t get.

@Alan Rath

Isn’t a “great palate” someone who likes the wines you like? I’m only half joking. To me, someone could be an expert at describing and distinguishing all the modern California Cabs, or (for my tastes) all the high end modern CdPs, but that wouldn’t persuade me they have a great palate, because those wines aren’t in my wheelhouse.

[david_li]

@craig v

I agree. Being comfortable with what you like / love is all that matters. Doesn’t bother me in the least if an expert rates my fav wine 85pts or the guy with the “best” palate likes something I don’t get.

@Alan Rath

Isn’t a “great palate” someone who likes the wines you like? I’m only half joking. To me, someone could be an expert at describing and distinguishing all the modern California Cabs, or (for my tastes) all the high end modern CdPs, but that wouldn’t persuade me they have a great palate, because those wines aren’t in my wheelhouse.

Drifting from my own post, I am actually happier if the wine that I know I like is rated poor by an expert. It is more likely that I will be able to buy those wines on discount.

Wine is very subjective. It is perfectly fine, if someone does not like a certain style of a well made wine. The expert’s opinion does not make the wine taste worse for me.

[Oliver_McCrum]

@Bruce Leiser_owitz

@Oliver McCrum

I think a few people are born with a striking ability to taste, and everyone else can improve their tasting ability by practicing a lot.

I think people who can blind taste well are people who can taste well, I don’t understand disparaging that ability. I think it’s a good goal.

From my own perspective, it’s not an issue of disparaging “blind tasting.” It’s just that I don’t think that blind tasting, in and of itself, is the sign of a great wine palate.

Bruce

What would be missing, Bruce? Not sure I understand your point.

[Jeff_Leve]

Being a good taster is a learned skill. A lot of people have been able to become good tasters. Recognizing how a young wine will be at maturity is another skill set that not many people have. Being able to accurately write about and describe the experience of how a wine tastes and feels, and not have it bore the reader to death is another completely different skill set that only a select few have been able to accomplish.

[dteng]

I dunno.
I find I am often jealous of those with a great wine palette…pending from PC for example.

[Gerhard_P]

@Scott Fitzgerald

Why is it so important to be able to describe what you’re tasting? Can’t you just enjoy the wine?

Sure you can just enjoy … no problem … everybody can say subjectively “I like this - and I don´t like that” and for his own he/she is absolutely right - but why should you THEN have a great wine palate?

(everybody can go into a concert, listen … and say “I like / don´t like the music” - but that´s no great music expert)

[Bruce_Leiser_owitz]

@Oliver McCrum

@Bruce Leiser_owitz

@Oliver McCrum

I think a few people are born with a striking ability to taste, and everyone else can improve their tasting ability by practicing a lot.

I think people who can blind taste well are people who can taste well, I don’t understand disparaging that ability. I think it’s a good goal.

From my own perspective, it’s not an issue of disparaging “blind tasting.” It’s just that I don’t think that blind tasting, in and of itself, is the sign of a great wine palate.

Bruce

What would be missing, Bruce? Not sure I understand your point.

I just don’t consider identifying wines blind to the sine qua non of a “great palate.” I don’t think you can identify wines blind without having excellent sensory and memory skills, but I’ve met lots of people who have what I consider to be an excellent palate who nevertheless have a difficult time distinguishing blind between wines from Vineyard A and Vineyard B, especially when the two vineyards are in the same region.

For myself, blind tasting is more about tasting the wine for what it is, without the label bias. When I blind taste wines, I do it primarily to avoid label bias and not as part of a contest to see if I can accurately guess what the wine is. It’s fun to get it right, of course.

I’ll give you a concrete example. If I go to a restaurant and ask the sommelier’s advice on selecting a wine, I don’t ask the sommelier to pull out their blind tasting results to show that they correctly identified blind 15 wines out of 15. It’s an interesting skill, but it doesn’t really help ME. Instead, I want them to
guide me to why Wine A on their list is a better match with what I’m ordering than Wine B. That’s the kind of palate skill that is much more important to me.

Bruce

[Merrill_Lindquist]

I believe that some small number of folks have an innate ability to perceive wines at a higher level than some other folks do. By this I mean they have the ability to easily taste differences in wines - to somewhat effortlessly cut to the core of what a wine is like. I think this is a fraction of the wine-drinking population. A gifted palate, if you will. I know a couple of these people.

Aside from that, I think most people can achieve some reliable “palate” if they pay attention - if they work at it. Tasting a lot, using a language of descriptors which provides a template or means for comparing wines they have experienced - if they do that, they can develop a “palate.”

I often say I think pretty much everyone can take piano lessons, and if they pay attention, and practice, they can achieve some level of competency. Only those with a “gift” can go beyond that. I feel it is that way with sports, music, probably a lot of things…and wine tasting is included.