'Hors Categorie' offer - new Christophe Baron project

WINE TALK
21

This isn’t a fair comparison as this is not ‘in the rocks’, not standing up for the wine just a different beast

22

It is from Walla Walla so the comparison is fair.

23

Peter,

I completely agree with your comments.

And Charlie, the reason one would purchase this instead of Chave is, well, because this is THIS, and not Chave.

The argument that one ‘can find just as good a wine for a fraction of that price’ is and should be used nearly everywhere throughout CA, WA and OR. There will ALWAYS be crazy pricing for ‘highly sought after’ wines that defies ‘normal’ logic - other than a) it’s limited availability, and/or b) it’s scores (or anticipated scores) and/or c) the ability to flip, and/or d) you just really like the producer.

I’ve been saying for a long time that I think it’s crazy to spend over $75 for ANY syrah coming from our area when you can purchase such great ones, including Jaffur’s top of the line one, for that tariff. But folks wantingly and knowingly spend A LOT more than that . . .

Is the wine ‘better’? Totally subjective.

Will you get ‘that much more enjoyment’ out of that bottle? Totally subjective.

Carry on . . . champagne.gif pepsi [soap.gif] [stirthepothal.gif] [swearing.gif]

24

Purchasing decisions for expensive wines should probably be based on blind tastings, not labels or producer promos.

25

I love Saxum. But if I was honest and truthful with myself,…is it really that much better than some of the other Syrahs I really like,…I would probably say no. I love Melville, Jaffurs, and Qupe and they come at a fraction of the price of Saxum. But I keep buying Saxum,…

26

normally i’d agree with you, but that’s not what they are saying in their email.

The critics say it tastes like an amazing Hermitage. The grower compares the site to Hermitage. So why wouldn’t you just buy an amazing hermitage on release at the same price.

27

I wonder what it would sell for without the glowing critic comments? In days of yore a winery might start the price more modestly, until the reputation grew. These days critics can be used to fast track the process?

28

Please do not compare to Chave. Nothing does.
And especially not anything not from Northern Rhone
I would presume it is waste of your money, if you like Rhône septentrional

29

So is it never not ok to compare anything not from Northern Rhone to Northern Rhone?

30

I love Saxum. But if I was honest and truthful with myself,…is it really that much better than some of the other Syrahs I really like,…I would probably say no. I love Melville, Jaffurs, and Qupe and they come at a fraction of the price of Saxum. But I keep buying Saxum,…[/quote]

I’ve been backing off my purchases of Saxum for a few years now because of exactly this, buying one or two bottles a release for no real reason but to stay on the list. They just sent me the “we are dropping you off our list” email a few days ago, I was not upset. Their wines are great but at that price and then getting them to my state, so many other great bottles that I can get for less money and a lot less hassle.

31

‘Cult’ does not necessarily equal ‘value’ does not necessarily equal ‘enjoyment’ and does not necessarily equal ‘quality’.

All of these terms are truly in the eye of the beholder.

And as comparisons with Northern Rhone, well . . .to me that’s just as ‘ludicrous’ as CA pinots being ‘compared’ to Burgundy.

Cheers.

32

Question? Have you been to walla walla? You do realize that wines are different styles depending on where they are grown, the rocks has a very distinctive style, you can’t just compare wines from the rocks to those grown in Les Collines…

I like Durand from Cornas but I wouldn’t say that it’s fair to compare it to juge just because it’s from Cornas and cheaper…

33

Passing no judgement on the wine in discussion, has anyone looked at the photos of this vineyard on his website? It’s a pretty cool looking vineyard and a beautiful location. I’m not sure what the technical term is, but it appears the vines are grown vertically without the canes being trained horizontally along a trellis. Pretty unique in WA. Is this technique common elsewhere?

34

Jbray - I have actually. And while I realize a region (any region) can have varying styles, to say a wine born of the same grape from the same area of the world is not fair for comparison is just silly. Could they end up tasting different? Definitely. What I am arguing is that both qualitatively and stylistically there will be plenty of wines, from Walla Walla and beyond, that will be in the same league as Hors Categorie for a fraction of the cost.

But for the sake of your argument, if I had to pick a couple of Non-Rocks, Oregon born wines from Walla Walla (like Hors Categorie) that likely have a similar style (because Christophe affiliation) are the Reynvaan In the Foothills and Foothills Reserve. And you can get two bottles of each for the price of one Hors Categorie.

35

I hadn’t seen it until we were there recently, but pretty much every classic site in the N Rhone is grown this way, the vineyards (Reynard and Chaillot in Cornas, and on the hill in Hermitage, Bessards, etc. to name a few) are all too steep and the mistral too strong to allow for your standard horizontal trellising.

36

No track record.
2014 from four year old vines, bucking conventional vine age wisdom regarding longetivity.
96 From the WE, and 99 WA.
“A Jewel” straight from from the winemaker’s mouth through Steiman’s ears and fingers, and on to you(as per WS article).
Twice the price of the referenced La Chapelle?
Only $500+ for two bottles
And an assumed hahaha and a nod from Mr Barnum

37

The funny part is, Reynvaan is waaay overpriced for what it is, bought the first year, 08’ or 07’ for $35 and then the prices shot up and thought it was ridiculous.

Look, I was just allocated the frog but pass along my allocation at cost to a board member so have no real dog in the fight (I like to stay on the list, I like the party, gives me an excuse to get out of town for a couple of days).

I just find it striking to compare wines that are totally different and say well they’re all from Walla Walla so this is what I like compared to another wine that is much different.

I applaud Christophe for what he’s done, when in retail back in 00’ we were buying the 98’s when he and chuck (dude, its K for killer) rolled up with smoke billowing out of their white van and trying to make a go of things.

This is really expensive but so is SQN (which they started within 5 years of each other) and when people hate on it I think it’s funny but at least compare apples to apples…

My boss pissed me off last week when I was bemoaning the price of Roulot we just got in, his quote was ‘these wines aren’t for you’ I told him to f*ck off as I own and have drank my share and he said ‘you don’t get it, these people make wine for rich people who spending $250 on a bottle of wine is an afterthought.’

And here we are, Christophe’s new vineyard, it’s not for us, it’s for people that spending $250 as an afterthought on wine is the norm…

38

And an FYI, a prominent retailer in the area, when asked if this was worth it and his thoughts said he would be answering the email to get in the list… he thought the wines were amazing…

If this guy is on board it made me do a double take, maybe they are worth it…

I’ll never know, I spent $360 on my 6 bottles of Juge…

39

Anyone able to get the sign up page to load?

40

server error. must be getting crushed.