Gueuze and Lambics

[Brian_G_r_a_f_s_t_r_o_m]

@Linda Baehr

I guess this post is a little late in coming, but someone brought a sour to Berserkerfest 2 (Loring party) that was REALLY sour and REALLY refreshing after all of those “slutty reds”. Anyone know which one I am talking about? I would love to get some.

my guess would be the 1996 Brasserie a Vapeur - “Cochonne” — that was the most sour of the beer selections that day. K&L used to have some, so check there first (I’ve never seen it elsewhere, so I wouldn’t spend too much time trying to track it down). You could always pick up a quality Gueuze and you’d likely be just as happy.

[Linda_Baehr]

@Brian G r a f s t r o m

@Linda Baehr

I guess this post is a little late in coming, but someone brought a sour to Berserkerfest 2 (Loring party) that was REALLY sour and REALLY refreshing after all of those “slutty reds”. Anyone know which one I am talking about? I would love to get some.

my guess would be the 1996 Brasserie a Vapeur - “Cochonne” — that was the most sour of the beer selections that day. K&L used to have some, so check there first (I’ve never seen it elsewhere, so I wouldn’t spend too much time trying to track it down). You could always pick up a quality Gueuze and you’d likely be just as happy.

I figured you would know. Thanks!

[Peter_Tryba]

St Louis Gueuze Fond Tradition on tap at Deep Ellum last night.

Delicious and refreshing on a sticky Boston evening!

[Peter_Tryba]

Oh yeah!

I also had ONE SIP of Russian River Consecration. Also lightly sour and brilliant. Sadly, I was at the busy store, working, not drinking, so one sip was all I managed.

[Josh_Beck]

@Linda Baehr

I would love to get some.

@Friedrich Nietzsche

The lonely one offers his hand too quickly to whomever he encounters.

[Josh_Beck]

I still can’t come to grips with most sour beers. Just not what I’m into. If I am around a campfire I’ll drink anything decent. If I want a refreshing beer on a hot day I’ll go for a great Pils/lager or bitter or failing that a Bohemia or Pacifico. If I want a warming beer that avoids sweetness I’ll go for a Scotch/Scottish ale or Saison. If I want a rich, heady beer to contemplate I’ll go for a strong Belgian style.

And if I want to vomit I’ll go for a lambic

[Roberto_Rogness]

Lambics and Flemish Reds are AMAZING food beers as well as being hyper refreshing. Try some with Paella or curried seafood (or goat for the Flemish Reds) and you may change your mind. Can’t get enough of those wondrous beers.

[Scott_Butler]

@Peter Tryba

St Louis Gueuze Fond Tradition on tap at Deep Ellum last night.

Delicious and refreshing on a sticky Boston evening!

I’ve been wanting to try a Gueuze since reading this thread. I just found the St Louis Gueuze Fond Tradition in bottle at a new beer shop near me. Since it will be my first Gueuze - is it typical of the style?

[Peter_Tryba]

The St Louis is a great beginner’s gueuze. The tartness is there, but this beer lacks the “horsey” characteristics of other sours. Its a svelte model as opposed to the “junk (or funk) in trunk” of the classics (read: Cantillon).

[Scott_Butler]

@Peter Tryba

The St Louis is a great beginner’s gueuze. The tartness is there, but this beer lacks the “horsey” characteristics of other sours. Its a svelte model as opposed to the “junk (or funk) in trunk” of the classics (read: Cantillon).

Yeh, I’ve noticed all the Cantillon comments. Assuming I like the St Louis I will start seeking out the Cantillon. Thanks for the feedback.

[Brian_G_r_a_f_s_t_r_o_m]

@Scott Butler

@Peter Tryba

The St Louis is a great beginner’s gueuze. The tartness is there, but this beer lacks the “horsey” characteristics of other sours. Its a svelte model as opposed to the “junk (or funk) in trunk” of the classics (read: Cantillon).

Yeh, I’ve noticed all the Cantillon comments. Assuming I like the St Louis I will start seeking out the Cantillon. Thanks for the feedback.

Scott,

You have it all backwards; it shouldn’t be “assuming I like the St Louis I will start seeking out the Cantillon,” rather, it should be “assuming I like the Cantillon I will start seeking out more Cantillon.”

The St. Louis really isn’t much different than Cantillon, insofar as they are both Belgian gueuzes, but Cantillon (and other producers) make gueuze that’s simply a better gueuze than St. Louis’ in every which way. So, if you don’t like the St. Louis because “it’s a little too much____” or “it’s not quite enough___” then you should try a better example of the style.

[Scott_Butler]

@Brian G r a f s t r o m

@Scott Butler

@Peter Tryba

The St Louis is a great beginner’s gueuze. The tartness is there, but this beer lacks the “horsey” characteristics of other sours. Its a svelte model as opposed to the “junk (or funk) in trunk” of the classics (read: Cantillon).

Yeh, I’ve noticed all the Cantillon comments. Assuming I like the St Louis I will start seeking out the Cantillon. Thanks for the feedback.

Scott,

You have it all backwards; it shouldn’t be “assuming I like the St Louis I will start seeking out the Cantillon,” rather, it should be “assuming I like the Cantillon I will start seeking out more Cantillon.”

The St. Louis really isn’t much different than Cantillon, insofar as they are both Belgian gueuzes, but Cantillon (and other producers) make gueuze that’s simply a better gueuze than St. Louis’ in every which way. So, if you don’t like the St. Louis because “it’s a little too much____” or “it’s not quite enough___” then you should try a better example of the style.

Ok, let me rephrase…“I’m going to find me some Cantillon next…DAMMIT!”

Better

[DougS]

@Brian G r a f s t r o m

@Scott Butler

@Peter Tryba

The St Louis is a great beginner’s gueuze. The tartness is there, but this beer lacks the “horsey” characteristics of other sours. Its a svelte model as opposed to the “junk (or funk) in trunk” of the classics (read: Cantillon).

Yeh, I’ve noticed all the Cantillon comments. Assuming I like the St Louis I will start seeking out the Cantillon. Thanks for the feedback.

Scott,

You have it all backwards; it shouldn’t be “assuming I like the St Louis I will start seeking out the Cantillon,” rather, it should be “assuming I like the Cantillon I will start seeking out more Cantillon.”

The St. Louis really isn’t much different than Cantillon, insofar as they are both Belgian gueuzes, but Cantillon (and other producers) make gueuze that’s simply a better gueuze than St. Louis’ in every which way. So, if you don’t like the St. Louis because “it’s a little too much____” or “it’s not quite enough___” then you should try a better example of the style.

I agree. I was surprised to read the comments on the St Louis vs. Cantillon as I have found the St Louis to be too “horsey” without the pleasant characteristics to balance that out – it tastes dull to me. Cantillon’s classic Geuze (and really any Cantillon Geuze) is, to my taste, one of the cleaner examples of the style: I get very pretty citrus character that’s more pronounced than the barnyardy aspects. I guess we all taste differently, though. Personally, I love Geuze and will never buy the St Louis stuff again.

edit: I don’t want to sound like I think Cantillon is the end all, be all of Lambic. Scott, if you want to experience some other high quality geuzes, seek out Hannsen’s Oude Geuze and Girardin 1882.

[Brian_G_r_a_f_s_t_r_o_m]

• 2007 Cantillon brewery Fou’ Foune Lambic - Belgium, Flanders, Brussels (7/11/2010)
  – popped and poured –
  – tasted non-blind over a couple hours, and again on Day 3 –
  – bottled on Aug. 13, 2009 –

NOSE: classic gueuze nose – until the apricots start to step forward from the background; sour wet oak; nectar; complex; moderately expressive; oxidative note on Day 3.

BODY: hazy tan-orange color; little head; medium bodied

TASTE: very sour, with spices and oak; puckering acidity; lemon; really nice, although I would prefer a more mellow version; still very sour on Day 3; 5% alc… This bottling features 2-year-old lambic which is then finished with fresh apricots for its final two months of aging in oak barrels.

B: 50, 5, 14, 17, 9 = 95

Posted from CellarTracker


The story behind this beer, lifted from the Cantillon website:

@http://www.cantillon.be/br/3_107

A marvellous wine grower’s house with a view on the Rhône river. A large table with a perfectly roasted young goat and delicious wines (Hermitage and Saint-Joseph). Around the table, only good friends.

It was 1998. There was a friendly atmosphere, the food was excellent, it was a perfect occasion to improve the world and let our imagination run away. Improving the world has remained an illusion, but one of our fantasies has become reality.
François Daronnat, an apricot grower nicknamed “Foufoune” was one of the participants.
He kept on singing the praises of his “Bergeron” apricots : they were the most natural, the most beautiful, the most delicious, sweet and acid at the same time. “With those apricots, I could brew you a beer, dear François”, I told him. But my spirits got bemused by the great Rhône wines and I forgot all the dreams and crazy ideas which pop up at these great moments.

Foufoune, however, hadn’t forgotten about the apricots and the beer: on a morning in July 1998, I discovered all of a sudden 300 kgs of deliciously mature “Bergerons” outside the Cantillon brewery. Foufoune was obviously someone who kept his promises. It was up to us now.

The result was perfect and the limited production of apricots lambic was destined for a small part of the French market.
Due to the success of our provençal beer, 1200 kgs of apricots are delivered now every year to the Cantillon brewery.

The fruits are stoned by hand before being soaked in 2 years old lambic. The beer extracts the taste and the aromas very quickly and the Fou’Foune is bottled after two months.

The beer is rather sour, slightly turbid and has a pale gold colour. Its production is limited to 3000 liters a year. A large part of the bottles go back to the region where these apricots come from. People there consider the Fou’Foune Cantillon as a local beer.

[Scott_Butler]

Well, if the Cantillon is better than the St Louis, then I need to really find the Cantillon. I like this St Louis Fond Tradition quite a bit! Tart/vinegar, funky, citrusy - good stuff!

[Scott_Butler]

So…picked up a Cantillon Bruocsella 1900 Grand Cru which I am excited to try. Just need to find time. This week has been nutso.

Has anyone ever tried this:

Abbaye de Saint Bon-Chien Grand Cru 2007

http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/bfm-abbaye-de-saint-bon-chien-grand-cru-2007-pinot-noir-barrel/97589/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


It was even more then the Cantillon but the beer store guy said it is great!

[RDHudak]

@Scott Butler

So…picked up a Cantillon Bruocsella 1900 Grand Cru which I am excited to try. Just need to find time. This week has been nutso.

Has anyone ever tried this:

Abbaye de Saint Bon-Chien Grand Cru 2007

http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/bfm-abbaye-de-saint-bon-chien-grand-cru-2007-pinot-noir-barrel/97589/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


It was even more then the Cantillon but the beer store guy said it is great!

I have not, but I have a bottle of the 89 Marriage Parfait and several old gueze. Let me know how that one turns out.

[DougS]

I haven’t had that BFM, but it’s completely different from a Lambic. It’s still sour, but I don’t think it’s fair to even compare it to Lambic (for starters it’s 11% abv compared to 5-6% with most Lambic). I would love to try it, though.

The Cantillon Grand Cru is the most elgant, least funky Lambic I’ve had. It’s interesting that it’s not blended. It’s made from a single batch of 3 year old Lambic. Since it’s bottled unblended after fermentation is complete, there is no secondary fermentation in the bottle. Thus the beer is not carbonated. I have some in the cellar as I expect them to improve and pick up some complexity with age. Right now the ones I have (bottled in '09 I think – the bottling year should be printed on the side of the cork if not on the label) are tasting quite linear and the fruit components are in the forefront, allowing very little funk to show itself. It’s certainly worth a try, but understand that it is not all that similar to a blended Lambic, which is the norm. For the experience it gives in its youth I prefer a geuze.

[Matthew_Brown]

The BFM is somewhere between a Chimay Grand Cru and a Flemmish Brown, like a Liefmans. They barrel age the base beer in a variety of used barrels and create a blend from whatever seems to work together at that time. They also started doing single barrel releases. Interesting beers to try, but not ones I would go back to repeatedly, especially for the price.

Agree on the Cantillon Grand Cru. Stops just short in quality to the Lou Pepe series.

[Scott_Butler]

@Matthew Brown

The BFM is somewhere between a Chimay Grand Cru and a Flemmish Brown, like a Liefmans. They barrel age the base beer in a variety of used barrels and create a blend from whatever seems to work together at that time. They also started doing single barrel releases. Interesting beers to try, but not ones I would go back to repeatedly, especially for the price.

Agree on the Cantillon Grand Cru. Stops just short in quality to the Lou Pepe series.

From everyone’s notes, the Lou Pepe sounds fantastic! From what Doug said, I may sit on the Grand Cru a while.