Thank you, that’s an incredibly helpful flyer. I’m trying to think through whether I can dip a meaningful toe into this sort of approach via wine fridge or whether I need to bite the bullet and build a larger cellar in my basement. I really like the idea of 10 cases of 2016s into a 250 capacity fridge for now and adding a second fridge when necessary to get to a 500 bottle collection over a few years for aging. A couple of fridges over the next few years sounds a lot more appealing than a construction project. You’re so right that the hard part will be leaving the damn things alone.
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Depending where you live etc offsite storage can be a lot more affordable than building and running a home cellar. You don’t need to use a fancy wine club storage place w a tasting room, either. ExtraSpace near me has a dedicated wine area, maintained at 55 degrees and with backup generation, for like 30% of the cost of comparable at the nicer spots.
Edit, also a lot easier to keep your gloves off them!
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That’s a good thought. Portland, Maine isn’t a big wine town so my options may be limited on that front without trekking down to Boston. I’ll reach out to a few nearby storage facilities and perhaps I’ll be pleasantly surprised.
Heck in ME you might be able to get away with a passive cellar.
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Well, that would be ideal. Guess I can go ahead and start picking up 2016s and monitor my temperature and humidity ranges in the basement to see if they ever get to concerning levels. Thanks for helping me think through it!
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I think 2-4k bottles seems to be about the sweet spot. Have a lot of paring down to do to get there though.
You can get a ballpark idea if you know:
- How many bottles you drink a year
- How much age is your sweet spot
If you drink about 2 bottles a week (~100 bottles a year) and like to age them about 10 years, 1000 bottles would be a decent goal. If you prefer them at 20 years, then 2000 bottles. If you drink about 1 bottle a week, halve those numbers.
This is complicated by the fact that how much age you like on them is often not clear when you’re starting out, and may change over time. As can your preference for region and producer and your rate of consumption. Which are all reasons not to go out and fill up the cellar in a year or two.
You also don’t want everything to come on line as ready to drink or ready to go over the hill at the same time, so you’ll want to spread out maturities as you fill the cellar.
It should be an organic process, with the cellar expanding gradually along with your knowledge, and branching off in different directions as your experience increases and your palate evolves.
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For yourself or for someone starting off?
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I might get there by the time I am 70.
This is a great thread!
I didn’t see this listed above, if it was my bad-
Henri Boillot Bourgogne Blanc
I’ve got 3 bottles left from a case of 2019. Just reloaded a case of 2022 for $38.
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Just ordered my first case based on this theme. From Saratoga Wine, three each of:
- Chateau Branaire Ducru Saint Julien 2016
- Olga Raffault Chinon Les Picasses 2019
- Domaine Eden Cabernet Sauvignon 2019
- Gabin Et Felix Richoux Irancy 2019
I was aiming to start with mostly 2016s but it seems difficult to find single bottles of the 2016 of most of the stuff in this thread. My impression is that I would need to do pre-arrival of cases of 6 to have access to more wines but I was hoping to buy only 3 of each vintage. Do you think I need to buy cases of 6 to get 2016s for the most part or just get better at searching?
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I like those choices!
I would imagine that you can find single bottles of many 2016’s, but I do notice that a lot of retailers are offering more favorable pricing on pre-arrival in six packs. I’m guessing you need to look a little bit deeper.
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I do not know where you are on the exploring/collecting journey…but the biggest mistakes I thought I made early on were in buying cases. There is always another deal around the corner. A few bottles will give enough sense of how properties develop in bottle, and where you enjoy them on the aging curve. One doesn’t have to try a dozen to get that.
Enjoy the adventure.
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In a thread filled with great advice, this right here (imo) is some of the best!
@RyanM, I’d actually suggest you snag up as much older wine as you can in a price range that you find workable (and maybe even a smidge higher because that always seems to happen) and see what you like. I’d even say to focus on this for a hard year or two as you will go through all sorts of different discoveries and what you enjoy can and likely will change.
That said, having a stash of Branaire-Ducru is never a bad idea. They really knock it it for great prices and age beautifully.
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Most of the time, I agree with you. However, there are a few times over the years where going big is the correct answer. For me, earlier in my wine buying, that happened when 1982 Bordeaux futures came out at unbelievable prices. I was young and just a newly married government attorney at the time, but I bought a lot for me (although not even close to what I would buy later). I did split cases with friends (spreading out the risks among several wines) but still, there was a risk. One of the great bargains of my life. [I mention this because from my somewhat limited experience drinking 2016 Bordeauxs, this could be the best vintage since 1982, although the prices are not nearly what prices were in 1983 for the 1982s.]
The other time I went pretty big (and wish I had gone much bigger) was 1999 to 2006 Truchot. I had no idea that prices would go up on these wines so much but I had started drinking Truchot with the 1985 vintage and knew I loved his wines. I also had the opportunity to taste many of these wines (at least 2000s, 2001s and 2002s) before I purchased them. Today, almost all of my top 50 wines in terms of PV are from Truchot.
Wish I had done this with 1984 Ridge MB ($20 a bottle) and wines of Mugneret-Gibourg when they were less expensive, but I didn’t go deep enough.
So, I would say you are correct, except when you are pretty sure of what you are buying (and in general have some experience).
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Agreed! Were I in my 30s or early 40s, and had the financial wherewithal, I would be buying cases of many 2016s. I concur on this vintage quality, and for the most part, it’s relatively well-priced even now. I’d buy top to bottom.
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@RyanM how early are you in your journey? And how much experience do you have with Bordeaux and older bottles at that?
I’ve only been collecting for a decade myself. I changed direction multiple times during that time, making many mistakes. Personally I am very happy that I didn’t go deep on any Bordeaux because I’ve found other areas I prefer. It might work out, but hindsight is easy - so just make sure those decisions comes from your own taste and not others.
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@LasseK I’m only about a year in so I definitely don’t have a clear idea of where my tastes will end up yet. My goal in creating a baseline cellar is to explore the benefits of aging. To your point, I will try to achieve as much diversity as I can with a small cellar so I expect to add as much Rioja and Mosel Riesling as right bank Bordeaux. To avoid muddying this thread any further with my inexpert questions, I’ve split further discussion of my particular case study into a separate thread so those who are interested can follow along:
If you have not tried mature Bordeaux before, not a bad idea to grab a few or go to a tasting where mature Bordeaux are being sampled, to see how these align with your tastes.
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I have not tried what I imagine you’d consider mature Bordeaux before. Unfortunately, there aren’t a lot of opportunities to sample mature Bordeaux in Maine, as far as I know, so I’ll likely need to order them and perhaps trek down to Boston if I can find some events there. A couple of weeks ago I opened a bottle of 2018 Esperance de Trotanoy which was terrific so I should probably grab another couple of those and hold them for a few years. Apologies for opening it way too early 