What issue?
Just in case you were wondering, there’s some hope for price correction in the campaign . Larrivet Haut Brion Red release Ex Negoce lower than 21 with a delicious wine
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the London price is like 5% above what 2021 is available for atm. I dont have any release data for the 2021 ex-London, though.
A really nice wine indeed this year! The Cabernet Franc gives it real aromatic complexity.
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There is hope!
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Clos de sarpe out 20% up against 2020. Don’t have a 2021 release price anywhere to hand.
21 apparently 267/6
Currency?
GBP, apologies. Ex London in bond.
A question for the critics here - I’m curious what your opinions are about the pricing for these specific wines. Is it in line with what you expected? Better or worse?
Not asking about a comparison to historic vintages as that is a bit loaded but just wondering about the absolute pricing
Bordeaux is an open market for most of its wines. That means consumers are aware of many things. You know, or can figure out the production. You know the price to the trade and from the trade, and from there you can figure out the profit your merchant is making.
What’s fair to a consumer is not the same as what’s fair to an owner.
There is no price low enough to satisfy a consumer and no price high enough to make an owner happy.
If a wine sells first to the trade and then to consumers, it was priced correctly. If a wine fails to sell, it was priced too high and will be discontinued.
If a wine goes up in price too quickly, the chateau priced it wrong, as they should have participated in that price.
Lastly, almost no wines are sold in tranches. Most chateau release the majority of the wine they want to sell at the same time. Only a few brands, primarily the First Growths sell in tranches.
FWIW, while I like Larrivet a lot this year, it’s a best ever for me. But Larrivet, Clos des Sarle and Senejac, out today, and Clos de Bouard released yesterday do not set a pattern. They are not a harbinger of anything.
Also, this board is not relevant and does not represent the world market. Bordeaux is sold in over 90 different countries. That’s relevant when it comes to pricing.
Back to editing today. 250 down and 400 more to go.
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I’m just curious if this was in line with your personal expectations, above or below. Nothing more than that. I’m comfortable with, and get everything youve said here - but from the comments here at least privately youve probably got some expectations of what the increases are, so I was just curious how this was going against your expectations as an expert in the domain
Honestly, I have no idea what to think. A lot depends on their yields which are often lower on the Left Bank, their scores from at least a few noted writers and brand awareness of the specific wine.
If I had a crystal ball, or even a magic 8 ball, I’d tell you. Anyone that says they have one is lying.
Cheval Blanc comes out next week, that’s some guidance for The Right Bank.
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Okay, understood, thanks. I think as guidance at least you’ve said Larrivet is their best ever wine.
Even back then the “Charmes” was selling for hundreds per bottle. The non specific Gevrey Chambertin was possibly sold for that price, but everyone knew about how special the " Charmes" specific vineyard was by 2019. You might want to check the label. If you got it for $65 then that was the steal of the century, and the retailer must have been oblivious to the market…
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My guess is Larrivet sells or not, but it won’t move much in price in the short term regardless. But if it’s someones favorite wine, or if they love that style, that’s one thing.
Most wines should not induce FOMO.
Yeah, I wasn’t looking at it from an “investment” perspective, just trying to interpret the price move alongside the score to understand if this is just a jump in price anyway or if they’ve smashed it out the park and the QPR is better than normal etc.
Did a quick check, Panzer offered the 2019 Charmes for $849 per bottle, the regular GC was $129. I doubt the price jumped in 2017 from $65 to the 2019 at $849. And Rob is not a price gouger.
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I looked again. You are right. I was looking at the GC VV. I read his post as GC Vv for some reason. 
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With price you need to keep in mind that yields, (with some estates down 30-40%) will make a big difference in setting their price. Brand awareness matters. A hot, in-demand brand that sells in 90 countries can obtain a higher margin. But, the price of a neighbor can also change your plan, up, or down.
And scores, will come into play. Wines with high scores, especially those with scores above 2020 from some of the better-known palates will be able to increase their price. And there is the current market price for similar quality back vintages that factors in as well. That does not mean because a few stores have remaining bottles or cases. It is the ability to purchase wine in quantities for wholesale that is the price.
Prices are not arrived at by throwing darts at a board.
This is why you can’t extrapolate much from single wines. You need to look at this on a wine-by-wine basis.
As for Larrivet, yields were 40 hectoliters per hectare, with 38% being placed into the Grand Vin.
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Oh I know/knew all that. I wasn’t just extrapolating on the basis of one price that that’d be a uniform increase across the board, but it is some data, and we’ve had no actual data yet.
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