One month from today, my wife and I celebrate our 10yr wedding anniversary. We have dinner reservations at TFL that night as it has always been a bucket list item for both of us. Since neither of us has been there, I would appreciate any tips from TFL veterans.
-Just how much food are we really talking here?
-I keep hearing about upgrades (wagyu, truffle, caviar). Which ones are worth the splurge?
-$150 corkage…I was really hoping to bring a nice bottle of Salon to pop that evening but their corkage policy restricts any outside wine that is already sold on their wine list. Looks like the Salon is a no-go then. Really seeking some advice here in terms of how to make the most out of ordering off their list without needing to tap into my HELOC.
Based on what I know about the food, it seems one would be best to focus on whites or light reds. And I don’t see a pairing option, so that has me thinking of ordering by the glass or perhaps 2 half bottles. Advice needed
-Food is already paid for since they do a ticketing system, and I understand it includes all taxes and gratuities. But what happens if I order upgrades and/or wine? Does the bill come out the same (“all-in”), or do I need to add on top of that?
-Any tips for getting a tour of the kitchen or possibly meeting Keller himself if he is in? I do plan to mention the whole anniversary thing when they call to confirm 2 weeks out, so maybe that will be enough.
I’ve eaten there 3x but the last time was probably 15+ years ago. Assuming nothing has changed, it’s a remarkably romantic and special meal. Don’t hesitate to ask for a tour of the kitchen. Again, it was a long time ago, but we never did any of the upgrades. The meals themselves without any “upgrades” were special enough.
We’ve also eaten at Per Se when it first opened. Another remarkable meal that came with a tour of the kitchen (all we had to do was ask).
We’ve been fortunate to go to TFL many times, the last this past March. Mike is dead on that it’s a romantic and special meal. I also find the service incredibly friendly – and my biggest recommendation to first-timers is to have fun and share your enthusiasm for the food and the experience with the staff. They love it as much as you do. It makes it all the more fun. The kitchen is still doing very special things, I think, and the service is stunning. It’s my favorite place in the world to eat.
The wine list online is totally up-to-date.
The foie gras and truffles are always worth it. The wagyu and caviar supplements are both excellent, but I recommend them only if they’re a special favorite ingredient of yours.
Haven’t been since switching to Tock, but I imagine you’ll get the same laundry ticket with the full check and then a bill for just the remaining balance of any additional items – supplements, wines, etc. You also have the opportunity to make a donation to the Bocuse d’Or program.
The somm team is superb. Erik is masterful. They have a wide array of half bottles – one of the most memorable times I’ve had there was just doing a tour of half bottles to go with the menu. It was exquisite. The wine list used to have some real Burgundy steals in places, but I’ve found that value has largely dried up. But if you’re in it to enjoy it, just go with what you like and keep it at a comfortable price. They have some great gems on the list, and they know what’s drinking well and pairs with the menu. I’ve had a lot of memorable, fun pairings there that were the result of the somms being so good.
I’m sure I’ll think of more, but happy to address any other questions! Also, just ask for a kitchen tour at the end, if you want. The new kitchen is a showpiece, and it is stunning.
We went last year. It’s hard to awnser your first question since I don’t know your preferences. We did both the truffle and cavier supplements and they were very good but the value is going to be different for each person. The wine list is nice but pricing is really out of control so the corkage still could work. We went off the list because we were on a multiple stop trip and didn’t want to lug wine around but would have brought if more convenient. They asked us if we wanted a tour of the cellar and kitchen so I’m sure if you ask they will do it.
Overall the FL felt a bit boring/old fashioned to us but I can see the draw for others depending on what you are looking for.
I have been there twice. Once was great the second time a major disappointment. My best Keller experience was at Per Se when they 1st opened up.
The corkage has gone up substantially in the last few years. That said I think it still is smart to BYO at $150. I notice no Kistler Pinot single vineyards, only one Aubert single vineyard, and no Schrader.
Of course you can drink the Mexican wine for $95!
Enjoy and congratulations!
This is such a constant challenge in restaurants, in particular, I think. What was once the upstart becomes canonical. I remember in Bill Addison’s review of Per Se a couple years ago, he was complaining about how tired some of the dishes were because they were what you’d find on any menu around the country – like the Elysian Field Lamb. I chuckled when I read that because, well, that’s what happens when you pioneer something and then it becomes something everyone wants to imitate.
Put another way, TFL reached a point at which it became the gold standard. So the choice for Thomas Keller, in part, is do you constantly chase the dragon and reinvent yourself? Or do you say, you know what, we do something that’s amazingly good, and this is what I want to do. I think he’s chosen the latter – and set the restaurant up for the time when he’s no longer there … that will be when it’s someone else’s turn to set his or her own bar and chase it.
I don’t necessarily think that’s resting on his laurels because the quality is so high. But it’s not cutting edge in the way it was 20 years ago. That’s for the likes of Alinea now. But, at some point, Alinea will seem “old fashioned.” There will always be the “new” places, but I like when somewhere ascends to “canon” status, and I think it would be foolish for Thomas Keller to try to do something different … then it would just feel like he’s not being true to himself.
I was able to go to TFL recently but had a much more equivocal experience than a lot of you. I read a lot of the posts here on the restaurant and appreciated the notes, but for those who are considering going in the future, I’d seriously reconsider it, and consider trying some of the other michelin 3-stars in the SF/bay area instead.
Things started off on the wrong foot when we arrived; the front of the house was borderline rude, giving us an incredulous look when we requested non-flute glasses for sparkling wine. We were part of a larger group and had what was probably the last seating at 8:45pm, but were seated late and the overall experience felt very rushed, inappropriately so for such an expensive and rarefied dining experience. Our table in the upstairs dining room was crammed tight and there was barely space for the servers to reach the dishes/cutlery in the corner when clearing courses. We had barely sat down before we were served the starting canapes, and were already given the pearls and oyster dish before we had a chance to request a discussion with the sommelier about our wine choices. Many of the dishes tasted overseasoned/salted and unbalanced, and incomprehensibly, we were not offered most of the supplements – they comped the foie dish but otherwise did not offer the langoustine or wagyu (which were, funnily enough, listed on the printed menu they gave us at the end), I’m guessing because it was so late and they wanted us to get out of there.
Overall I still enjoyed the experience overall because of the company, but for a restaurant that some people discuss as one of the country’s best, this was a disconcerting and very dissatisfying experience. For a restaurant that demands a lot of its customers via price and time and effort to make it there, I expected much more. Would tread cautiously if considering going there, especially for your first time.
I was at the recent dinner with Fred O. and second his assessment of the meal. The food was good but not memorable and couldn’t make up for the poor service. Note that we may have had an unusually poor experience because it appeared the the prior seating at our table left late and, as Fred noted, they appeared to be trying to rush our dinner so they could clean up the kitchen and go home on time. That might also explain why a couple of our later dishes came out room temperature/slightly cold when they should have hot.
As to David’s more specific questions (as he has already booked and paid for the meal so can’t rebook elsewhere), the only one of the supplements we were offered was the foie gras, which is a definite pass. It is a foie gras mousse, not a lobe, and wasn’t something I would pay extra for (as Fred noted, they comped us this dish because they sat us so late).
The somm was good. We gave a budget per person and asked him to arrange a pairing with the meal within that budget. Other than having to arrange wine service after we were already two courses in, this worked well for us as we were a table of 7. Obviously you’re not going to get as many different wines if there are just two of you. They focus on half-bottles for pairings so that helps. I think that the budget we gave was $200-$250 per person for wine. The somm noted that that is a typical range for them to work with.
David, I hope that your dinner is better than was ours. This was long planned for us as well and overall was a disappointment, even ignoring the cost. Once cost is considered, I could not recommend the restaurant to anyone else.
On a more positive note, Fred chose The Charter Oak for lunch the next day, which was excellent. Very comfortable room, pleasant service, and delicious, interesting food. Highly recommended and I would really like to return for dinner.
My one visit was about 15 years ago but I saw no need for supplements. It was a special meal without them and the quantity of food was far more than enough.
Wine list is much pricier than it was back then. Here is what caught my eye at not totally outrageous prices. Personally I’d probably go with a bottle of the Bereche Rive Gauche, one of my favorite Champagnes.
375s -
Nigl, Grüner Veltliner, “Senftenberger Pellingen - Privat,” Kremstal 2014 85
Huet, “Le Haut Lieu,” Sec, Vouvray 2014 85
Ridge, “Lytton Springs,” Dry Creek Valley 2015 65
I was talking to a friend about the French Laundry the other day. It is his favorite restaurant in the world and he has dinned there 5 times. It’s also the only 3 star he has ever been too. I think that is a key point as with most things experience gives you perspective. When we went to TFL we already had a lot of experience eating around the world. So to us there was nothing different or unique about the experience. That said, I can still see the draw for even very experienced dinners. Some like that warm hug of a classic high end French meal. While it wouldn’t be our first choice next time we are in the area, it still has a lot to offer and the venue and location has a certain charm that no doubt adds to the overall experience.