Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

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G. Curd
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Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#1 Post by G. Curd » June 26th, 2020, 1:11 pm

Hello all. newhere I am fairly new to international wine and have typically bought most of my wine via online/wine store/commercial purchases. I have an allocation at Aubert and Ridge, but they are domestic. I was wondering how one purchases international wines at release (I live in the US). I have never really dealt with this topic. I have really enjoyed all of JJ Prum wines that I have tried and I have purchased about 30 bottles of back vintages to get started. However, I wanted to start purchasing at release. This time around I used JJ Buckley as they have a wide range of 2018 JJ Prum wines. My question is probably a very silly one to many of the people who have been into wine awhile, but I thought I would ask anyways: Is there a importer or distributor that sells Joh Jos Prum or should I just stick to buying via websites? There aren't any local places here in Indiana that know much about these wines so I thought I would use the wisdom of the wine berserkers. I checked the JJ Prum "website", but there isn't much there. I found a place in Oregon that gets a decent amount of new stuff, but they don't ship to Indiana. If the question is a stupid one feel free to brutal as you would like :). Thanks for the help everyone.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#2 Post by Marshall Manning » June 26th, 2020, 2:00 pm

Prum used to have two US official importers, Rudi Wiest and Valckenberg. Wiest's web site isn't up, so I don't know if they still have Prum or not. But you don't normally buy wine directly from the importer. They have distributors in various states and then the distributors sell to retailers and restaurants. Your best bet is finding a retailer near you who carries the wines. The new releases are not hard to find, just check Wine Searcher...I'm sure there have to be places in the Midwest or East Coast that will ship to you.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#3 Post by G. Curd » June 26th, 2020, 2:15 pm

Marshall Manning wrote:
June 26th, 2020, 2:00 pm
Prum used to have two US official importers, Rudi Wiest and Valckenberg. Wiest's web site isn't up, so I don't know if they still have Prum or not. But you don't normally buy wine directly from the importer. They have distributors in various states and then the distributors sell to retailers and restaurants. Your best bet is finding a retailer near you who carries the wines. The new releases are not hard to find, just check Wine Searcher...I'm sure there have to be places in the Midwest or East Coast that will ship to you.
That's basically what I thought through my "research". I just wanted to make sure. Thanks for your help Marshall. Unfortunately we don't have any great retailer near me in Indiana that I have found yet. I am sure there will be something in the Chicago area or Cincinnati.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#4 Post by Robert Dentice » June 26th, 2020, 2:36 pm

The short answer for wines like Prum the cost and hassle to import directly is not worth it in comparison to just buying from a retailer in the U.S.

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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#5 Post by Gabe Berk » June 26th, 2020, 2:50 pm

I've been looking for Emrich-Schönleber upon release every year and seem to strike out all the time. I used to sell the their wine for a distributor years back, but have the hardest time finding any new releases. Probably my favorite Riesling producer.

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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#6 Post by G. Curd » June 26th, 2020, 3:13 pm

Yeah that is what I thought the answer would be Robert. I just hoped there was some secret I hadn’t been told yet 😀.

That stinks Gabe. This is why we need a direct to consumer importer/distributor. However, as Robert said it’s likely just not financially feasible.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#7 Post by Anthony C » June 26th, 2020, 3:17 pm

I like Prum's stuff, but I have resigned to just get it when my local wine guy gets it in his store. Sadly not as often as I'd like :(
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#8 Post by Curtis Chen » June 26th, 2020, 3:22 pm

I used to find the Himmelreich/Wehlener Kab pretty easily at local stores, but in the past two years or so, the supply has dried up significantly. Dunno why.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#9 Post by Marshall Manning » June 26th, 2020, 3:42 pm

Just did a search and found this earlier thread about Rudi Wiest going bankrupt, so it wouldn't surprise me if it's more difficult to get German wines in the US until someone else picks up the slack:

viewtopic.php?t=168171
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#10 Post by Brian S t o t t e r » June 26th, 2020, 4:48 pm

Gavin, it shouldn't be too hard to find JJ Prum from retailers in the U.S. and as others have said, it's too much of a hassle to try to get around the three-tier system to get their wines.

I know you're new in your wine journey, particularly with riesling, but don't forget there are other producers to try as well :)
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2017 Goodfellow Family Cellars Durant Vineyard Chardonnay
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#11 Post by Howard Cooper » June 26th, 2020, 6:31 pm

Howard

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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#12 Post by G. Curd » June 26th, 2020, 9:25 pm

Brian S t o t t e r wrote:
June 26th, 2020, 4:48 pm
Gavin, it shouldn't be too hard to find JJ Prum from retailers in the U.S. and as others have said, it's too much of a hassle to try to get around the three-tier system to get their wines.

I know you're new in your wine journey, particularly with riesling, but don't forget there are other producers to try as well :)
I have had decent success finding it online, I was just wondering if there was a more direct way. Must vintages are definitely available for a price.

I definitely need to taste more from different producers. I get a little ocd when I like something. I wanted to back fill my collection JJ prum to start bc I know I enjoy it and have somewhat limited funds. You are 100% correct that I need to try other producers. I plan on trying to find a tasting event or join a group locally. I am early in the journey so I have a lot to learn. Everyone has been super helpful on here. There are several you mentioned on a prior topic and/or pm that I plan on picking up a half bottle and trying. Thanks to everyone for all the help.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#13 Post by Rich K0rz€nk0 » June 26th, 2020, 9:49 pm

Brian S t o t t e r wrote:
June 26th, 2020, 4:48 pm
Gavin, it shouldn't be too hard to find JJ Prum from retailers in the U.S. and as others have said, it's too much of a hassle to try to get around the three-tier system to get their wines.

I know you're new in your wine journey, particularly with riesling, but don't forget there are other producers to try as well :)
This, and while there is a ton to love about JJ, there are many others to indulge, from the "other" Prüm, Keller, Müller, Dönnhoff... taste often and long.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#14 Post by Jay Miller » June 27th, 2020, 1:54 pm

Is Salil reading this board anymore?

If anyone has figured out how to buy JJ Prum in Indiana I'm sure it would be him.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#15 Post by lleichtman » June 27th, 2020, 2:09 pm

G. Curd wrote:
June 26th, 2020, 9:25 pm
Brian S t o t t e r wrote:
June 26th, 2020, 4:48 pm
Gavin, it shouldn't be too hard to find JJ Prum from retailers in the U.S. and as others have said, it's too much of a hassle to try to get around the three-tier system to get their wines.

I know you're new in your wine journey, particularly with riesling, but don't forget there are other producers to try as well :)
I have had decent success finding it online, I was just wondering if there was a more direct way. Must vintages are definitely available for a price.

I definitely need to taste more from different producers. I get a little ocd when I like something. I wanted to back fill my collection JJ prum to start bc I know I enjoy it and have somewhat limited funds. You are 100% correct that I need to try other producers. I plan on trying to find a tasting event or join a group locally. I am early in the journey so I have a lot to learn. Everyone has been super helpful on here. There are several you mentioned on a prior topic and/or pm that I plan on picking up a half bottle and trying. Thanks to everyone for all the help.
They are certainly worth the price but if you want to buy it directly from them, I would suggest going to Germany when and if we are allowed back.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#16 Post by G. Curd » June 27th, 2020, 2:22 pm

Jay Miller wrote:
June 27th, 2020, 1:54 pm
Is Salil reading this board anymore?

If anyone has figured out how to buy JJ Prum in Indiana I'm sure it would be him.
Another user also recommended I speak to him. I wrote him a PM, but he hasn't responded yet. I would love to meet him.


Lawrence- I would absolutely love to do that. I do plan on visiting the Mosel area of Germany once the kiddos are a bit older and I will definitely be coming home with plenty of vino from multiple producers there. I have a feeling the majority might by JJ, but time will tell where my palate goes.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#17 Post by David_K » June 27th, 2020, 2:30 pm

JJ Prum is great but don't ignore other producers. The Mosel is blessed with an extraordinary number of top flight sites and growers. While JJ is about as good as it gets, there are others that are as good in a variety of styles.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#18 Post by John Morris » June 27th, 2020, 2:55 pm

Marshall Manning wrote:
June 26th, 2020, 3:42 pm
Just did a search and found this earlier thread about Rudi Wiest going bankrupt, so it wouldn't surprise me if it's more difficult to get German wines in the US until someone else picks up the slack:

viewtopic.php?t=168171https://www.wineb ... um/ucp.php
Prum's wines are very widely available, and the sort-of successor to Wiest's company, The German Wine Co., is importing and distributing Prum in California: https://thegwc.com/portfolio/
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#19 Post by John Morris » June 27th, 2020, 2:57 pm

G. Curd wrote:
June 26th, 2020, 1:11 pm
Hello all. newhere I am fairly new to international wine and have typically bought most of my wine via online/wine store/commercial purchases. I have an allocation at Aubert and Ridge, but they are domestic. I was wondering how one purchases international wines at release (I live in the US). I have never really dealt with this topic. I have really enjoyed all of JJ Prum wines that I have tried and I have purchased about 30 bottles of back vintages to get started. However, I wanted to start purchasing at release. This time around I used JJ Buckley as they have a wide range of 2018 JJ Prum wines. My question is probably a very silly one to many of the people who have been into wine awhile, but I thought I would ask anyways: Is there a importer or distributor that sells Joh Jos Prum or should I just stick to buying via websites? There aren't any local places here in Indiana that know much about these wines so I thought I would use the wisdom of the wine berserkers. I checked the JJ Prum "website", but there isn't much there. I found a place in Oregon that gets a decent amount of new stuff, but they don't ship to Indiana. If the question is a stupid one feel free to brutal as you would like :). Thanks for the help everyone.
FYI, in most states, importers and distributors can't sell to consumers. Only retailers can.
"English doesn't just borrow foreign words, it stalks languages down dark alleyways, knocks them over and then rifles their pockets for new words." -- @Another NPC on YouTube

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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#20 Post by Sarah Kirschbaum » June 27th, 2020, 3:03 pm

Gabe Berk wrote:
June 26th, 2020, 2:50 pm
I've been looking for Emrich-Schönleber upon release every year and seem to strike out all the time. I used to sell the their wine for a distributor years back, but have the hardest time finding any new releases. Probably my favorite Riesling producer.
Where are you located Gabe? On the east coast, at least, I believe Sussex still brings some in for Moore Brothers, which doesn't show up on Wine Searcher. They don't bring in a lot of the high level stuff, but they usually get some. Emrich-Schonleber is second only to Keller in our cellar and our hearts (and sometimes not even there).

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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#21 Post by G. Curd » June 27th, 2020, 4:09 pm

I can't wait to try some of these other suggestions like Emrich-Schonleber, Keller, etc. Brian Stotter sent me a great list of other producers as well. It will take a little bit of time to try them all, but I think I am up to the challenge :). I have had Dr. Loosen, Dr Heidemanns , and some of the other more easily accessible Rieslings, but definitely haven't even navigated past the tip of the ice burg.

John- Thanks for verifying that for me. I was mostly aware distributors don't typically sell to consumers, but I honestly wasn't fully sure. I didn't know if there was a specific retailer or store that I should stick to for Prum and other Rieslings or if there was another method I was unaware of as a relative newby. Everyone has been very helpful.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#22 Post by Howard Cooper » June 27th, 2020, 5:14 pm

G. Curd wrote:
June 27th, 2020, 4:09 pm
I can't wait to try some of these other suggestions like Emrich-Schonleber, Keller, etc. Brian Stotter sent me a great list of other producers as well. It will take a little bit of time to try them all, but I think I am up to the challenge :). I have had Dr. Loosen, Dr Heidemanns , and some of the other more easily accessible Rieslings, but definitely haven't even navigated past the tip of the ice burg.

John- Thanks for verifying that for me. I was mostly aware distributors don't typically sell to consumers, but I honestly wasn't fully sure. I didn't know if there was a specific retailer or store that I should stick to for Prum and other Rieslings or if there was another method I was unaware of as a relative newby. Everyone has been very helpful.
There are a few stores around that have a good selection of German wines. One is in DC called MacArthurs Liquors. Their German wine "guy", Phil Bernstein really knows German wines and is very passionate about them. Another store that has a good selection of German wines is Crush in NYC. I think Flickingers in Chicago used to have German wines, but I have not looked for a while.

If you want to stick with Mosel wines, a couple of my favorites other than Prum are Schloss Lieser and Reinhold Haart. Keeping in a somewhat similar theme, but a bit cooler and even more precise, go to the Saar and the Ruwer and try Zilliken and von Schubert (Maximin Grunhaus). Having read Brian's posts for a while, my guess is that he recommended some of these, in addition to other producers. Going outside the MSR, I had a very nice Spatlese last night from Schafer Frohlich from the Nahe.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#23 Post by G. Curd » June 27th, 2020, 5:50 pm

Howard Cooper wrote:
June 27th, 2020, 5:14 pm
G. Curd wrote:
June 27th, 2020, 4:09 pm
I can't wait to try some of these other suggestions like Emrich-Schonleber, Keller, etc. Brian Stotter sent me a great list of other producers as well. It will take a little bit of time to try them all, but I think I am up to the challenge :). I have had Dr. Loosen, Dr Heidemanns , and some of the other more easily accessible Rieslings, but definitely haven't even navigated past the tip of the ice burg.

John- Thanks for verifying that for me. I was mostly aware distributors don't typically sell to consumers, but I honestly wasn't fully sure. I didn't know if there was a specific retailer or store that I should stick to for Prum and other Rieslings or if there was another method I was unaware of as a relative newby. Everyone has been very helpful.
There are a few stores around that have a good selection of German wines. One is in DC called MacArthurs Liquors. Their German wine "guy", Phil Bernstein really knows German wines and is very passionate about them. Another store that has a good selection of German wines is Crush in NYC. I think Flickingers in Chicago used to have German wines, but I have not looked for a while.

If you want to stick with Mosel wines, a couple of my favorites other than Prum are Schloss Lieser and Reinhold Haart. Keeping in a somewhat similar theme, but a bit cooler and even more precise, go to the Saar and the Ruwer and try Zilliken and von Schubert (Maximin Grunhaus). Having read Brian's posts for a while, my guess is that he recommended some of these, in addition to other producers. Going outside the MSR, I had a very nice Spatlese last night from Schafer Frohlich from the Nahe.
Thanks so much Howard! I would really love to try Rieslings from all different vineyards and areas of Germany. I am interested in trying all of these at some point. I will keep you posted on which ones I find and try. Thanks again for being so kind to list these for me and for sharing these places to look for Rieslings.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#24 Post by Patrick T a y l o r » June 27th, 2020, 9:01 pm

G. Curd wrote:
June 26th, 2020, 1:11 pm
Hello all. newhere I am fairly new to international wine and have typically bought most of my wine via online/wine store/commercial purchases. There aren't any local places here in Indiana that know much about these wines...
Where are you in Indiana? I am west of Indianapolis. Feel free to send me a private message.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#25 Post by John Davis » June 29th, 2020, 5:28 am

PM me. I may be able to help.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#26 Post by Matthew Brown » June 29th, 2020, 6:31 am

You may want to be proactive and speak with stores about special ordering, especially if you are looking for specific bottlings. Most of the time retailers are offered a list of wines they can pick from once their importers have compiled their orders for their territory. There may be 6-8 weeks to potentially get orders in before they arrive, depending, and there may be some wines that don’t sell through or are more common that are considered ‘stock’ items they intend to have on hand. But for more limited or highly rated items, the numbers are finite, and if the distributor gets 20 cases of something for say the Chicago market and 20 accounts order a case each off the pre-arrival, that’s it. They can’t go back for more. If you get with a retailer about these wines before they are offered, they can let you know when and what is being offered. They may only pick up 2-3 labels for the store to carry based on what works for them cost or interest-wise, but you may be able to get 3-4 other things for yourself.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#27 Post by Curtis Chen » June 30th, 2020, 9:52 pm

Some 2018 JJ Prum just got listed at K&L Wines for special order. Wines will be available within a week. Pricey though. Hoping they pop up at other local stores for less.

https://klwines.com/Products?filters=sv ... c&limit=50
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#28 Post by Robert Panzer » July 2nd, 2020, 7:21 am

My 2019 offer is in the pipeline.....coming soon......
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#29 Post by DanielP » July 2nd, 2020, 7:24 am

Curtis Chen wrote:
June 30th, 2020, 9:52 pm
Some 2018 JJ Prum just got listed at K&L Wines for special order. Wines will be available within a week. Pricey though. Hoping they pop up at other local stores for less.

https://klwines.com/Products?filters=sv ... c&limit=50
How did those sell out at those prices? WS spat for $50? Wine.com is cheaper and they don't exactly list bargain prices.
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#30 Post by Brian S t o t t e r » July 2nd, 2020, 7:19 pm

Robert Panzer wrote:
July 2nd, 2020, 7:21 am
My 2019 offer is in the pipeline.....coming soon......
[wow.gif] champagne.gif
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2020 contenders for WOTY:
2017 Goodfellow Family Cellars Durant Vineyard Chardonnay
2015 Laherte Frères Champagne Blanc des Blancs Extra Brut Les Grands Crayeres
2001 Joh. Jos. Prum Wehlener Sonnenuhr Riesling Spätlese
2015 Josef Walter Hundsruck Spätburgunder "J"

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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#31 Post by G. Curd » July 3rd, 2020, 8:16 am

My 2019 offer is in the pipeline.....coming soon......
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#32 Post by G. Curd » July 3rd, 2020, 8:35 am

DanielP wrote:
July 2nd, 2020, 7:24 am
Curtis Chen wrote:
June 30th, 2020, 9:52 pm
Some 2018 JJ Prum just got listed at K&L Wines for special order. Wines will be available within a week. Pricey though. Hoping they pop up at other local stores for less.

https://klwines.com/Products?filters=sv ... c&limit=50
How did those sell out at those prices? WS spat for $50? Wine.com is cheaper and they don't exactly list bargain prices.
I was wondering the same thing. I looked at it and is seemed a bit pricey for what I have purchased recently. K&L doesn't ship to me anyways :(
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Re: Importer of Joh Jos Prum. How to buy on release?

#33 Post by Bob G » July 3rd, 2020, 12:59 pm

Cutting Edge Selections in Cincinnati is the distributor for JJ Prum. They distributed for Rudi Wiest and now for the German Wine Collection, the current importer. I'm sure they could hook you up with a retailer who could get in what you want. I don't get out to local retailers much any more but I used to buy Prum at The Party Source in Bellvue, KY.
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