When I started this Commission/Ringer discussion, it was just a guess based on its description. While I’m not 100% sure, it does make sense to have same wine with two different label, coming from my 25+ years of marketing background.
@David Crow, you and I are separated with just a letter in our last name. Haha. Anyways, you mentioned you like The Ringer as well. How would you rate this compared to the 2018 Editorial and Yesterday (Oakville), assuming you purchased them and tasted them already?
Yes, I’ve tried all three wines, Editorial, Yesterday, and the Ringer, although not side by side so making real comparisons is difficult. I would say all definitely seem very high quality and are excellent values. Editorial and Ringer seemed somewhat similar in that both struck me as very elegant and refined and big wines without being too over the top in any way.
I tried Yesterday twice. First was a Coravin pour that was pretty disappointing as it seemed a bit thin and I just didn’t get much from it. The second time I tried it I uncorked the same bottle I had previously Coravined and it seemed like a completely different wine. Much bigger with rich oak notes present. It reminded me very much of a Tor Tierra Roja Vineyard cab I’d had a while back. Definitely high quality but the prominent oak made it feel different than the Editorial and Ringer to me, which seemed more integrated and elegant.
I also just tried a 2017 Radio Silence (which I’m 99% sure is Realm fruit) and it was probably my favorite of all. I tried it alongside a 2018 Rivers Marie Napa Cab that had just arrived and they seemed very similar. I’d give the nod to the Rivers Marie, but both were fantastic wines, probably a bit more fruit forward than the Editorial and Ringer, but still very balanced.
I’d also say I’ve tried a number of De Negoce wines (#s 2, 5, 21, 42) and while they have been solid wines for the price I paid, none have been anywhere near as good as the Wine Access wines I’ve tried. That’s just my personal view, and these are all very young wines, but the Wine Access wines seem more complete and just taste more expensive while the De Negoce wines have seemed a bit disjointed. That being said, the DN wines are about half the price or less than the wine access wines, and at the price I’ve paid I’d say all are a solid value, but I wish I didn’t have to buy the DN wines by the case.
Having worked bottling many times, I can assure you bottling the exact same wine under many labels is quite common. I’ve seen the same identical wine get bottled under as many as 4 different labels.
I can think of some burgundy wines that does this.
I’d have love to try Radio Silence, but I passed on it. So between the other three, I prefer The Ringer for its elegant style. Yesterday comes in second, and Editorial is my least favorite. If I didn’t have 1.5 case of The Ringer and have storage space, I would definitely buy at least 1/2 case of Commission…also waiting to see what other wines WA will carry from now until end of the year.
Never purchased De Negoce wines. I’m quite happy with WA for their selection and as many have also stated, for their customer service.
Yes, I said the same winery. Not to be sold for different supermarkets/resellers as private labels. I’m sure happens all the time for lower priced wine. Anyway, this one is not. In the description they even say the label was commissioned for the winemaker. Why wouldn’t he commission THE RINGER label too?
lol @ this conversation. Why doesn’t someone just ask WineAccess? Then we can stop debating it. NOT IT
here is a new one, 2017 arlaud vosne romanee aux reas: 2017 Cyprien Arlaud Vosne-Romanée Aux Réas
in case you need a referral…price is pretty sharp when combined with amex promo
Well known occurrence in the industry. Happens especially in the bulk wine market (bottling several different brands out of the same tank). Can even happen when a winery bottles their own wine as two different things (think anniversary wines and “special release” wines - very often these are the exact same as something else available under a cheaper sku).
Anyway I emailed WineAccess and will report back. I totally agree can happen in Bulk Market and cheaper wines but I don’t see why for same retail outlet. Makes no sense here. I’m confident I will be proven right here that it’s not the same wine.
If someone higher up the ladder answered your email, then you may get a honest answer (though I highly doubt that)…but if it’s someone in customer service support answered, then he/she may not know at all and just deny they are the same.
They had no problem answering this question with YESTERDAY’s two labels no idea why they wouldn’t know. It also makes no sense why they would do this when RINGER sold out and they would love to sell more RINGER! There is no marketing logic to re-label it and pretend it’s a new offer.
Will - check your PMs please re our real names policy. Thanks.
Both were already on their “roadmap” to release on separate dates (I believe it was 2-3 weeks a part).
Ordered some Commission today (among others). Excited to try
If Commission Is the same as Ringer, they missed the mark on marketing for Ringer IMO. It seems highly, highly likely the fruit source is Bryant for both, but the winemaker for Ringer is - for all we know - an intern at Wine Access or some other mystery person.
They are telling you for Commission that the winemaker is Julian Fayard — a very well known winemaker in Napa whose own label sells for several times this price per bottle (and, frankly, I don’t think sources fruit from anywhere as noteworthy as Bryant). He actually makes a $200+ bottling from Pritchard Hill already from Sage Hill Vineyard. So this is either 1) The deal of the century 2) Younger vines or otherwise declassified grapes from Bryant (but if so, why would Fayard allow his name to be on the project?) 3) ??? Seriously I don’t really love options 1 or 2.
It’s a good point about why they would use Fayard’s name for the Commission but not for the Ringer. It’s just strange that the blend and alcohol is identical between the two wines.
I think the most likely option on the Commission has to be your option 2 (younger vines from Bryant or otherwise some declassified fruit). I think I remember Fayard has made another wines(s) for wine access before (I think called Idiosyncrasy) so he has a connection to them. And often winemakers will make wines at lower price points.
Is anyone aware of any active 100/300 links? I tried the one Mark M. posted over in the “coupon/deal” thread and get a “sorry/not eligible” message. I tried the “is offer/false” link and just get nothing, whether I try it with “limited time” wines or other wines - no discount, no message why there’s no discount, etc. I’ve scoured this thread and don’t see any others, but thought it might be worth asking.
I emailed Wine Access to ask if the Ringer and Commission were the same. Below is the response I received. I have very little confidence the person who responded knows the real answer. It looks like they just compared the tasting notes and descriptors.
“Hello David,
Thank you for reaching out to us. These wines are similar but are different wines. If you look at the sale bellow the Commission wine is a little more acidic than the Ringer. As well the descriptions of the wines are different.
2018 Commission Cabernet - Fruit Intensity 3- Oak Intensity 2 -Body 3-Acidity 2- Tannin 2
2018 The Ringer Cabernet- Fruit Intensity 3- Oak Intensity 2 -Body 3-Acidity 1- Tannin 2
Please let me know if I may be of additional help at this time.
Kind Regards,
Stormie”
Not surprising there. If it is the same (though I am not 100% sure), higher management has their own “NDA” from their support team.
Do you put a lot of stock in the descriptions they give with the rating of fruit / oak / body etc? I’ve seen multiple wines with a medium level oak intensity that see now oak… makes me question whether or not they are all just created with a random number generator.