They figure it out because those sugars remain in the product. Ragu really is sweeter than Prego. They also figure it out because at $1.49 a jar they can afford to taste it and see if it’s sweeter than they want (Ragu for me).
Wines with sugar listed will sometimes be the driest wine in a category. Wines with tartaric acid listed will sometimes be the lowest acid wine in the category.
And most assuredly wine won’t be $1.49 per jar.
Adam Lee
Siduri Wines
And now who is being obtuse.
Thanks Paul. Adam makes some good points. And again, how do you enforce this to keep everyone honest? I see that as the biggest challenge. Back when we made wine in a custom crush facility, I saw producers who marketed themselves as “natural” dumping sugar in tanks of under-ripe fruit. But it was vegan sugar so perhaps that’s okay. 
Another natural producer used MegaPurple just before bottling. How will you ever get wineries like this to admit it? Unfortunately I’m not sure you will.
Well Mike, we could divert federal inspectors away from meat processors, and instead have them hound winemakers. That seems like a good use of resources, doesn’t it?
An excellent use of resources David! Especially since people are in such danger of drinking wine! 
Seriously, after a thread like this, makes me want to enjoy a good bottle of wine without questioning how the end result was achieved. Think I’ll go for an '05 Keller Hubacker GG and then something hearty and red to go with the braised short ribs Kendall just started.
It’s fun to take a ‘back seat’ to folks like Adam and Mike - so much fun here in the peanut gallery!!!
I don’t think you’ll find any winemaker taking part in THIS discussion trying to pull the wool over anyone’s eyes or trying to be deceitful. That is not necessarily the case across the entire industry - at all levels - and I stated that early on in the discussion.
I LOVE the concept of making ‘natural wines’ have to say’may contain much higher levels of ethyl acetate’ - BRILLIANT 
Cheers!
The point is that labels on wines are part of the process of educating the consumer. Giving up on that process because of the supposed “confusion” on the part of the supermarket buyer (just one of your many arguments, I know) seems defeatist not to mention elitist. While I applaud transparency on winery websites (including yours) pitched to a specialist, wine-buying niche, that is not going to help the vast wine buying public who pick up their wine in the supermarket.
I’m drinking the 2009 Foillard Morgon 3.14, and I want to know why he felt the need to add pi to the wine.
Well, other than ‘Mr K-J’, not sure you’re going to find many of our wines here at supermarkets 
![[snort.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/b/bdc3944606213c4dca6c1169cf0a166c8bc4f8c9.gif "snort.gif"){kind=small}
As far as ‘educating the consumer’ goes, I think that you are barking up the wrong tree with the winemakers who are active on this board for the most part. I think we go out of our way, sometimes to our detriment, about being wide open what we do and why we do it in the making of our products.
I don’t think that’s the issue - I think the big issue is ‘defining’ what would ‘have to’ be on the label, what ‘should’ be on the label, etc - as a means of ‘educating the consumer’ . . .
Cheers!
Around and around we go.
Hopefully it was cherry pi!
LOL! Right you are Matt. I had totally forgotten about that thread. And many of the same participants. If nothing else, I guess we’re consistent in our convictions.
The goal of ingredient labeling should not be to educate the consumer on winemaking (they can do that on their own if they choose). Like other ingredient labels, it should be to inform the consumer of what they are putting in their body.
Hardy,
But what if what’s on the label is actually ‘NOT’ in the wine itself . . . If you’ve sterile filtered the wine, are there any yeast cells in it?? And if you’ve fined your wine with ‘X’ but you rack off the remnants and it does not remain in, do you have to put it in there?
When you purchase beef, are they required to list all of the food that the specific cow that that cut of meat came from ate during its lifetime? Perhaps some do, but I’m not aware of it - nor does the government require you to do so . . .
Cheers
Grass fed beef no doubt involves bugs, some level of cow poop and various other things. Imagine putting that on a label.
Hardy,
Forgive me, I am not aware of this answer, but is that something you are doing on your labels? I looked on the website, but couldn’t tell from it if it is on the labels.
If so, how are you deciding what you do and don’t list?
Adam Lee
Siduri Wines
I’m not an expert on winemaking or wine regulation, but as a tax lawyer, I have more than a passing familiarity with the difficulty of drafting clear statutes and the unintended consequences that can follow even well-drafted laws and regulations. I have no objection to voluntary labeling or taking action against false or misleading labeling, both of which pose no problem under current law.
That leads me to questions that I think anyone who thinks a law should be passed should consider first, not just those in favor of mandatory ingredient labeling of wine.
What is the specific problem you are trying to solve?
What are the likely costs and consequences of doing nothing, and who bears those costs and suffers the consequences? What are the likely costs and consequences of the proposed solution and who bears those costs and suffers the consequences? What are the benefits of the proposed solution and who enjoys those benefits? To what extent can the proposed solution be used for rent-seeking or as a sword against competition or competitors?
Laws are easily passed but much harder to revise or replace, particularly when the burden if compliance isn’t widely spread. I haven’t seen anything that convinces me that there is any significant benefit to mandatory ingredient labeling for wine. If it matters, ask. If the producer won’t answer, but from someone else and encourage others to do the same. If enough people care, then wineries will do it voluntarily. If there anrem’t enough who care, it probably isn’t a big enough problem to justify forcing producers to do so. Also, keep in mind that the ingredients in wine are already heavily regulated and limited, so this this is a much narrower issue than it is with food in general.
carrying that thought a step further: wouldn’t the winery be responsible for identifying any kind of “-cide”…Pesti, Herbi, Fungi or otherwise…on said label? it’s part of the grape, and part of what’s in the wine. right?
I don’t think anyone is advocating holding wine labels to a higher standard than other food labels. It’s easy to come up with a bunch of edge cases, but other consumables presumably have answers.
Michael
I sorely doubt that even the standards for food would satisfy some folks around here.