What's wrong with cherry-picking?

WINE TALK
21

No reason to apologize at all, but I see absolutely no connection at all to your analogies. At a party I am a guest and I have to (want to) be considerate of my host and other guests. At an offline, the very purpose of being there is to share with friends. At a retailer I am a paying customer and I am only concerned about myself. There is zero connection between these circumstances.

22

Importers aren’t really able to cherry-pick producers. Just as if you purchase directly from a CA winery, I doubt you’d last long only buying the cherries and not the whole range (e.g. “hostage wines”).

Retailers are not able to cherry pick from wholesalers, because the wholesalers must buy an entire range of a portfolio from importers or producers in order to get the cherries from that portfolio.

There is nothing wrong, per se, with cherry picking; however, this is why the prices of the cherries get so high. So, if you think it is OK, then you can’t complain about being priced out of certain wines. It is a vicious cycle though and taken to its logical conclusion will create a world of cherries and loss leaders without much in between. Buy hey, isn’t that just late stage capitalism in a nutshell.

23

If importers or retailers could cherrypick, do you think they would?

24

Maybe. It wouldn’t be much of a business model, you need to have a whole range of wines to make a business. I think it would make the whole wine economy highly volatile and not much of a sustainable business for anyone.

25

When you go to buy a car, do you ask to see whatever the dealer hasn’t been able to move?

26

There is nothing wrong with cherry picking.

I only have so much money to spend on wine. I have a cellar that does not continue expanding like the universe. I can only drink so many bottles per week. That means I focus on the wines I want in my cellar from the producers I prefer, that were made in the vintages I favor.

Wines are priced at different levels, allowing everyone to be choosy with the wines they want to purchase and add to their cellars.

27

Are there really no relationship considerations? Don’t retailers/distributors/wineries/etc steer their most prized wines to their best customers?

28

Do people then have a problem with retailers putting together cases of wine from one producer reflecting what he, the retailer, has to buy in order to get a few cherries? Mix might include if we take Burgundy, Bourgogne, village wines, premier crus and a couple of cherry Grand Crus.

29

And the same could be said for a winery that offers a club offering of ‘sought after’ wines with others that they offer because they make them.

Please sit back and look at all scenarios folks . . .

Cheers.

30

Great way to offload otherwise unsellable wines to clueless people.

31

Not always so. Not even close. There are producers who make fine wines up and down the cru levels. Mugneret Gibourg is a great example, though maybe everything they make is now considered a “cherry.”

32

I don’t have a problem with it, but I wouldn’t buy those wines if I didn’t have to.

33

I feel that way about Fourrier which I buy at all levels. But I think you’re suggesting the exception rather than what Mark was thinking of. I.e, buy Olivier Bernstein if you want DRC.

34

Let’s turn this around a bit.

Let’s say that you’re on the SQN mailing list and you get your offer - and you say that you only want to get the syrah, because it got 100, but not the Grenache, because it only got 97. Do you think that Manfred would be cool with that, or do you need to take a ‘package’? And then let’s say you are allowed to do that but it’s noted - and next year, when the wines are offered again and you want both because they’re now 100 points, SQN says sorry, you can only get 1 of the 2 wines because of your actions before. Is that fair?

I know that there had been much talk in the past about ‘hostage’ wine offerings where you had to take specific wines you may not have wanted in order to get the ones that you really wanted and folks were not happy about this. You know that happens with distributors / importers with their accounts, right?

Just trying to make sure we are all on the same page and looking at this from other sides . . .

Cheers.

35

Well, there’s the possibility of getting your hands dirty if you squeeze the cherries just-so and you may have to rinse off the pesticide residue, particularly if they are not organic, and you risk the fall off of a ladder if you get dizzy or are scared of heights, but otherwise you have the benefits of fresh air and manual labor which could lengthen you lifespan, so overall, I’d say a positive. [smack.gif]

36

History of America in a nutshell.

37

It would be nice as a consumer to know that is how it works beforehand, but no issues with that. I had a winery email me the first offer of a new small production wine they made with a note that if I pass, I won’t be offered it again next year. I appreciated the notice.

38

Chris,

I think you’re a lot more understanding than most based on previous threads [snort.gif]

And I’m heading back to Harrisburg next week to meet with the PLCB buyer to try to get a few more wines into the system - wish me luck [drinkers.gif]

Cheers.

39

I don’t think anyone is suggesting that people should buy bad wine or wine that doesn’t please them. I know I’m not. It’s more complicated than good versus bad most of the time, though. Take Keller, a producer I have bought every year so far. If I tasted and disliked the wines, I wouldn’t buy. Probably if I heard from people I trust that the wines weren’t good, I also wouldn’t buy. On the other hand, I heard from various sources that 2011 was a relatively weak vintage compared to 2010, though good producers still made good wines (in my opinion this is often the case, btw). I still bought some 2011’s and have enjoyed them and am not at all sorry to have them, even though I liked the 2010’s better.

What I AM saying - based on my interpretation of the question, which might have been wrong - is that making choices based on common wisdom (this a “bad” vintage, this is a “good” vintage) about a name or number is problematic and can have drawbacks. And we do do that - make judgments based on common wisdom. How do we start to categorize a vintage as good or bad? By what people are saying about it, largely. There’s nothing wrong with that - few people can taste broadly enough to decide entirely for themselves. Using this common wisdom as a firm guide has two problems. First, it assumes you will agree with the common wisdom. Since wine cannot be as easily labeled as working or working the way an electronic device can, that’s a poor assumption. Second, the common wisdom is almost always painted in broad strokes, and leads to thinking that judgement of an overall vintage applies to every producer or site within that vintage. My point then, is that if you cherry pick based on common wisdom you might miss things you like very much. More generally, you might miss out on a chance to develop your own sense of what you like.

Analogies are always flawed to one degree or another, but the one I’m thinking of is going back to the bowl of fruit. If someone puts a mixed bowl of fruit in front of you, and you know you only like cherries, then by all means only take the cherries. If someone puts a bowl of mixed fruit in front of you, all of which you like, and says “the cherries were consistently good this year, whereas the strawberries were varied” and then you only take the cherries, you might miss some great strawberries.

40

Would people prefer to go have wine at someone’s house who only purchased 100 point cherries, or to someone’s house who had taken the time to search out what he/she found interesting?