What Wineries Have Dropped Off Your Radar Screen??

Ron_Erickson · December 20, 2018, 12:33am

Mt. Veeder came on my radar for the first time a year ago for their '14 cab. NOT a typical Napa cab – restrained, high acid. One I want to follow over time.

… MtVeeder was started by Mike & Arlene Bernstein in 1973. It was a Cabernet house, mostly, from their Bernstein Estate.
But they made a late harvest Chard about '75 from the LongVnyd that was an absolute killer, yet pretty much dry. And in '75, they
made (along w/ CarnerosCreek) a Petite Sirah from the MarstonVnyd that was the stuff of legends. One of the greatest PS’s made
in Calif…ranked up there w/ the Ridge YorkCreek '71 and FreemarkAbbey. They also made some terrific Amador Zins from the EsolaVnyd.
They sold MtVeeder to Franciscan/AgustenHuneeus in '83 and I rapidly lost interest as Franciscan/Estancia was making rather ho-hum wines.
And it’s now owned by one of the biggies…Constellation, perhaps.

Mike and Arlene sold Mt Veeder to a couple from Florida. They in turn sold it to Huneeus.

First I was aghast. 2. Then I was relieved. 3. Now I’m confused.

I will explain:

If Mt. Veeder were owned by Constellation, I’d feel terrible for liking the wine.

Never heard of Huneeus, but sounds much better than Constellation.

But the Huneeus website doesn’t list Mt. Veeder. It seems that Franciscan did buy Mt. Veeder when Agustin Huneeus was running Franciscan in 1989: https://www.nytimes.com/1989/05/31/garden/a-tiny-but-notable-winery-is-sold.html But I can’t find anything about who owns it now.

If you two, Tom and Mel, don’t know the history, I don’t know who does.

It looks like Constellation has had it for a while.

Bob_Davis · December 20, 2018, 10:09pm

Copied from WCWN:

We have some intersection

David Bruce
Santa Criz Mtn.
Phelps

Although my last visit to David Bruce I liked the Pinots.
Others:

Marcassin
Rochioli
Cline
Pride
Ridge - due to severe negligence. Going back next year after we move.
Arrowood
Biale
Dave Coffaro
Siduri/Novy
McPrice Myers
Villa Creek
Jaffurs
Loring

The second list came about due to me realizing we can’t buy it all.

Adam_G · December 21, 2018, 3:23am

Peter sold to VJB - not a conglomerate, though, a small(ish) family winery that spends a lot more on presentation than on the wine. Also their style is not in accordance with mine, at least not any more. I quite liked VJB’s stuff in about 2010.

Liquid Farm also fell off my radar, mostly due to the pricing. Halcon as well.

Alan_Eden · December 21, 2018, 3:36am

Kosta browne seems to have fallen off a lot of radars

NED_VALOIS · December 21, 2018, 3:49am

Schrader
Flowers
Charles Smith
Seavey
Teachworth
Turley
(probably) Abreu

jcoley3 · December 21, 2018, 7:38am

Mt. Veeder came on my radar for the first time a year ago for their '14 cab. NOT a typical Napa cab – restrained, high acid. One I want to follow over time.

… MtVeeder was started by Mike & Arlene Bernstein in 1973. It was a Cabernet house, mostly, from their Bernstein Estate.
But they made a late harvest Chard about '75 from the LongVnyd that was an absolute killer, yet pretty much dry. And in '75, they
made (along w/ CarnerosCreek) a Petite Sirah from the MarstonVnyd that was the stuff of legends. One of the greatest PS’s made
in Calif…ranked up there w/ the Ridge YorkCreek '71 and FreemarkAbbey. They also made some terrific Amador Zins from the EsolaVnyd.
They sold MtVeeder to Franciscan/AgustenHuneeus in '83 and I rapidly lost interest as Franciscan/Estancia was making rather ho-hum wines.
And it’s now owned by one of the biggies…Constellation, perhaps.

Mike and Arlene sold Mt Veeder to a couple from Florida. They in turn sold it to Huneeus.

First I was aghast. 2. Then I was relieved. 3. Now I’m confused.

I will explain:

If Mt. Veeder were owned by Constellation, I’d feel terrible for liking the wine.

Never heard of Huneeus, but sounds much better than Constellation.

But the Huneeus website doesn’t list Mt. Veeder. It seems that Franciscan did buy Mt. Veeder when Agustin Huneeus was running Franciscan in 1989: https://www.nytimes.com/1989/05/31/garden/a-tiny-but-notable-winery-is-sold.html But I can’t find anything about who owns it now.

If you two, Tom and Mel, don’t know the history, I don’t know who does.

TL;DR history - Constellation.

Sorry.

Howard_Cooper · December 21, 2018, 12:34pm

A lot of Burgundy producers who prices are just not in my ballpark, at least based on their US prices, such as: Roumier, Mugnier, DRC, Raveneau, Rousseau, etc.

A number of Bordeaux estates that have gone to the dark side like Cos D’Estournal, Troplong Mondot, Pape Clement, etc.

In California, it would be a much shorter list to name wineries I still think about.

James_Billy · December 21, 2018, 1:51pm

Haven’t Cos returned from the darkness?

Robert.A.Jr · December 21, 2018, 1:59pm

Copain - changed ownership
Ridge - increased use of new oak (do buy Geyserville)
Allemand - price and scarcity
Rougeard - lost allocation
Domaine Roche Nueve - price for quality
Lanessan - brought in modern consultant
La Louviere - modern consultant
Meyney - modern consultant
Poujeaux - modern consultant

Frankly, for the most part, anything that Rolland, Hubert, Cambie or their ilk touch.

Sarah_Kirschbaum · December 21, 2018, 2:02pm

Every California or Australian wine that ever was on my radar is now off it. I have not purchased either in quite a few years.

M_Dildine · December 21, 2018, 2:09pm

France.

TomHill · December 21, 2018, 3:51pm

Au contraire, Robert. They’ve been changing their oak regime at Ridge for over 10 yrs now and the new Am.oak that was
once so prominant has been scaled back quite a bit. Increasingly, older oak is being used. Although the oak is still noticible
in the Ridge wines, I think the current Ridge wines are much more reflective of their vnyd origins than they once were.
But then…what would I know?? Only been drinking Ridges for almost 50 yrs now.
They did lose me once back in the late '70’s-early '80’s, when the brett issue got out of hand. But they got that problem fixed by the mid-'80’s.
Tom

J_a_y_H_a_c_k · December 21, 2018, 4:01pm

Siduri
Copain
DuMol
Seasmoke
Williams Selyem
Pahlmeyer
No Girls
Petrus (I used to think about buying it but it is now off my radar and I do not even think about it any more)

J_a_y_H_a_c_k · December 21, 2018, 4:02pm

Soon to add due to purchases by conglomerates:

Outpost
Schrader

Robert.A.Jr · December 21, 2018, 4:06pm

Copain - changed ownership
Ridge - increased use of new oak (do buy Geyserville)
Allemand - price and scarcity
Rougeard - lost allocation
Domaine Roche Nueve - price for quality
Lanessan - brought in modern consultant
La Louviere - modern consultant
Meyney - modern consultant
Poujeaux - modern consultant

Frankly, for the most part, anything that Rolland, Hubert, Cambie or their ilk touch.

Au contraire, Robert. They’ve been changing their oak regime at Ridge for over 10 yrs now and the new Am.oak that was
once so prominant has been scaled back quite a bit. Increasingly, older oak is being used. Although the oak is still noticible
in the Ridge wines, I think the current Ridge wines are much more reflective of their vnyd origins than they once were.
But then…what would I know?? Only been drinking Ridges for almost 50 yrs now.
They did lose me once back in the late '70’s-early '80’s, when the brett issue got out of hand. But they got that problem fixed by the mid-'80’s.
Tom

Hard to disagree with you and your expertise, but I have a thread somewhere on this site that shows by year the increase of use of new oak in Lytton Springs and the Estate Cab, using data straight off the Ridge website. I think we did see some decline though in 2016 and perhaps 2015.

Bud_Carey · December 21, 2018, 4:12pm

Forgot to mention… due to my old age, I have stopped buying all things French, Italian, Spanish, and Aussie.
Sticking to mostly small Cali producers.

Michael_Martin · December 21, 2018, 4:33pm

Tobin James enough said.

Ojai
Carr
Turley
Piedrassi
Paul Lato
Ravenswood
Round Pond

T_Altmayer · December 21, 2018, 4:43pm

Copain
Carlisle
Herb Lamb
D’Angerville (price)

SeanHarding · December 21, 2018, 6:06pm

There have been many that I’ve bought a few times and then stopped, but the most notable one that’s really dropped off is probably Quilceda Creek. When I first got into wine, they were the hot thing in WA state, and I was so excited to get on the list, go to the release parties, etc. I’m not sure I ever truly loved the wines in proportion to the hype and price, but I did like them. I stayed on the list for a number of years after the initial excitement wore off, but eventually realized that it was silly (especially at the price point) and dropped off. I still like lots of “modern” new world cabs, but QC isn’t my thing any more.

I also dropped off the Betz list a while back, but I still have a ton in my cellar. It’s not really anything they did wrong, I just realized that I was buying more because of other people saying how much they like it, rather than enjoying it myself. I don’t dislike the wines, but they’re not in my top tier, and I’m trying to be more disciplined about lists.

I still love Liquid Farm, though.

lleichtman · December 21, 2018, 6:41pm

Bonny Doon and Phelps for sure. Rhys has also hit that wall for me. I completely stopped buying Aussie wines and NZ Sauvignon in now few and far between.