What Causes The "Cola" Aroma in Some Pinot Noirs?

[Marc_Hauser]

Okay, I’m gonna ask a dumb, but sincere, question. Does cola have an aroma? I admit I’ve never sniffed my Coke (ha! Cocaine joke!). I always thought of cola flavors in Pinot, but aroma?

[Otto_Forsberg]

Okay, I’m gonna ask a dumb, but sincere, question. Does cola have an aroma? I admit I’ve never sniffed my Coke (ha! Cocaine joke!). I always thought of cola flavors in Pinot, but aroma?

[dougwilder]

I have noticed these aromas on and off for 20 years, from regions all over the state. At one point I thought maybe it was the signature aroma of Anderson Valley, but lately have notice from all over California. Is it an oak thing? Any thoughts?

I think it is an overripe fruit + oak indicator. Some selections/clones seemed to be more susceptible - Pommard for instance, the higher numbered Dijon clones.

Paul

Pommard is what I was thinking of as well, Paul.

[loren.grossman]

Joe,

I would think that would lead to a more ‘smoky’ quality, and not a ‘cola’ one, but heck, what do I know?

Cheers

I would agree.

[Tom_DeBiase]

Joe,

I would think that would lead to a more ‘smoky’ quality, and not a ‘cola’ one, but heck, what do I know?

Cheers

In the review of ASEV research I came across this comparative. Noting that only one compound found in both entities. Surprising given that cherry cola and cola are often used as descriptors in Pinot Noir and I suspected other compounds would crossover.

Here is straight forward analysis of the compounds from oak. Many of the ingredients-profiles are what we have been discussing.

https://www.etslabs.com/library/15

Tom

[JMReuter]

Here is straight forward analysis of the compounds from oak. Many of the ingredients-profiles are what we have been discussing.

ETS Labs

Tom

That link is pretty cool. Thanks for sharing it!

[Paul_Miller]

Joe,

I would think that would lead to a more ‘smoky’ quality, and not a ‘cola’ one, but heck, what do I know?

Cheers

In the review of ASEV research I came across this comparative. Noting that only one compound found in both entities. Surprising given that cherry cola and cola are often used as descriptors in Pinot Noir and I suspected other compounds would crossover.

Here is straight forward analysis of the compounds from oak. Many of the ingredients-profiles are what we have been discussing.

ETS Labs

Tom

Thanks for sharing this. This thread is very interesting.

So to what extent does barrel toasting lead to cola? Can you correlate the two? Are wines with a certain barrel toast more associated with cola?

[Tom_DeBiase]

In the review of ASEV research I came across this comparative. Noting that only one compound found in both entities. Surprising given that cherry cola and cola are often used as descriptors in Pinot Noir and I suspected other compounds would crossover.

Here is straight forward analysis of the compounds from oak. Many of the ingredients-profiles are what we have been discussing.

ETS Labs

Tom

Thanks for sharing this. This thread is very interesting.

So to what extent does barrel toasting lead to cola? Can you correlate the two? Are wines with a certain barrel toast more associated with cola?

I have no idea. One would have to do a controlled study to see what chemicals are formed-increased-decreased by the toasting process. Obviously 'toasty" notes increase but there are also many other compounds that come into play. The reason I put formed-increase-decrease is because there are studies that show the heavier the toast level, some compounds DECREASE compared with medium toast.

I mentioned it earlier but worth repeating. Many people on this board steer away from this Cherry Kola or Kola note but many many others seek out wines with it because they like it.

Tom

[Jorgen_Lindstrom_Carlvik]

Joe,

I would think that would lead to a more ‘smoky’ quality, and not a ‘cola’ one, but heck, what do I know?

Cheers

In the review of ASEV research I came across this comparative. Noting that only one compound found in both entities. Surprising given that cherry cola and cola are often used as descriptors in Pinot Noir and I suspected other compounds would crossover.

Here is straight forward analysis of the compounds from oak. Many of the ingredients-profiles are what we have been discussing.

ETS Labs

Tom

Very interesting link, Tom!

[Jorgen_Lindstrom_Carlvik]

I have noticed these aromas on and off for 20 years, from regions all over the state. At one point I thought maybe it was the signature aroma of Anderson Valley, but lately have notice from all over California. Is it an oak thing? Any thoughts?

i really dislike that aroma/flavor in any wine, so PLEASE avoid it when you start producing your own Pinot Noir!

[Jay_Miller]

I’ve had plenty if non-RRV Pinots where I’ve gotten a cola note and thought to myself, “But this isn’t RRV fruit. “

LOL, that’s exactly my reaction when I get it in a non-RRV pinot.

Not a fan of the flavor profile in wine but a big fan up the discussion/information upthread.

[David_Patte]

I’ve found it appears mostly in ripe Pinot Noirs with some new oak. I feel like it is a combination of Pinot fruit and new oak that creates the impression, since very rarely I get the same kind of impression from other wines that are otherwise similarly oaky. They are just “oaky” but don’t have that distinct “cola oak” character. Conversely, can’t remember having many wines with a noticeable cola character without any obvious oak aromatics.

Then again, one’s cola might be somebody else’s who-knows-what. We might talk of different things and call it the same name or talk of identical things with different names. For me, cola equates the aromatic combination of oak and Pinosity (and that doesn’t happen always - often leaner, cooler-climate Pinot Noirs can feel just “oaky” without any cola character if they have a noticeable streak of oak influence).

I agree with Otto: I have only found cola in Oregon Pinots very rarely (compared to many CA AVAs) and if so, tends to be a warmer vintage and definitely a winery that uses a higher percentage of new oak. For my personal taste, if I can taste vanilla and/or other oak-derived flavors on a Pinot, it’s a flaw. Structure and tannins from new oak are okay, but the oak flavors should be so deep in the background that they are not primary notes.

I want to stress that over-oaking is not just a high-end winery issue. Mass-produced Pinot (and other wines) that stays in tanks can have bags of oak chips or other oak “alternatives” added.

[larry_schaffer]

Interestingly, I found some cola in a barrel sample of a 2019 Lindquist Family Winery Bien Nacido Block Z Syrah last week. I will talk to Bob and find out what specific barrel it was in, but obviously it’s not just apparent in Pinot . . .

Cheers.

[Marcus_Goodfellow]

Eugenol (spicy, clovelike, sweet) and coumarin (sweet, herbaceous) were predominant in all colas. Other predominant odorants in at least one brand included guaiacol.

Characterization of typical potent odorants in cola-flavored carbonated beverages by aroma extract dilution analysis — University of Illinois Urbana-Champaign

That would make a lot of sense then. Including how Larry would see it in Syrah.

I was taught early on that it’s a product of cool fermentations, but haven’t found any real consistency to that.

[Andrew_Dodd]

2006-2012 ish Kosta Browne seems to have it in spades

[Tim_Heaton]

Maybe it’s a by-product of all the Velcorin?

[larry_schaffer]

Maybe it’s a by-product of all the Velcorin?

Funny - but I’ll have to say no - at least in the case of the Lindquist Syrah above

Cheers

[Anton_D]

Could it be from combining Syrah and Pinot Noir?

[larry_schaffer]

Could it be from combining Syrah and Pinot Noir?

Ouch . . .

I wouldn’t think so - syrah producers would never allow that to happen!

Cheers!

[Brandon_Anderson]

Curious if anyone has gotten it on '18 red Burg…just food for thought.