Peter, have you been to the new Marriott property on the Isola Della Rose? I have a bazillion Marriott points, and am tempted to stay a night or two. It is 20 minutes from St Marks by shuttle, so totally unsuited for most of the trip, but it might be a nice experience for a night or two
Sorry, Neal but Iāve not been nor have heard anything from friends who visit Venice regularly. I can offer this, but itās only a generalization. New hotels in and around Venice, especially the big name properties, usually encounter service and other issues for a while after they open. The Hilton Molino Stucky in Guidecca Island, for example, took quite a while before they ironed out their issues.
The front desk folks at the 'Ca Pisani where I usually stay told me a couple years back that new hotels in Venice and on the islands do not have an easy time finding qualified personnel because with a population of some 56,000, Venice cannot provide enough good workers to staff new(er) properties. Therefore, the hotels have to go elsewhere in Italy to recruit.
The idea of staying in a Hilton or a Marriott in Venice gives me the hives ā especially one āoff propertyā ā but there is that whole āfreeā thing, to which I am very much attached. I looked at your place; it looks lovely and I do like the neighborhood, just across the bridge.
The Dorsoduro is my district of choice. Neal, check this out. Late at night or very early in the morning, Iām in the habit of walking Venice. Like you, my wife and kid are sound asleep. One of the things I always do is stand on the Accademia Bridge and gaze out at the Grand Canal. What a marvelous view, made all the more hauntingly beautiful because Iām the only one on the bridge. When dawn is about to break and the lights in the city begin to turn on, what a sight!
While the idea of being secluded in a big name property on an island may have its advantages, factor in the disadvantages as well. If the weather is bad, you may be stuck on the island for the day if the shuttle doesnāt go out. If the weather is bad in Venice and the shuttle doesnāt come, you may be stuck. If you lose track of time in Venice and miss the shuttle back to the island, you may be stuck. Staying on an island makes you dependent on the shuttle schedule. As every visitor to Venice knows, there are times after a day of exploration where you just want to go back to the hotel to rest and nap. If you want to have lunch or dinner in the restaurant on the property, itās probably going to cost an arm and a leg unless you have some kind of deal with them. When the San Clemente Palace Kempinski opened on the island of San Clemente, these are exactly the kinds of things that happened to its guests.
On the other hand, canāt beat āfreeā, but I save my hotel points for destinations other than Venice.
Peter
Really appreciating the comments, and this is an important point. FWIW in untouristy/unflashy places Iāve often been charged the same price sat down, as for standing up, indeed I can recall a place in Reggio Emilia, where we sat outside on a very pleasant side street (blocked to traffic) and were still charged the same price as those rushing in for their caffeine fix at the bar.
However assuming people are going to recognised tourist destinations & in the general area of them, your advice will be pretty universally appropriate. I did get caught out once in Pisa, by sitting down indoors at a āmodest at bestā cafĆ© near the central station. ā¬4 a coffee ![[wow.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/7/7d450e9830889c8943b674446a21b7254cad657e.gif "wow"){kind=small}
. Iād become so used to recognising and frequenting non-touristy places, that I hadnāt twigged this was a major tourist thoroughfare.
There used to be a legislated maximum price for a coffee taken standing up (āAl bancoā in Italian for those that want to do this) It was ā¬0.95 back then for an espresso, but I believe the scale became more āadvisoryā a few years ago. As far as Iām aware there are no limits to what can be charged to sit down.
Despite this, we do see Italians sat outside cafes, but they do this when they want to sit down, relax and spend a good while people watching, catching up on news or chatting with friends. They bought their drink and hence they see it as the price of staying there as long as they want to.
regards
Ian
Well put, Ian!
Venice is but one island among a chain of islands situated in a lagoon that flows into the Adriatic. Although Venice is by far the most popular of these islands, there are others worth exploring that could easily take up an entire day. The islands with the greatest access include Murano, Burano, Mazzorbo and Torcello.
The Laguna Nord (LN) ferry makes a run to Murano, Burano and Mazzorbo from Fondamente Nuove in Venice. If you are game, you can visit all three islands in a morning, afternoon and early evening. Murano is, of course, famous for its glass, and you can visit any number of glassworks factories spread out on the island. No appointments are necessary, you just poke your head in and ask to see a demonstration. The folks who fashion glass are artisans, and they are a dwindling lot. It is anyoneās guess how many of them will be left in the next several generations. There is a showroom attached to each factory, but beware of high prices and aggressive salespeople. Murano is nice to stroll, the chief virtue being a tranquil environment (other than weekends). Lunch can be had at Ai Frati, a family-run affair that serves typical Venetian cuisine. The restaurant is located on a canal, and there is a terrace where one can linger over a long meal.
Burano is known for its lace and linen, made by artisans that have been in the business for many generations. What is striking about Burano are the brightly colored homes painted in pink, blue, red and white that line the canal. Youāll want to have your camera ready. Perhaps as a sign of the times, many of the shops that purport to sell Burano handcrafted linen and lace actually import them from China. If you must have the real thing, head over to Martina Vidal to see and feel the quality linen that made Burano famous. Of course, after strolling around Burano, youāll be hungry, and the only place to eat is Trattoria al Gatto Nero. This is a family run place, and an astounding variety of fish and seafood from the lagoon is on offer. I once overheard a waiter recommend risotto to a family of locals, and when the dish came out and they tasted it, they rolled their collective eyes heavenward.
Mazzorbo is connected to Burano by a bridge. Here you will also see brightly painted homes, but the main attraction are the vineyards that produce wine made with the Dorona grape, a white wine varietal that is not seen outside of the Veneto. IIRC, Venissa is the only producer on the island.
Torcello is ninety minutes by ferry from Venice. It was settled soon after the fall of Rome, and was once the premier maritime power before Veniceās ascendency. Today it is inhabited by some two dozen hardy folks. I visited only once, on a rain and wind swept morning, which only served to add to the eerie feeling I got while visiting the ruins of a once prominent Byzantine cathedral. The cathedral is the main attraction here. Almost inconceivably, Torcello is home to the Locanda Cipriani, a prominent small hotel and restaurant that apparently draws enough guests and diners to stay in business. Very expensive, and as an alternative, you might consider the several small restaurants that line the road after you disembark at the pier.
Two other islands of note are the Guidecca, located across the canal from the Zattere (promenade) in Dorsoduro, and San Michele. The Guidecca is home to the Hilton Molino Stucky hotel, and is the only island where cars are allowed, this being mainly a residential island. Seeing cars here can be a bit jarring after spending time in and around Venice. San Michele is mainly a cemetery, and the resting place of many famous people like Stravinsky and Ezra Pound. Iāve never been.
Thatās it for now, Marshall. Hope this has been helpful. Feel free to post questions. Iām off to France next week and wonāt be checking this board much until I return in mid-November.
When the Starwood acquisition by Marriott is completed, those points can be redeemed at the Gritti Palace! The restaurant/bar is right on the grand canal, the 20 euro drink is completely worth it.
One of my favorite, albeit very pricey, restaurants is Osteria da Fiore. Razor clams even better than Ai Testiere (at almost double the price). The little lagoon crabs are a must if they have them. The other two are already mentioned (Ai Testiere and Fiascetteria Toscana, the latter I go to twice each visit). Went to Ai Gondolieri once, very good if you are tired of seafood.
PS Neil, I share your love for Venice. My favorite small city, always want to go back.
PPS For those who are less familiar with Venice, itās not hard to avoid the heaviest of tourist crowds. Avoid the Rialto bridge area and San Marco at peak times, check out the Jewish Ghetto or the area around Campo San Maria Formosa (near Ai Testiere). There is a great wine bar there called Enoiteca Mascareta. On Sunday, when crowds are heaviest, go to Murano which even when busy isnāt that crowded. Eat at Busa Alla Torre (reservations needed for Sunday afternoon)
Peter: These posts have been fantastic! The information you have provided is very much appreciated.
Thanks again!
Cheers!
Marshall ![[cheers.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/0/0ff9bfcdb0964982cd3240b6159868fbdf215b1a.gif "cheers"){kind=small}
First, a big thank you to Peter, not only for his time posting here, but his insight and recommendations regarding Venice are extremely helpful and spot on.
I was there earlier this month as part of my honeymoon. The entire stay was fantastic. It certainly helped we had great weather and great food. We stayed at the Londra Palace (the view from Room 510 is spectacular), which is about six doors down from St. Markās square and the Dogeās palace. The property is perfectly located, the service was excellent as was the restaurant. Highly recommended.
The crowds in Venice could easily be overwhelming. It was not that bad when we were there, but I would imagine the mid summer months are close to intolerable. The entire town is designed to bring in tourists. The train station is about 100 feet from the Grand Canal. You can take a boat from the airport directly to your hotel and the docks accommodate massive tourist ships with people pouring onto the island. For the most part, that means St. Markās Square and the Rialto Bridge area are packed between 10 and 4, so wonder down a side street, go to the outer islands, etc. Venice is truly amazing. The fact that more than 1000 years ago people started building in a muddy lagoon with wood poles is incredible enough, but when there are so many buildings still standing after hundreds of years, it is truly something to behold.
We took a tour guide (pm for info if anyone wants its) and he was excellent, showing us some better and lesser known sites. The energy of the Rialto market, the spectacular beauty of St. Markās (and the Horses upstairs) and the Dogeās palace are all must see stops.
We ate incredibly well, Peterās recommendations were spot on and the meal at Il Ridotto was the best of the entire trip.
I want to go back, but imagine it might be tough to have a better stay.
We ate at both of these and they were outstanding, surpassed only by Il Ridotto. We also ate ate Trattoria Cherubino, which served authentic Venetian food and was very good for lunch.
Thanks allā¦we still have almost a year so keep āem coming! Barry, we need to have dinner soon as I need to pick your brain some more. We have two hotel "ideas ā¦Hotel Savoia & Jolanda with a canal view and Caā Pisani Hotel in the quieter Dorsoduro area. Any ideas or specifics here?
Thanks again!
Cheers!
Marshall
Just rolled across this thread for the first time. Great, great advice, Peter. Our favorite city as well.
Hey Marshall. My opinion on canal view vs. the quieter Dorsoduro district is this. Youāll be spending lots of time exploring Venice on foot and perhaps by boat, which means youāll be near and on the water all the time, which makes a canal view unnecessary (for me, of course). A canal view is great if you plan on spending lots of time in your room, which I somehow donāt think youāll be doing. Speaking for myself, I always prefer the tranquility of the Dorsoduro after long days of exploring. If you opt for the Caā Pisani and must see the canal, the Accademia Bridge is only a stoneās throw from the Caā Pisani. The view from the Accademia Bridge is priceless, especially late at night or early in the morning when you (and your wife) will probably be the only ones there!
Good advice. We had a canal view in a first floor room at the Pensione Accademia on our honeymoon, which was nice, because they are half a block off of the Grand Canal. On the other hand, there was a night club next door that blasted Peter Frampton into the night, which took some of the glow away.
The Accademia Bridge late at night (we donāt do early morning) is wonderful
I have fond memories of the Pensione Accademia as this was the first hotel I stayed in on my very first trip to Venice. Discreetly located at the end of a canal, the pensione was, in a previous incarnation, the home of the Russian Consulate. It was here that I discovered the Dorsoduro district, and Iāve not looked back since. The rooms tend to be small and there is no elevator if one has mobility issues. But the place is nonetheless charming, whose clientele is largely made up of well-travelled Americans and British. A generous breakfast is offered, and the pensione has a beautiful garden where one can unwind with a drink after a day of walking and sightseeing. Some of the front desk personnel can be a bit distant, while others are more welcoming and accommodating. The night club that David mentions is still there, so a room on a higher floor is recommended. If you have an early flight out of Venice, the Pensione has its own motorboat pier where you can be whisked to the airport in 30 minutes. The Pensione does not run its own motorboat service, but will arrange one for you.
As an aside, the Pensione Accademia reminds me of the Pensione Bencista in Fiesole, a hill town that is a twenty minute bus trip (on the no. 7 bus) from the center of Florence. Once in Fiesole, the Bencista is a 5-10 minute walk from the bus stop. This gem of a pensione is family owned, and the stunning views of Florence from the terrace is alone worth the stay. If you take breakfast on the terrace, you may not wish to go into Firenze that day. Not surprisingly, the rooms tend to be small, but renovations have been going on for some time now, and Iāll check the place out next time Iām in Firenze. Many guests opt for the half board on offer, which means a three course dinner of typical Tuscan fare that is very well prepared. If staying in hectic Firenze does not appeal to you, consider the Pensione Bencista.
Iām not a big fan of Al Cove. Too Americanized for me.
We will be in Venice on Jan 3rd and in Cremona on Jan 4th. I have a lunch available in both cities. I am leaning towards Il Ridotto. Any suggestions for Cremona?
I tried to make reservations by email about how long did it take you guys to get responses? Or is a voice call better?