TNs: 2004 red Burgundy greenie check

WINE TALK
21

I’m no burgundy expert – but doing what I can to learn, largely out of the generosity of others. I’ve enjoyed the 04 T. Liger-Belair NSG Les St Georges on several occasions. There is a note of greeness but it works well with this wine; I could see where similar notes in a more traditional, restrained burg might be jarring. At close out prices, this has become a go to burg for me…

22

I had a very positive experience with the Clos de Lambrays 2004 about a year ago, with similar notes to yours. I don’t think it ever went through a real “green” phase…

23

Now that you mention it, it was a delicious Lambrays

24

Thanks for the update-it mirrors exactly my recent experience with many 04s, that several that seemed tainted have already emerged.

25

I agree, the '04 Lambrays never really showed the chemically problem. It has always had a pleasant stalkiness and drinks well.

26

Thanks for the update and notes!

Good luck for me with the 04’s… I really like them and never experienced green from a handful Mugnier, Cathiard and Liger Belair wines I’ve had… Maybe it’s time to open some more…

27

Morning all,

Many thanks for the notes and general views on 2004 Burgundy. The most recent one I tried was a Morey Villages from Domaine Dujac. I was given it blind (only being told it was Pinot) and I guessed it as Morey 1er Cru 2002 from Dujac, so I was clearly impressed! It was delicious, no greenness, tough tannins or frightening acid levels; just a lovely charmer. I’ve had the Clos des Lambrays 2004 a few times and agree it is a good wine.

Cheers,
David.

28

Tasting 2004s with others I’ve noticed that the sensitivity to the “green” varies between people similar to TCA-sensitivity. Alas I’m very sensitive to it and overwhelms my palate after a couple of tastes if it is present in the wines.

Here are some examples:
2004 Domaine Robert Chevillon Nuits St. Georges 1er Cru Les Vaucrains - in 2006 the green meanies smelled like ganja. This was drinkable and the green subsided.

2004 Domaine Robert Chevillon Nuits St. Georges 1er Cru Les Perrières - too much green that did not subside; barely drinkable

2004 Domaine des Lambrays Clos des Lambrays - Very green; I couldn’t drink this, blech; I have other vintages of this wine in the cellar and generally like it quite a bit. Very bad.

2004 Domaine Armand Rousseau Père et Fils Clos de la Roche - no green that I could tell; this was very good wine.

I’m a Chevillon fan so it’s rather upsetting to me that these aren’t drinkable. Other than a check-in with each cuvee these are buried in the cellar while I hope for the best. [swearing.gif]

29

Keith - are you generally sensitive to the “green/mirepoix” aspect in 04s?

It’s such a slippery slope with palate alignment given people’s varying degrees of sensitivity - I’d love to grab some of that Lambrays…

30

That’s a great point Shannon. I am very sensitive to these pyrazines and not super-sensitive to TCA. I opened an '04 white last night and could not really enjoy it given the (much lighter than the reds) weird chemically green aspect. From tasting alongside other people, it is clear that the sensitivity to this compound varies a great deal.

31

Never got to taste it personally, but we got 6 bottles of 04 Jadot Bonnes-Mares on closeout recently (retailed for @$70). A good customer bought one and tasted it, then came back and bought the other 5. So that’s a good sign. We also did a wine dinner recently with Chateau du Chorey where we featured 3 vintages of one of their 1er Cru wine; 02,04,and 06. Surprisingly we sold just as much of the 04 as the other 2 because it was showing very nicely with the food. It was also priced slightly less.

I think 04 will be a great ‘backfill’ vintage for many people, as long as you don’t take ANYONE’S advise blindly and taste a bottle for yourself. Lots of sources will keep dropping their prices lower and lower until they find a point where people will buy. I can see lots of 1er and Grand Cru wines going for 1/2-1/3 their release price. So at some point you have to ask the question; “This may not be a great example of a Burgundy from such-and-such, but is it a good Burgundy for the money?”

32

For example, when I hosted Peter Weygandt we tasted this: Domaine des Lambrays 2004 Clos des Lambrays. Don, Brandon and Michael were there tasting, along with a few other Berserker members. I can’t say the wine showed well. It was very green. Although I do know that Rowdy liked it.

33

Thanks for the notes and thoughts. My 04s are pretty shallow but I have enjoyed most of the ones I have tasted. Although I can’t handle the slightest TCA, I think I may be on the less sensitive side with regard to 04 mean greenies.

I am hoping my Lambrays lines up the positive notes.

Jason

34

Keith or Peter,

I saw that you guys both posted notes on the Domaine de Courcel Pommard 1er Cru Grand Clos des Épenots a couple years ago and not having much Burg experience I picked up 4 of these last year on closeout ($25) Any recent thoughts ?

35

I have not had the Epenots since release, when it was awesome, but for what it’s worth here is my note from almost exactly one year ago on the Rugiens:

Domaine de Courcel 2004 Pommard 1er Cru Rugiens
Approaching this wine feels sort of like being a caveman looking at an automobile engine. It looks impressive and complicated but you don’t have the foggiest idea what to do with it, and you’re mildly afraid that it might start growling and eat you. I can’t possibly describe all the stuff going on in here except to say that not one bit of it, from the powerful knockout scent to the wincingly acidic but dense-with-blackness palate, is remotely reminiscent of grapes. Nor is it especially functional as a wine per se. It tastes more like a wine waiting to happen. Not since I’ve had a barrel sample that was still going through malo have I experienced a wine so shrill and disjointed. Part of that derives from the fact that what you have here is like the spare parts of a wine strewn in disarray across the floor. But part of it also derives from the fact that the alcohol and acidity – a bell-pepper-juice kind of acidity – are poking out and dominating everything else. Twenty or thirty years from now when you might surmise this wine to be ready to drink, it will either be monumentally awesome or taste like the punch bowl at a Klingon fraternity party.

36

P.S. At $25 a bottle from a cool cellar, I would certainly load up.

37

Thanks Keith, There were only 4 bottles so I took them all.

38

Yeah, that’s a smokin’ deal. I thought this was terrific (but in need of 10 years of cellar time) on release.

39

You bought based on somebody else’s note? I thought it had been determined on some other site that any non-professional reviews were worthless… [wink.gif]

40

Todd I would never do such a ridiculous thing [berserker.gif]

I bought first then saw the notes