warning, unfashionable take
I love classic Loire CF, and I have a decent amount of Baudry, Joguet, Bonnelier.
But I also occasionally enjoy new world riper CF. The criticism is it becomes generic, but I find there is a light, “floaty” mouthfeel to CF even in ripe new world styles that I appreciate, and it isn’t the same as Cabernet Sauvignon from the same regions and styles.
Okay return to the regularly scheduled thread.
I had that for the first time a couple months ago. Delicious wine. I wouldn’t buy at its steep tariff, but I enjoyed it plenty when shared by a friend.
Interesting. I think you and I have a similar feeling. No need to say if it’s ripe it some lesser product, it just isn’t to my own taste. And I’m cool if someone else hates one style or another. I’m really interested in that Quintarelli. Prices are insane but I’m glad there’s an opinion one way. I’ve only ever had that producer’s Classico so it’s probably an impossible comparison but I really enjoyed the single wine I had from them. The tariff for cab franc done appassimento is quite insanely high but I get they age it super long before release also so there’s a huge cost to that. Definitely a bottle to split with friends at some point.
Lol I was sipping Alzero 1994 when I read this post yesterday evening. 
The term I personally prefer in this case is “soupy”.
This is Wine Berserkers, sir! Threads are only launching pads for all kinds of tangential anecdotes, never what the thread topic says - well, maybe apart from the first two or three posts.
Scandalous!!!
I. Must. De-friend. You.
So many Napa Cab Francs taste like generic red wine.
Yup!
2 x Yup!
Gran Enemigo = Great Enemy (of the judicious palatte)
This thread is giving me a “just because you can doesn’t mean you should” kind of vibe 
Just from looking at the picture of the lineup, without having read a word yet of what you wrote (which I will after typing this post), I have zero doubt whatsoever that you (and likely all others) hated the Trespass. That stuff is pure rocket fuel. Now, off to see if I’ve predicted correctly!
This surprised me with this wine as well. I believe they say it’s amphora or concrete and neutral barriques but I agree it tastes like some amount of new oak snuck its way in.
LOL! I saw this, and found it hysterical, but didn’t want to do the laughing reaction to the entire post, which is excellent, as is Otto’s norm.. Thank you for parsing this out for all to appreciate.
+1.
Some scores include: 95JD, 94V, 94JS, 93WA
It came across as soft/oaky/ripe/boring/alcoholic, and felt it was deserving of a score in the low to mid 80’s.
Most importantly, I simply did not like it.
As it feels like a bit of a ‘pile-on’, an invite to share some insight from the other end of the spectrum.
For those that do like Cabernet Franc in it’s bigger/bolder form, what is it about the grape that charms you? As against wines of a similar build with different grapes.
You can listen to anyone who is consistent. So long as someone is consistent, you can calibrate your differences.
I think you can “pile-on” anytime you are comparing new world versus old world iterations of the same grape. Throw in a lot of new oak and you get a wine that often doesn’t resemble the original iteration. I am just getting my toes wet with CF in general - my limited impression of new world iterations are despite the ripeness and the high alcohol, the canopy management which probably gets rid of some of the IBMP, the higher pH, the heavy oak treatment with new oak (are there any Loire wines that get a ton of new oak?) - despite all this - the wines still retain some varietal typicity - a bit of green pepper, the tannins are lighter and softer, a bit more acidity, fruits not quite as dark. Broad strokes I know.
Yes. One of them I happen to love because I think they’re exquisitely proportioned and believe they will age well — Domaine du Bel Air. Others are just disappointing —- Domaine des Closiers being my most recent run-in.
Went down that rabbit hole - the Grand-Mont apparently gets some new oak but after reviewing the winery’s website and other sources it is a bit cryptic how much - sounds like they do use small barrels for that wine versus foudres. Anyhow, still seems like a far cry from 75 to 100 percent new Taransaud and/or Darnajou (Realm 75% - Bevan 100%)
The Clos Nouveau can be more offending, and also sometimes more glorious. Whatever they do with the oak, they’re not shy about it.
If we are talking about the El Enemigo Gualtallary, I think Matthew Luczy of the Wine Advocate supplied a possible answer (at least about the 2021), where he said that it was fermented in barrel, before undergoing elevage in foudres/concrete. It’s possible the fermentation in barrel added the woody/vanilla notes because the maturing in foudre wouldn’t.
