Three Dudes Choose TJs Over Silver Oak Blind

WINE TALK
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Big +1

Dan Kravitz

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Where did the Geyserville fall in the rankings and what vintage was it? I’m not super surprised that people didn’t peg it as zin (or maybe they did, but that’s the impression I got from the post) - I think you could plot the zinniness of Geyserville as an inverse function of bottle age.

Juan - I know Caymus and Silver Oak are often talked about in the same breath because they are both very high-production, popular wines at the same price point, but I think they’re totally different beasts. Caymus smells and tastes like grape concentrate. Silver oak smells and tastes like American oak. Both are very distinctively different from other $80 Cali Cabs, but also I think different from one another. As someone who really likes American oak, I like Silver Oak but have difficulty finishing a glass of Caymus.

I think Silver Oak is to blind tasting as medicines with serious side effects are to blind medical trials. The American oak character is so overt that you can’t hide it in a tasting: even if people don’t call it as Silver Oak they will react to its profile accordingly. I’d guess that if you had some people in that tasting who like Silver Oak they would have liked it blind, too.

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Ben, you’ve tasted with us before so you know I love Napa Cab… It wasn’t the American Oak, it just wasn’t structured or balanced. I’ve given up on trying to like this wine and spending any money on it.

It was a 2017 Lytton Springs, not Geyserville. It was #2 with Limerick Lane right behind it. I think the 18 LS is better than the 17. And the Geyserville over both.

Though the finding of the night was a 1986 Coteaux Du Layon Chaume. Never tried this style of wine before. Loved it. Thank you Dan!

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“Trash”. That’s quite a judgement for a wine that sells pretty darn well. We get it - you don’t like it. Apparently others do?

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Yeah, there’s so much good wine in the world, if you know you don’t like Silver Oak, no point fighting it anymore!

Love me a good old Chaume, I’m very envious. And I agree with you on the 17/18 Ridge. It’ll be interesting to see how the ‘18 LS/Geyserville comparison changes as they age. I usually find Geyserville to be quite accessible in its youth but I think the 18 needs to sleep.

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Juan - I know Caymus and Silver Oak are often talked about in the same breath because they are both very high-production, popular wines at the same price point, but I think they’re totally different beasts. Caymus smells and tastes like grape concentrate. Silver oak smells and tastes like American oak. Both are very distinctively different from other $80 Cali Cabs, but also I think different from one another. As someone who really likes American oak, I like Silver Oak but have difficulty finishing a glass of Caymus.

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Agree that Silver Oak and Caymus are different beasts. I would never buy Silver Oak, but I don’t mind it and occaisonally will drink it in the Delta lounge because there aren’t any better choices. But if they were only serving Caymus I might opt for a glass of water instead…
But honestly not sure what I would say about SO if I had it blind. I’m guessing it wouldn’t do well.

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I absolutely love these kinds of wine tastings, as they challenge so many prejudices and preconceptions.
Another fun variation to toss in is to ask people to (blindly) rank the wines in order of what they think the price is.

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I agree with the others - if you don’t like that style of wine, so be it. I know that Nate Weis, the winemaker for Silver Oak, is as passionate about winemaking as any other winemaker. They have a ‘style’ using American Oak - and some really take issue with that. And some take issue with Ridge doing the same - but not to the same effect.

Cheers!

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Caymus smells and tastes like grape concentrate. Silver oak smells and tastes like American oak.

Well said.

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I do too, only I would never claim that a single blind tasting by three guys of a half dozen wines proves that a producer is “trash.”

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Indeed . . .

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Yes, the American oak can be noticeable at Ridge, but I find it always integrated. With every Silver Oak I’ve tasted, it is, quite simply, all that I have ever tasted. Every single taste of about 15 wines, over about 3 decades, has simply been the overwhelming taste of oak. Comparing it to Ridge is simply wrong. Yes, they both use American oak. Chateau Lafite and Sterling Cabernet are both aged in French oak.

Dan Kravitz

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Dan,

Fair commentary, though I have had more than one Ridge that did not shed that ‘American Oak’ signature, even after a number of years. And not every Silver Oak I’ve had has screamed American Oak - especially when tried blind. Many of them have for sure, but not all of them.

Cheers

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Had a wonderful 1994 Silver Oak Alexander 3L last year.

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I have had some very nice Silver Oak, especially the Napa bottling. Clearly if the winner of the flight was a 2004 Merlot, the group of three may not like the taste of many Cali Cabs, and that is their right. So buy Bordeaux or older Cali Cabs and don’t preach to us what is swill. I am sure I would find the TJ wine to be swill.

I would note that one of the most widely held wines on Cellar Tracker is the Caymus 40th anniversary where over 52,000 bottles were purchases (about 4,700 cases) and over 32,000 bottles are still in cellars (not mine). So, I would say Dan and “Obi Juan” are somewhat in the minority even if some here agree with them.

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Drinkin a wonderful 16 Geezer right now…tastes like Silver Oak! [wow.gif]

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You don’t say . . . . [snort.gif]

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Trash?

Thanks, Keith L. in disguise. Way to be cutting edge on wine critique and promulgate the massive group think here on Silver Oak and Caymus.

SMH on every time somebody comes back around to pick on the OGs. How many posts until Jordan is berated?

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It’s in the wine forum snob starter kit.

Caymus? Too sweet, overrated.
Silver Oak? Vanilla, yuck.
Opus one? Overpriced, for posers.

Never mind these names are huge for a reason and sell tons but you can’t look cool posting unless you bash them them for some cheap internet points. These are gnats swinging at established giants hoping to get a reaction.

These same people will name drop a first growth when the first growths suffer the same problem of wines with similar quality being available for much less money.

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Be specific whether it is the Silver Oak Alexander or Napa. I always find the Alexander over oaked and ‘harsh’ compared to the Napa.

The Napa also benefits from aging and the Alexander does not evolve or benefit from time in bottle to the same degree from my estimation.

I recently put an aged Silver Oak Napa against a younger Pahlmeyer and it was damn close.

This thread should be taken as seriously as anyone who buys wine from Trader Joe’s.