Kris,
Yes. Current vintage replacement is reasonable, for this consumer, if “replacement” is the chosen option. I wouldn’t ask for same vintage replacement, but would take it if offered.
Quite frankly, all the communications were amicable (unless you count me being lied-to “not amicable”). This post was not, and is not, meant to be a complaint that I did not receive refund/replacement/store credit. Rather, it is about a TCA return policy that strikes me as quite narrow.
As others have suggested, you are more likely to get a replacement from the winery (if they have good customer service) than the retailer. Most retailers want the bottle back in order to return it to the distributor, but I imagine most distributors have time limits on returns. Having been in the distribution business, it’s amazing how many “bad” bottles are returned, especially from larger grocery stores. In order to do business with some you have to agree to take back bottles if their customer doesn’t like them, so the distributor ends up eating the cost for a wine that’s not flawed.
Their comment about storage was silly, though. Storage conditions have nothing to do with TCA.
I agree with this. LA Wine has aggressive discount pricing (generally) and (presumably) low margins. I have no problem with their policy. Though, what exactly is their policy? 30 to 60 days is a pretty vague wording. Is less than 30 days Ok?
I take your side in this. The 30-60 day thing is ridiculous. I probably open 5% of my purchases that soon. And don’t tell me 6 or 12 or 24 months later, you can’t possibly pursue a refund from the responsible parties.
A few months ago, I emailed Wine Exchange that I had a corked bottle of 2014 Chanin S&B pinot and I offered to bring it in. They said no need and credited the purchase price to my account.
Like most of you, I’m too lazy to keep records and pursue refunds, even though I realize we are enabling the cork industry’s failings by doing so.
But I would be irked by Brian’s situation. At least try to do something to make it better or to keep a customer. Offer half the price back as a store credit or something. And if Brian is asking for that every other month and it seems suspect, then you can draw a line.
This.
Though to be fair, corked sometimes is used very broadly by less savvy wine drinkers to describe an ‘off’ bottle. Generally an individual who has aged a wine 10+ years is likely safely within the group of wine drinkers who know corked should only apply to a TCA infection. But I can at least rationalize why the policy was described in the way it was.
I look at it this way: when we’re buying a wine intended to age, we’re essentially accepting an unfinished product and assuming the risk for any cause of failure. Caveat emptor.
A more rational system would be to buy wines when they are actually ready, ex-cellar. Hence the premium on library releases, which I take to include the cost associated with assuring ideal provenance as well as ‘insurance’ if it’s corked or damaged. But then we often feel sticker shock when comparing to the initial release price.
So in the end, I conclude it’s hard to find logic in our collective practices. And in any case, the true solution is Stelvin closures, but again those closures are blocked by anti-science sentiment in favor of tradition . . . . which circles back to the lack of logic in collective practices.
Yes. Would I be shocked if they didn’t replace it or offer me a refund? No. However, it’s almost like buying meat or produce from a grocery store, getting home and realizing it’s already gone bad (or was inedible in the first place). It’s just not what you paid for. While this issue gets trickier with wine due to the fact that the defect often isn’t discoverable until it is opened many years after purchase, I don’t think that’s an excuse for a winery or retailer to be able to sell you a defective product.
Pretty much how I feel. I would just chalk it up to bad luck. I would feel very uncomfortable asking for a refund/replacement after that long.
+2
It is a rare rare thing when I bring a wine back. I’ve done it like twice in my life. Last time was Chambers from an Italian cellar sale where a 30+ year old Barbaresco was massively corked. I opened it within 6 weeks of purchase, I’m a 20+ year client, and they have a great return policy. And then, I only asked for credit. I look at this as assumption of the risk, the inherent cost of the hobby. I’m cool with that, but then again, I prefer real cork as well.
I purchased a 1997 Lokoya from the winery on release, and opened it in 2015 only to discover it was corked. I was no longer on the mailing list, but called the winery just out of curiosity. They replaced it with a 2011 version of the same wine. While clearly a less popular vintage, I thought it was an extremely generous response.
Even more impressively, I once gave a bottle of Abreu to someone, and when they opened it several years later, they concluded it was off. They called Abreu (which I thought was inappropriate), Abreu called me to verify that I had given them the bottle, and then sent them a replacement. I thought that was exceptional customer service.
PA’s PLCB had an evergreen return policy and made wholesalers give a credit for any return. Dresser stopped doing business with the PLCB when they demanded a credit for an old bottle. How is the retailer/distributor supposed to know how it was stored, a particular problem with microorganisms. The PLCB now has a 30 day return policy.
Obviously TCA is not a 30 day or 30 year problem. Ya got it or ya don’t. I could almost see a policy that you can’t return a bottle for TCA unless you bought it at least 10 years ago ![[stirthepothal.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/f/f40faec63ca1018898a40805efbf9f0066a3d205.gif "[stirthepothal.gif]"){kind=small}
.
I vividly remember a house evacuation after the cork was pulled on a bottle of 1964 La Mission Haut Brion. Bottle poured down the drain, cold water running full blast, every window in the house thrown open, we still didn’t go back inside for half an hour, this during winter.
I also remember the PLCB ‘evergreen’ policy. Being billed back for a half bottle of 1989 Grans-Fassian Trittenheimer Apotheke TBA in the mid-2000s. I paid. I did not contact the winery.
IIRC, I still have one of these in my cellar. Think I’ll open it on the back porch sometime soon.
Dan Kravitz
FWIW I opened an 08 Feather at the end of February. It was the last of four bottles. As soon as I opened it up it was obviously horribly corked. I poured it out and opened up something else.
(I hesitate to put this post in this thread, rather than creating a separate thread for it, but I believe it’s not inappropriate to post here, as it’s regarding the bottle that ultimately caused me to discovery L.A. Wine Co’s TCA returns policy.)
I received the following email back from the contact I emailed at the winery (again, Long Shadows winery, out of Washington):
Hi Brian,
Typically we don’t replace 10+ year-old bottles that weren’t purchased directly from the winery. It’s too hard to know what conditions the bottles were stored under or how long they were on the shelf.
However, these are different times, and I think now more than ever it’s important to be opening and enjoying delicious wines. Please send me your home address and we’ll ship you a bottle of our current vintage Feather Cabernet Sauvignon…our treat.
Kudos to Long Shadows! ![[cheers.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/0/0ff9bfcdb0964982cd3240b6159868fbdf215b1a.gif "cheers"){kind=small}
I’m glad this ends well. But I’ll still buy wine from la wine company. And I’ll also buy from Long Shadows!
Be nice to donate the value of the bottle to some Covid19 charity. Pay it forward.
Glad it worked out.
TL;DR
Unreasonable dude shames reasonable wine store over not taking back cheap wine bought 10+ years ago and somehow manages to get replacement from winery to avoid backlash.
Gotta love the internet
I have already donated to some COVID-related charities, but thank you for the entirely appropriate move of suggesting I should donate more.
Geez, I posted the winery’s response only to let it be known that they gave me good customer service, as I believe good customer service deserves recognition.
A lot of incorrect assumptions being made in this thread…
Good to hear and I think that’s the way to do it, going direct to the bottling/corking source. They have higher margins than the retailers and all the responsibility.
If we’re talking about an irreplaceable bottles of La Tache, that’s one thing. But shaming the store and reaching out to the winery and feeling entitled to get a replacement on your $30 bottle from 13 years ago is ridiculous. Write it off as a loss, this (low) risk comes with the hobby.
+1