Thanks Doug. I did read quite far back. Seems there were hopeful members that had charges temporarily removed while investigation is in process. That’s where I’m at now minus the hopeful part. Not sure I read any posts where case was closed by cc in their favor on an older than 60 day charge.
D Bekhor
I see. I must have misunderstood what was said. I hope this somehow turns out okay for you.
David-
I posted this above but after my conversation with AmEx there is no way to dispute charges now because of Premier Cru’s merchant agreement which is open ended. You have to wait until PC says they cannot deliver your futures. And they are not saying that. So until you have proof that they cannot deliver (i.e. They go out of business) you have to hold tight.
In other words, you feeling they won’t deliver isn’t good enough. PC has to say they cannot deliver.
At least that is what AmEx told me
Nice. Sort of reminds me of the Supreme Court’s opinion that the latest Disney-funded extension to the copyright expiration deadline is constitutional because “limited times” can logically refer to any time that’s less than infinity.
Bob:
You should kick your matter upstairs to the AMEX person’s supervisor because I know of two people who managed to get AMEX refunds in the last two weeks and one was quite substantial. As someone noted above, the UCC requirement for delivery is that if the time is unspecified it is within a “reasonable time” under the circumstances. A “reasonable time” for a prearrival wine would be time of release of the wine from the winery plus a maximum of 6 months (that’s assuming sea freight and at least three months worth of demurrage or other delays). In a worst case scenario, you should get someone in the industry (e.g. another retailer who has an import license, an importer (such as Adventures in Wine, or any of the various licensed California importers) or one of the qualified indusrtry consultants/experts (e.g. Maureen Downey of Chai Consulting) to provide you with a sworn declaration so stating.
Don,
Do you know how far back their open orders went?
Garrett
It might also help if you email PC and ask them to tell you when your order will be fulfilled. Presumably, you’ll get an answer along the lines we’ve seen–that they can’t give you any estimate of when your order will be fulfilled. That response, along with copies of some of the recent articles, should be helpful in creating the dispute you need on the charge.
Bruce
Garrett:
At this point I don’t have those details. A cellar consultant approached me on behalf of his two clients and asked what to do. I gave advice similar to what you saw here. The consultant reported back that they had been largely successful with Amex although it took not accepting the first “no” they were given and escalating it up the chain a bit.
Ha! I’ve just been listening to Daniel Khaneman’s Thinking: fast and slow on CD, having read it once about a year ago. Brilliant book; one of my top 10 ever.
Incredible book. Saw him speak many times when I was in college. Will teach you more about how to think about life than just about anything.
Yep! Khaneman’s writings are great and “thinking: fast and slow” is fantastic. Also, don’t miss "MisBehaving, the making of behavioral economics’ by Thaler. Great read, lots of fun examples of how irrational we are!
Following up on any experiences with VISA chargebacks/refunds. Thanks
An update in Wine Spectator:
doesn’t look like anything new other than using your CC chargebacks (which they pulled from here)
>
Bad WS article headline. PC is not closing its doors (going out of business),
but is closing only its phone lines, accounts payable, checking accounts,
e-mail inbox, and shipping dock. Its sales site and cash registers remain
wide open, especially if you want to load up on Mylar wine gift condoms.
I have some CdP on order back to December 2013 and here is my experience to date with Axex. I made an initial call and was given the frontline answer of nothing to do beyond 60 days. Then got kicked up to a supervisor who was very helpful and agreed to open a dispute…walked me through the process and the time periods involved (20 days for merchant to respond, etc etc). Checked in on my Amex over the holidays and to my surprise see that they closed the dispute because it exceeded the 60 days. Picked up the phone and after a lenghty discussion did not get very far.
So then I tried the online chat and this worked much better. Explained to the online rep that I had not received the merchandise and the pre-arrival purchase. She opened it for the entire amount, received an email confirmation within 5 minutes and this morning I received another email saying that the full amount has been provisionally removed from my bill. Now will need to see the final outcome, but Amex told me that if the merchant does not reply then the credit becomes permanent…and from what people have been posting it sounds as if PC is not replying.
When I picked up wine on Christmas Eve, there were at least a dozen employee cars in the parking lot (including a brand new Corvette). Why keep these employees on the payroll if they are closing down operations? Perhaps attempting a chapter 11 reorg?
I’d like to give them the benefit of the doubt that selling the storefront and the house are intended to try and get the business out from the hole it seems to be in.
Hard to believe they can fill all those orders though even with that cash infusion.
Anybody receive anything lately? Is there word of further arrivals? Is Da Nile a river in Egypt?
Just received a shipping invoice. From the dollar amount I assume it’s for four bottles of Jadot 2009 Beaune 150th Anniversary Cuvee, ordered 3/12/12.