Moving Past Veuve: Initiate Me

WINE TALK
21

Veuve is actually ok these days. The regular yellow label NV is just usually over priced since it became popular. The 08 regular vintage yellow label is actually excellent.

Perusing the Hi-Times selection since I know you’re local and their selection is a good as any around here, these are a few I would recommend trying. I think you’ll find the variety surprising and fun. These are all ‘NV’.

Andre Clouet Grand Reserve
Bollinger Special Cuvee(on the high side at $60. You can find it lower sometimes but it’s one of my favs.)
Camille Saves Rose
Gaston Chiquet Blanc de Blancs d’Ay
Hebrart Blanc de Blancs
Henri Billiot Reserve(Another fav. I’d start here if you really want that appley thing.)
Henri Goutorbe Brut Prestige
Paul Bara Rose
RH Coutier Brut Tradition

Also, Envoyer gets lots of interesting Champagnes and low prices. That’s another good source locally for exploring.

22

Bollinger Special Cuvée is one of my favorite NV champagnes, and readily available for $40 if you buy at wine.com and use one of the many $50 off $150 or $100 off $300 coupons.

23

These are all great recommendations. I’d also suggest you sign up for the Envoyer and Lopa Wine mailing lists. They both frequently offer exceptional champagnes in that price range. You’ll both thank and curse me once you fall down those rabbit holes.
I’d avoid the non-dosed extra brut ones if you like the sweetness and roundness of the Veuve, although dosage is complicated and some would still fit your palate. While you’re cursing me, splurge and buy a Tattinger Comte. It will ruin both you and your budget.
Cheers,
Warren

24

Pierre Moncuit Bland de Blancs Grand Cru NV. This is my favorite value in Champagne.

25

Is this from their most boring lots neener ?

26

[oops.gif] My fingers were just trying to do the rest of me a favor by throwing him off of the trail for the good stuff.

27

Thanks for the shopping list Chris! I definitely used to peruse Hi-Time before the shutdown, and I am on the Envoyer list, but have been uncertain about just randomly buying Champagne from either without a recommendation. I’m comfortable enough with California wines to do that, but not yet with the bubbles.

28

There are a lot of good recommendations above. I would add Frank Bonville.

Ed

29

Clicquot and some of the other wines that you mentioned are about as down-the-middle as you can get with Champagne so it is hard to say what might or might not be better to you.

I would go to a wine shop that has a decent Champagne selection like Hi-Times and just start buying and trying bottles. There is no better way to learn. Organize up a Champagne tasting with friends and try a dozen bottles side-by-side. There are plenty of good recommendations above; you will probably love some of them, dislike some of them, and find some just kind of boring. Based on mostly drinking larger producer NVs, I don’t think you really are going to know exactly what you will like and dislike yet in Champagne.

I don’t know what Morlet Champagne you had, but their basic NV Grande Reserve was always a solid wine and usually sold around $40-$45 though was not the easiest wine to find. I don’t know how they currently handle importation, distribution, and pricing, but I would be shocked if it was outside of your price range. Morlet is a Pinot Noir heavy Champagne as is the Clicquot, there are vineyard source similarities between the two and there are also some similarities in the winemaking. It makes sense that you would enjoy both. Other producers that are likely to be silmilar would be those who have a lot of grapes coming from the Southern Montagne de Reims and the very eastern end of the Marne Valley (aka the section many now call the Grande Vallee). Wines from folks like Paul Bara, Andre Clouet, Camille Saves, Henri Billiot, Goutorbe, Geoffroy, Philiponnat, Bollinger, Chiquet, AR Lenoble, Brice, Chiquet, Hebrart, Coutier, Barnaut, Jacquesson, Pol Roger, Deutz, and Laurent-Perrier would all fit this bill and should not be too hard to find. There are plenty of others too, but don’t stick just to these folks; explore the entire region and various styles as you might surprise yourself with what you like.

Try some Blanc de Blancs, Rose, 100% Pinot Noir, 100% Pinot Meunier, vintage wines, low/no dosage, small producer, all oak aged, etc… Eventually you are going to start to develop favorites. Just don’t let anyone tell you that you need to follow any strict script. Big/small producer, high/normal/low/no dosage, maloclatic/no malolactic, steel/oak, blended rose/macerated rose, etc… There are good wines of all kinds out there. Explore!

30

While I agree with these recommendations, I too am a bit concerned about availability. But Hi-Time and Envoyer give you access to a ton of names outside of the big brands.

31

Living in Coto you are a 10 to 15 minute drive to Envoyer so no shipping costs and easy to go back for more. It seems like a no brainer to start trying single bottles of grower champagnes to find others you like. Listen to your own pallette not someone elses

32

good choice at an excellent price.

33

I love Marshall’s grower list, and the Lassaigne LVDM and Bereche are two of my favorites(pretty close to our house wines…) also Deibolt-Vallois BdB, Doyard BdB, and Pierre Moncuit make wines we absolutely love at very reasonable pricing.

34

33 posts to get to Deibolt-Vallois? Shame!

35

How did Veuve get to its status anyway? Was it quality or marketing? There are so many other big Champagne houses that aren’t nearly as famous or recognized by the wider audience [scratch.gif]

36

I give a +1 to Delamotte, Hebrart, Tattinger

37

Expand your horizons. $42.95 at JJ Buckley ( I have no affiliation) Baby brother to Salon and worth every penny. More complex than the simpler styles of Champagne. I think they tend to get overlooked because of Salon flagship. Entire line is interesting.

38

Bryan, here are a few things to look at if you go to Hitime. The first three bottles below would all be a good survey into different grapes, as well as perceived sweetness levels. And, these are all priced similar to that of what you would pay for Veuve. Enjoy the journey.

https://www.hitimewine.net/mousse-brut-l-or-d-eugene-blanc-de-noirs-i-377242.html

https://www.hitimewine.net/vilmart-14-brut-grande-reserve-1er-cru-i-377201.html

https://www.hitimewine.net/chartogne-taillet-brut-sainte-anne-i-374657.html

https://www.hitimewine.net/marguet-exra-brut-15-shaman-grand-cru-i-378504.html

https://www.hitimewine.net/mousse-2012-extra-brut-terres-d-illite-blanc-de-noirs-i-374357.html

39

and greg always has stuff on the shelf for sale to walk-ins.

Call ahead for a list

40

I actually find a lot of similarities between the Delamotte NV (blend of all three grapes, not the BdB) and the Veuve NV. The Delamotte comes across as a bit lighter and slightly more elegant but the both have a similar character in regards to the Pinot grapes. While Delamotte is seen as the sibling to Salon, it is important to remember that Laurent-Perrier owns both and only Salon really stands on its own. Delamotte is much closer to Laurent-Perrier than it is to Salon. Laurent-Perrier’s newly reformulated and renamed NV - La Cuvee is also pretty darn good and on paper is very, very similar to the Delamotte NV. I prefer the Laurent-Perrier and wonder exactly who gets what when it comes time to blend.