If you have 250 or more btls in your cellar, why are u not on CT?

[craig_v]

Here’s one more key reason why I love CT. I don’t drink the next btl too soon.

I mostly buy 2-4 btls of everything. For me, that means I need to be careful not to drink the next btl too soon so I can let it evolve and change for an appropriate amount of time based on that btl. I’ll usually pop the first btl within 90 days of my purchase for fun and to assess its future aging potential. I’ll write a note along with a possible next opening timeframe. When I wing it, I found myself drinking something I drank only a year previously. Not the end of the world but its a lot more fun to open an '02 Mugnier I bought 13 years ago when its at its nearer to its potential peak rather than accidentally drink it too soon or deplete my btls too soon.

[Neal.Mollen]

I primarily input on the mobile app, e.g. I’m receiving deliveries and inputting them at a remote storage site. I make some bulk updates on desktop via the site, e.g. I’m at home and prepping to move a bunch of stuff into storage, but that’s a minority. The ‘shopping cart’ functionality helps, but it’s desktop only.

Overall it seems like your domain model is well structured, but the UX of your app is suboptimal, especially for bulk operations. Even if you just made the hierarchy under wine definition or just the vintage or producer name clickable, that would go a long way towards improving the multi-input experience.

The mobile app is for pulling a bottle, checking a note, it is not meant for bulk manipulation and operation you are correct.

The desktop version is a monster… 99.9999% of the time when someone says “CT can’t”, on a desktop version, it’s user error / lack of know how.
the mobile app has a long way to go to catch up to desktop functionality, but like i said, i use it mainly to consume a bottle, check a note, and look at inventory here and there.

The criticism here is totally fair. There are still way too many things one can only do in desktop, and the mobile app design predated bigger screens and needs to scale better across a wider range of form factors. We are just lining up a designer to kick off a mobile refresh. As Mark notes, right now the mobile app is better as a companion, but in a world of many mobile-first and mobile-only users we need to do way better.

Not only is the advice below unsolicited, it is ill-informed, coming from someone who currently uses only 1/100th of CT’s functionality but . . . .

Don’t let your redesign for the mobile app get carried away. Too often, in my opinion, designers keep adding features and functionalities until the app becomes bloated and difficult to navigate to do the simple things. The mobile app, it seems to me, is best used for doing simple things when away from your laptop/desktop. If those simple things become more difficult/less intuitive in the process of adding more complex functionalities, the trade off is not worth it.

Just my 2 cents

[Neal.Mollen]

Why should I?

I have an access file made of my own that I can sort exactly to my needs … I´m pretty sure with CT I cannot do this as well.
Moreover: the most work is to type in my purchased bottles and (still more challenging) to delete the emptied bottles … a work I´m trying to do in my own file with more or less success … to change everything into CT would cost me a month of daily 10 hours … sorry.

BTW: I´m registered on CT - but not with my wines, only to follow some TN.

Just FYI, the typing bit is SO much easier in CT, because someone has almost always already created the entry for the wine before you go to enter. I have had to actually type in maybe 1-2 wines in the many years I have used CT. Maybe that is the answer to your question “why should I.”

[Blake_Brown]

CT is gold IMHO.

[Mike_Maguire]

Never have felt the need, probably my age but I know where every bottle is and consumption window.

[Gerhard_P]

Why should I?

I have an access file made of my own that I can sort exactly to my needs … I´m pretty sure with CT I cannot do this as well.
Moreover: the most work is to type in my purchased bottles and (still more challenging) to delete the emptied bottles … a work I´m trying to do in my own file with more or less success … to change everything into CT would cost me a month of daily 10 hours … sorry.

BTW: I´m registered on CT - but not with my wines, only to follow some TN.

Just FYI, the typing bit is SO much easier in CT, because someone has almost always already created the entry for the wine before you go to enter. I have had to actually type in maybe 1-2 wines in the many years I have used CT. Maybe that is the answer to your question “why should I.”

Why should I use weeks of work to enter x-000s of bottles when I have them already in my home file?
(… because YOU want to know about them?)

Nothing against CT … maybe perfect for many people, e.g. those who don´t have already an inventory …

[Anton_D]

I also can’t imagine not using CT to keep track of my cellar. Then again, I also have zero unread emails in my inbox, so it may be a personality thing.

I’ve been meaning to get to that…

[Mark_Y]

I’ve been meaning to get to that…

You have 7 pages of app?! is it because you put one app in a folder and call it “productivity”?

[Neal.Mollen]

Why should I?

I have an access file made of my own that I can sort exactly to my needs … I´m pretty sure with CT I cannot do this as well.
Moreover: the most work is to type in my purchased bottles and (still more challenging) to delete the emptied bottles … a work I´m trying to do in my own file with more or less success … to change everything into CT would cost me a month of daily 10 hours … sorry.

BTW: I´m registered on CT - but not with my wines, only to follow some TN.

Just FYI, the typing bit is SO much easier in CT, because someone has almost always already created the entry for the wine before you go to enter. I have had to actually type in maybe 1-2 wines in the many years I have used CT. Maybe that is the answer to your question “why should I.”

Why should I use weeks of work to enter x-000s of bottles when I have them already in my home file?
(… because YOU want to know about them?)

Nothing against CT … maybe perfect for many people, e.g. those who don´t have already an inventory …

My account is private. No one can see it but me.

And you should do exactly and precisely what you want to do. I’m not trying to talk you into anything. I am just reacting to your comment that the hardest thing about your current setup is typing in the name of the wines you buy; that is not something you have to do on cellartracker. That’s all.

[Mattstolz]

If you have 250 or more btls in your cellar, why are u not on CT??? Or at least have a reliable spreadsheet of your own???

I organize a local monthly wine group dinner. And pretty much every month, the last few guys to post their wines for an event, are guys with cellars over 1000 btls but with no means to track what they own. And, these are really smart people. Most of them pretty technology savvy to boot. When asked in the past they expressed the perceived challenge of of; tally, organizing and loading their cellars on the front end. One guy expressed concern over needing to contribute the expected annual donation. He’s pretty tightfisted. These concerns are not without merit but after you’ve accumulated 250 btls +, keeping track of what you have so you can drink them within their window, becomes very difficult. Plus how do you avoid not completely forgetting to drink something before it starts to fall off? Especially once you have 500 plus blts? It becomes very difficult and time consuming to rummage though racks and boxes looking for something you think you still own but drank a couple years ago. Plus, you’re holding up my event thread .

ok I just have to ask: how can someone too tightfisted to cough up $25 A YEAR for CT even accumulate a 250+ bottle cellar? thats just a drop in the bucket if those wines are anything above 20 cases of yellowtail.

[Gerhard_P]

Just FYI, the typing bit is SO much easier in CT, because someone has almost always already created the entry for the wine before you go to enter. I have had to actually type in maybe 1-2 wines in the many years I have used CT. Maybe that is the answer to your question “why should I.”

Why should I use weeks of work to enter x-000s of bottles when I have them already in my home file?
(… because YOU want to know about them?)

Nothing against CT … maybe perfect for many people, e.g. those who don´t have already an inventory …

My account is private. No one can see it but me.

And you should do exactly and precisely what you want to do. I’m not trying to talk you into anything. I am just reacting to your comment that the hardest thing about your current setup is typing in the name of the wines you buy; that is not something you have to do on cellartracker. That’s all.

There are a lot of wines on CT that actually do not exist … (just one example: La Romanee/Bouchard P&F before 1976 or after 2005 - or La Romanee/Liger-Belair before 2002) and also many wines are missing that do exist.

One of the most important things of my own file is the possibility to have all wines in the exact order I wanna have them …
I doubt that´s possible on CT (as well as on other systems).

[Mark_Y]

There are a lot of wines on CT that actually do not exist … (just one example: La Romanee/Bouchard P&F before 1976 or after 2005 - or La Romanee/Liger-Belair before 2002) and also many wines are missing that do exist.

So create them? how do you think what’s in CT got there in the first place?

[Neal.Mollen]

Why should I use weeks of work to enter x-000s of bottles when I have them already in my home file?
(… because YOU want to know about them?)

Nothing against CT … maybe perfect for many people, e.g. those who don´t have already an inventory …

My account is private. No one can see it but me.

And you should do exactly and precisely what you want to do. I’m not trying to talk you into anything. I am just reacting to your comment that the hardest thing about your current setup is typing in the name of the wines you buy; that is not something you have to do on cellartracker. That’s all.

There are a lot of wines on CT that actually do not exist … (just one example: La Romanee/Bouchard P&F before 1976 or after 2005 - or La Romanee/Liger-Belair before 2002) and also many wines are missing that do exist.

One of the most important things of my own file is the possibility to have all wines in the exact order I wanna have them …
I doubt that´s possible on CT (as well as on other systems).

Gerhard, you seem to think I am trying to talk you into something. I promise I am not. You should do whatever you want.

But you said that the biggest problem you have with your current system is the need to type in the wines.
You wouldn’t have to do that with the vast majority of wines available for sale. I am quite sure there are wines that aren’t currently in the CT database and you would have to add them. But the ones that are there are there.

As for how the wines are displayed, you can sort by grape, region, sub-region, vintage, bottle size, cellar location, producer, drink start date, drink by date, or by a dozen or more other details. It is hard to imagine the option you are looking for isn’t there, but like I said, you do you.

[Anton_D]

ok I just have to ask: how can someone too tightfisted to cough up $25 A YEAR for CT even accumulate a 250+ bottle cellar? thats just a drop in the bucket if those wines are anything above 20 cases of yellowtail.

If it were needed to help a fellow Berserker, I’d pay 4 times that not to have to inventory my cellar.

Not being cheap, just something that would make things less fun, for me, if I had to do that. I favor it for anyone who likes to do it!

Now, keep in mind this is coming from a person who doesn’t need to take his cellar along with him when he goes out to eat, either.

Different corks for different dorks!

[Gerhard_P]

My account is private. No one can see it but me.

And you should do exactly and precisely what you want to do. I’m not trying to talk you into anything. I am just reacting to your comment that the hardest thing about your current setup is typing in the name of the wines you buy; that is not something you have to do on cellartracker. That’s all.

There are a lot of wines on CT that actually do not exist … (just one example: La Romanee/Bouchard P&F before 1976 or after 2005 - or La Romanee/Liger-Belair before 2002) and also many wines are missing that do exist.

One of the most important things of my own file is the possibility to have all wines in the exact order I wanna have them …
I doubt that´s possible on CT (as well as on other systems).

Gerhard, you seem to think I am trying to talk you into something. I promise I am not. You should do whatever you want.

But you said that the biggest problem you have with your current system is the need to type in the wines.
You wouldn’t have to do that with the vast majority of wines available for sale. I am quite sure there are wines that aren’t currently in the CT database and you would have to add them. But the ones that are there are there.

As for how the wines are displayed, you can sort by grape, region, sub-region, vintage, bottle size, cellar location, producer, drink start date, drink by date, or by a dozen or more other details. It is hard to imagine the option you are looking for isn’t there, but like I said, you do you.

Neal,
my reply was not solely to you, rather to the question of the TO “why are you not on CT?!”

Can I have (on CT) e.g. all Burgundy wines in geographical order from North to South? Masannay, Fixin, Gevrey … down to Maranges? Then Mercurey …? And all in vintage order? I doubt it.
Can I then scroll down and see all wines from 1919 to 2017 (in geographical order) in one file?

But the main problem is: I don´t have the time to do all again.

[Anton_D]

You have 7 pages of app?! is it because you put one app in a folder and call it “productivity”?

I didn’t even know what that little star was for until you made me look.

On that first screen, I don’t use stocks, notes, news, music, productivity, home, TV, wallet, health.

There are things on the phone I will never know what up: pages, iTunes U, Watch, podcasts, Keynote, garage band, …I think things just find their way onto the screens!

I’ve yelled at that damned phone so many times, Siri changed my own ID to “Bad Name.”

[Neal.Mollen]

There are a lot of wines on CT that actually do not exist … (just one example: La Romanee/Bouchard P&F before 1976 or after 2005 - or La Romanee/Liger-Belair before 2002) and also many wines are missing that do exist.

One of the most important things of my own file is the possibility to have all wines in the exact order I wanna have them …
I doubt that´s possible on CT (as well as on other systems).

Gerhard, you seem to think I am trying to talk you into something. I promise I am not. You should do whatever you want.

But you said that the biggest problem you have with your current system is the need to type in the wines.
You wouldn’t have to do that with the vast majority of wines available for sale. I am quite sure there are wines that aren’t currently in the CT database and you would have to add them. But the ones that are there are there.

As for how the wines are displayed, you can sort by grape, region, sub-region, vintage, bottle size, cellar location, producer, drink start date, drink by date, or by a dozen or more other details. It is hard to imagine the option you are looking for isn’t there, but like I said, you do you.

Neal,
my reply was not solely to you, rather to the question of the TO “why are you not on CT?!”

Can I have (on CT) e.g. all Burgundy wines in geographical order from North to South? Masannay, Fixin, Gevrey … down to Maranges? Then Mercurey …? And all in vintage order? I doubt it.
Can I then scroll down and see all wines from 1919 to 2017 (in geographical order) in one file?

But the main problem is: I don´t have the time to do all again.

I can’t say whether those sorts would be possible since I have never had reason to sort using the custom feature. I know you can sort by vineyard and by region, then sub-region, but I suspect the results are then sorted alphabetically, not north-to-south.

And as for the time thing, I just can’t say. I know Eric has said that there is some batch-import capability, but I have no idea how that works either.

Like you, I have no real inclination to make the investment of time to utilize 1/10th of the system’s capabilities.

[Robert.A.Jr]

ok I just have to ask: how can someone too tightfisted to cough up $25 A YEAR for CT even accumulate a 250+ bottle cellar? thats just a drop in the bucket if those wines are anything above 20 cases of yellowtail.

If it were needed to help a fellow Berserker, I’d pay 4 times that not to have to inventory my cellar.

Not being cheap, just something that would make things less fun, for me, if I had to do that. I favor it for anyone who likes to do it!

Now, keep in mind this is coming from a person who doesn’t need to take his cellar along with him when he goes out to eat, either.

Different corks for different dorks!

Anton nails it. Has nothing to do with money. Eric used the term “apathy”. Put me in that camp. I am only organized if someone does it for me. I have no desire to automatize my hobbies. Heck, I even cycle and used to race in an old-school, low-tech way, compared to engineers like Trimpi! I treat my hobbies and passions much differently that how I approach work and business.

[Neal.Mollen]

ok I just have to ask: how can someone too tightfisted to cough up $25 A YEAR for CT even accumulate a 250+ bottle cellar? thats just a drop in the bucket if those wines are anything above 20 cases of yellowtail.

If it were needed to help a fellow Berserker, I’d pay 4 times that not to have to inventory my cellar.

Not being cheap, just something that would make things less fun, for me, if I had to do that. I favor it for anyone who likes to do it!

Now, keep in mind this is coming from a person who doesn’t need to take his cellar along with him when he goes out to eat, either.

Different corks for different dorks!

Anton nails it. Has nothing to do with money. Eric used the term “apathy”. Put me in that camp. I am only organized if someone does it for me. I have no desire to automatize my hobbies. Heck, I even cycle and used to race in an old-school, low-tech way, compared to engineers like Trimpi! I treat my hobbies and passions much differently that how I approach work and business.

^^^^^

[Eric_LeVine]

ok I just have to ask: how can someone too tightfisted to cough up $25 A YEAR for CT even accumulate a 250+ bottle cellar? thats just a drop in the bucket if those wines are anything above 20 cases of yellowtail.

If it were needed to help a fellow Berserker, I’d pay 4 times that not to have to inventory my cellar.

Not being cheap, just something that would make things less fun, for me, if I had to do that. I favor it for anyone who likes to do it!

Now, keep in mind this is coming from a person who doesn’t need to take his cellar along with him when he goes out to eat, either.

Different corks for different dorks!

Anton nails it. Has nothing to do with money. Eric used the term “apathy”. Put me in that camp. I am only organized if someone does it for me. I have no desire to automatize my hobbies. Heck, I even cycle and used to race in an old-school, low-tech way, compared to engineers like Trimpi! I treat my hobbies and passions much differently that how I approach work and business.

I should qualify my statement. Of the people who want an inventory system (let’s assume that is roughly half of wine collectors), apathy and Excel are my biggest competitors. There is indeed the other “half” who strongly prefer not to have a system and feel that having a system would detract from the romance.

Keep in mind, I made CellarTracker for myself and no one else. I then let two friends use it, and at that point I realized that having 300 or 3,000 or 300,000 people using it would make things more interesting. Trust me, I cannot imagine a more specific/niche piece of software (I worked on Microsoft Office for 13 years), so I am probably more surprised than anyone at the number of people who derive utility from it.