I Think I may be Done

[MattBerto]

I would like those older folks here who continue to buy wine to remember the famous quote: “S/he who dies with the most wine, WINS”

[Neal.Mollen]

@Chris_Seiber

@Neal.Mollen

@ChrisJames

show some discipline

I believe you have answered your own question.

Actually, one recurring difference of opinion here is the ability of wines to survive for more than a day. Personally I have very rarely had a wine I wanted to drink on day 2, no matter the closure used or the temperature at which it is stored. This is especially true for wines with any age on them

As for cost, this goes back to the joy of the hunt. For non-futures wines, you have to look carefully and strike when you see a buy. Back when I was buying futures I would often specify halves, ad they are (were?) rarely significantly different in price

One thing I’ve learned on here over the years is that each of us a widely different like/tolerance of wines open past the first day. Some people leave a partial bottle sitting on the counter and love the last glass a week later, some find that they’re not really even interested in drinking the rest of a bottle on day two.

Of course, the answer depends some on the wine in question, but even when you hold that constant, there is a just an infinite spectrum of how people perceive and enjoy wine after day 1. Even more than just how much we like wines in general.

Personally, I’m not at either extreme, but I’m closer to the “I tend to like it less each day after the first day” side of the spectrum.

Neal, I assume you’ve tried all the best practices for reducing the diminishment of wine after the first night? There are lots of opinions out there – mine is that if you pour an amount into a smaller container (an old 375 ml bottle, but you could use a water bottle, glass medical type bottle like we all used for Covid tastings, etc.) right after you first uncork the bottle and fill it to the very top and seal, then stick that bottle in the fridge, that provides you with the maximum preservation of the wine.

It’s still not totally the same or going to hold a long time, since the pouring into the new container introduces oxygen and that acts on the wine even in its refrigerated and sealed state. But it seems like the closest thing to me, other than Coravin, to the extent that works for you.

Yes, I have including a disposable plastic stopper with a peel off tab on the business end which is supposed to bring the wine in contact with some substance/gas/pixie dust that keeps the wine for a significant duration. None has done much to keep the wine “fresh” until the next day.

I 100% agree that opinions here on the subject occupy every point on the compass and they are all correct for those who hold them.

[Michae1_P0wers]

Definitely true as to personal preference Chris. I also tend to fall on the side of preferring most reds on the first day. They may require a lot of air on that day, but it’s still usually best for me. I believe I’m rather sensitive to oxidized flavors in red wine. It is far less common but not unheard of for me to find a very young and structured wine better on day two. I don’t believe I’ve ever encountered a red wine I enjoyed more on day three than days 1-2.

Whites are different. Dry whites I often find they hold at very close to the same enjoyment level over a few days assuming the bottle is mostly full or the wine is placed into a smaller vessel. Sweet whites hold better still, and I have encountered Rieslings which seem better after a few days. Hard to say, however, whether that is actually do to improvement vs. something like mood, food, or mood.

[Chris_Seiber]

@Michae1_P0wers

Definitely true as to personal preference Chris. I also tend to fall on the side of preferring most reds on the first day. They may require a lot of air on that day, but it’s still usually best for me. I believe I’m rather sensitive to oxidized flavors in red wine. It is far less common but not unheard of for me to find a very young and structured wine better on day two. I don’t believe I’ve ever encountered a red wine I enjoyed more on day three than days 1-2.

Whites are different. Dry whites I often find they hold at very close to the same enjoyment level over a few days assuming the bottle is mostly full or the wine is placed into a smaller vessel. Sweet whites hold better still, and I have encountered Rieslings which seem better after a few days. Hard to say, however, whether that is actually do to improvement vs. something like mood, food, or mood.

I agree 100% on the reds v whites distinction. And that sweet whites do even better. I think nothing of leaving a partial bottle of chardonnay recorked in the fridge for a couple of days.

I expect that’s also a highly subjective perception, but I also would guess a much higher percentage of us would prefer white wines after day one as compared to reds.

@Neal.Mollen , how do you do with white wines after day one?

[Neal.Mollen]

@Chris_Seiber

@Michae1_P0wers

Definitely true as to personal preference Chris. I also tend to fall on the side of preferring most reds on the first day. They may require a lot of air on that day, but it’s still usually best for me. I believe I’m rather sensitive to oxidized flavors in red wine. It is far less common but not unheard of for me to find a very young and structured wine better on day two. I don’t believe I’ve ever encountered a red wine I enjoyed more on day three than days 1-2.

Whites are different. Dry whites I often find they hold at very close to the same enjoyment level over a few days assuming the bottle is mostly full or the wine is placed into a smaller vessel. Sweet whites hold better still, and I have encountered Rieslings which seem better after a few days. Hard to say, however, whether that is actually do to improvement vs. something like mood, food, or mood.

I agree 100% on the reds v whites distinction. And that sweet whites do even better. I think nothing of leaving a partial bottle of chardonnay recorked in the fridge for a couple of days.

I expect that’s also a highly subjective perception, but I also would guess a much higher percentage of us would prefer white wines after day one as compared to reds.

@Neal.Mollen , how do you do with white wines after day one?

An excellent and important distinction. We have often held unfinished whites until the next day without degradation similar to red wines. Of course we don’t drink much still white wine, and champagne never lasts to day 2 anyway. (Plus it is easy to get great champagnes in half bottles)

[Chris_Seiber]

@Neal.Mollen

(Plus it is easy to get great champagnes in half bottles)

I wish I found that to be the case, but I haven’t.

Or maybe it’s more that I think I can find very common high production Champagne in half bottles, but none of the geekier stuff.

Do You Buy Champagne In Half Bottles?

never. ever, ever. i’m still surprised Krug hasn’t retired this given how the wine shows in this format.

I did just order six Roederer 24whatever in half bottles. It’s really nice to have those when you just want a glass or two before still wines, before heading out to dinner, or whatever.

[Neal.Mollen]

@Chris_Seiber

@Neal.Mollen

(Plus it is easy to get great champagnes in half bottles)

I wish I found that to be the case, but I haven’t.

Or maybe it’s more that I think I can find very common high production Champagne in half bottles, but none of the geekier stuff.

Do You Buy Champagne In Half Bottles? - #6 by ybarselah

I did just order six Roederer 24whatever in half bottles. It’s really nice to have those when you just want a glass or two before still wines, before heading out to dinner, or whatever.

Yes, I should have been more precise. I have loads of excellent champagne in half bottles. I am never at pains to find something I want to drink. But you are likely going to have a harder time finding the limited production growers (looking at you Cedric Bouchard) in half bottles. But then, it is difficult to imagine an occasion worthy of such a wine where I would not want to finish the bottle

[Scott_G_r_u_n_e_r]

@Mike_Cohen

I recall opening a bottle of 2000 Beaucastel for a friend last year. My friend likes wine a lot but doesn’t have a cellar. He was excited to try a bottle that was 22 years old. While we were drinking it, I asked him to be honest what he thought about it and he said it was good, but nothing special. And frankly I agreed with him.

Complete opposite reaction with a 98 recently

[Mike_Cohen]

@Scott_G_r_u_n_e_r

@Mike_Cohen

I recall opening a bottle of 2000 Beaucastel for a friend last year. My friend likes wine a lot but doesn’t have a cellar. He was excited to try a bottle that was 22 years old. While we were drinking it, I asked him to be honest what he thought about it and he said it was good, but nothing special. And frankly I agreed with him.

Complete opposite reaction with a 98 recently

Love it!

[Neal.Mollen]

@Mike_Cohen

@Scott_G_r_u_n_e_r

@Mike_Cohen

I recall opening a bottle of 2000 Beaucastel for a friend last year. My friend likes wine a lot but doesn’t have a cellar. He was excited to try a bottle that was 22 years old. While we were drinking it, I asked him to be honest what he thought about it and he said it was good, but nothing special. And frankly I agreed with him.

Complete opposite reaction with a 98 recently

Love it!

And I’ve had a 98 Donjon in the last year that was gorgeous.

[Chris_Seiber]

@Neal.Mollen

@Mike_Cohen

@Scott_G_r_u_n_e_r

@Mike_Cohen

I recall opening a bottle of 2000 Beaucastel for a friend last year. My friend likes wine a lot but doesn’t have a cellar. He was excited to try a bottle that was 22 years old. While we were drinking it, I asked him to be honest what he thought about it and he said it was good, but nothing special. And frankly I agreed with him.

Complete opposite reaction with a 98 recently

Love it!

And I’ve had a 98 Donjon in the last year that was gorgeous.

Which I think again goes to show what most of us have figured out over the years – the taste of aged wine generally, and specific aged wines, is different. That difference is better to some of us, worse to some of us, it just depends on what you like.

[Jonathan_Loesberg]

I thought you decided you didn’t like CdP’s 15-20 years ago. Maybe you just don’t like young CdP’s.

[JIMCOH]

Along this older wine portion of this, I am drinking a 98 Ravenswood Gregory Merlot right now. It has a small touch of funk, but it is a wonderful, not in your face, merlot that I know will be dead in the fridge before morning.

[Neal.Mollen]

@Jonathan_Loesberg

I thought you decided you didn’t like CdP’s 15-20 years ago. Maybe you just don’t like young CdP’s.

I (just about) stopped buying CDP after the 98 vintage because the alcohol and sweetness levels had reached the point where I no longer enjoyed them

[Jeff_Cassetta]

I hear you…that was my mantra, then some good income years and 2018/19 Bdx. But I haven’t brought any 2020. I’m done, I’m done…

[JBrochu]

@Mike_Cohen

So for @Tariq_K who has amassed a nice sized collection in a short period of time, I’d suggest that you have a couple of potential issues that face you. First is figuring out preferred drinking windows. Do you like Bordeaux with 5,10,15,20,25 years of age? Second is that a large percentage of your bottles will be within their drinking window at the same time. This isn’t ideal IMHO as it will cause you to hang onto a bunch beyond their ideal drinking window. Third is what to do when you want to grab a bottle from the cellar to drink tonight but realize that the vast majority are too young. Last, when someone amasses a large cellar in a short period I think it’s reasonable to ask if the chase is more important than the wine and what do I do about that?

This assumes the collection amassed quickly is comprised mostly of recent vintages. My own collection was acquired relatively quickly (mostly over the past 4 years) but I bought a mix of library wines, young drinkers from newer vintages, and wines from newer vintages that should age for a long time.

[David_Bu3ker]

As in exploding? If so, yes, a thousand times yes.

[Jeff_Bryant]

@Terry_H_a_r_r_i_s

Plus, with the cellar in the home one gets to go down to the cellar and rearrange bottles every week or so . . . . Really good exercise for those of us who are OCD

Anytime my wife is looking for me in the house and can’t find me she knows im in the cellar

[Jonathan_Loesberg]

I can see this. I noticed the change with the 98 vintage. But it is true that global warming change CdP at some point near of after the beginning of the 21st century.

[Robert.A.Jr]

I’m holding the line, too. So far. Only through 2019! Not even looking at 2020 Bordeaux!