I was saying that the actual pH number is NOT subjective - not that you will objectively like wines at, below or above a certain number.
But yes, it is just a number, like alcohol levels. Though with pH, you also need to take into account TA - you can have a high pH and a high TA and the wine will not come across as lush . . .
Cheers
There was a faith-healer of Deal,
Who said: "Although pain isn’t real,
If I sit on a pin
And it punctures my skin,
I dislike what I fancy I feel.’
Relevant to this discussion, have you guys seen the release email today from Once & Future by Joel Peterson? The information on each SVD is fantastic, lots of details, including the back label with specific information about things like alcohol and pH, case size, etc. And it is clear that he does not just slap an arbitrary number for ABV, every single bottle has a different percentage designated. Major kudos to him in my book, I’m a buyer.
This might surprise people, but Kosta Browne is a winery that has always given detailed specs online for every wine they make.
For example, their 2022 Willamette Valley Pinot Noir, from their website:
VINEYARD L’Angolo, Eola Springs, Shea, Arlyn, Ribbon Ridge, Giving Tree, Zenith, Thoma, Holmes, Chestnut
CLONES Wädenswil, Mt. Eden, Swan, 114, 115, 667, 777, 943, 1A, Pommard
TRELLISING VSP
SOIL Combination of Jory (volcanic soil), Mustard-tinted Willakenzie (marine-sediment), and Laurelwood (loess & silt)
FERMENTATION 100% stainless steel, 5% whole cluster
ÉLEVAGE 32% new French oak for 13 months
ALCOHOL 13.5%
pH 3.68
TA 5.36 g/L
They used to archive all the spec sheets for every past bottling and vintage, but I’m not sure if those are still on there.
That’s great! The Ridge website has all this data as well. Love that these wineries do that. And even link critics notes and put out their own notes and suggested drinking windows
Dustin thanks for your insightful and informative posts in this thread. It does beg the question, how will you label/report ABV and pH on your own wine?
I remember a discussion on this board of how not all alcohols in wine are created equal, and that over a certain level there are perhaps more deleterious effects due to difference in the alcohol itself. Not exactly certain about the scientific validity, but I thought it was interesting and could see some merit in that based on my own experience.
Larry,
I have not finalized blends and have lots from 14.4 - 15.2 and ph from 3.7 - 3.83. We picked looking for more elegance and freshness and everything in the cellar came in with brix that hypothetically should have made a wine under 14.5 but we had some higher conversions than expected (more in 23 vs 22) as well as having had a touch of cellar creep during elevage.
Dustin
Yeasts?
Correct. Some yeasts converted higher than expected
They sell a large portion of the wines overseas. You’d be surprised how many high end Napa Valley Cabernets/Blends are not sold here in the States.
I did not know that, but it makes sense. If you’re rich enough to set up shop in Napa, you may well have a house or houses in other countries, as well as friends and associates also in the top 100th of 1%. And if you’re production is really small, you don’t really need to ‘sell’ it.
Did you run glucose and fructose numbers prior to fermentation began or are you just basing things on brix numbers? And are you inoculating or going uninoculated?
Cheers
Saw in an article, Hyde, Ritchie and Antinori Antica Vineyards for the Chards.
They’re also making a Cabernet Sauvignon from the Vangone vineyard (surprised me to say the least) and their website is up and running now.
A bit like Australia exporting “big flavor” Shiraz in the 1990s.
At a minimum, they are doing a great job with PR 
From their website for the 2021 Cabernet Sauvignon Vangone Vineyard
Alcohol: 15.7 %
TA: 5.8
pH: 3.99
Fining: None
Barrel Regimen: 100% new French oak, 22 months
Harvest Date: Oct. 6, 2021
Bottling Date: Aug. 31, 2023
Case Production: 50
Kinda funny. An acquaintance and his dad own that vineyard. They owned a great wine shop down here that the son ran but got tired of that business and bought a vineyard to start their own winery. Good people.
That’s super cool and I know Sam Kaplan makes an excellent Cabernet Sauvignon for them.