He has winemakers lined up to buy his “overpriced” grapes. He’s not holding them hostage.
1 Like
Or to put it a little more strongly, the fact that you paid inordinate amounts for Beckstoffer grapes, and then put 15.7% on the label clearly speaks volumes about the approach to winemaking. 15.7% will all but obliterate any terroir from the final wine, so basically you might as well get lesser juice, because it would be hard to taste the difference. Maybe the terroir does show in Priorat, I have not tasted more than a couple and was irked by the alcohol, but definitely not in California.
I am curious why one would put 15.7% on the label if it is less. If it is a lot less than that, and you are going after the alcohol mavens, they will be disappointed, and that is not a good thing if you are trying to hawk a new wine.
One final thought. Who determined the sugar levels when the grapes were harvested? Winemaker or grower?
4 Likes
That is obviously still true.
However in another generation or two, Napa will clearly be too hot to grow Cabernet; Grenache will be the iconic grape… until it gets too hot for Grenache and the entire valley floor is replanted to Palomino.
It obliterates the variety character as well. On Thursday I had the 2017 Dalla Valle Maya, labeled at over 15%. The blend is 40% Cab Franc. One would never be able to tell. Even the critics notes make that clear. Jeb highlights scorched earth, crème de cassis and chocolate; LPB finds Black Forest Cake and blueberry compote; Decanter highlights coffee and mulberry; Suckling finds plums and chocolate.
This is not Cab Franc. I also did not find it drinkable.
And it was $1000 on the restaurant list. My client loved it, so there is that.
3 Likes
Perhaps Beckstoffer terroir is the overripeness, as almost all Beckstoffers have that characteristic.
ripeness is fairly subjective.
with that said, there is no beckstoffer terroir. that’s just a laughable concept. i hope you were being sarcastic actually.
i believe in santa more than beckstoffer terroir.
1 Like
I was not being sarcastic. I do not drink wines from Rutherford. I am dumbfounded by the news that some idiot is paying the equivalent of $225 to fill a bottle of wine, with grapes that are in no way unique.
1 Like
Whenever somebody asks me about getting into the wine biz, I ask them what they would do that would be unique. Nobody says, I am going to make a world class computer. People try to find a niche in the market.
What is the point of another wine from a famous vineyard already sourced by people with more experience and track record ??
IMNHO the secret is finding a place where land is undervalued and making something out of it. Before he made a real fortune with golf clubs, Eli Callaway did this in Temecula. He did well when he sold the winery. Look at the Brothers Daou? Ok, think of Jim Clendenen who did very well making chardonnay in a then barely known region.
I might add, you can buy great Chardonnay from ABC for under $90…a lot under!
I have enjoyed many cabernet based wines from Sonoma county that don’t have the characteristics that Napa hater hate, like high prices! I can’t believe you cannot find land in Sonoma suitable for cabernet at a workable price.
About pricing: having. read a few books on the subject I have come to the conclusion that if you went to a big company and said, I can create world peace and end global warming for a grant of five million, then would say, we will think about it. But if you said, I can increase your pricing by 1%, they would build you a campus.
2 Likes
Unless you consider 15.5% alc, 100% new French oak and a famous consulting winemaker terroir, as that would definitely fit most Beckstoffer wines.
You can, but that kind of misses the point, which depends upon the goal. That may not necessarily be to create a moderately-priced (relatively) Cabernet that appeals to a particular set of drinkers (a winemaker’s wine?). If the goal is to create a product in order to gain access to the “wine lifestyle” in your later years (and I say that totally without judgment, really), then you probably go balls deep.
Well here is his Mr Epprights previous wine endeavor where the stock picture was taken for the article.
https://www.kalewines.com/people
I find this quote just humorous
“It goes back to this vanity crap and hopefully, someday, there’s an end to it….”
All while not seeing/understanding that he is the problem. what value are these people adding to the equation.
Andy Beckstoffer is taking them for an absolute ride and imo educated enthusiasts shouldn’t be oblivious to that tax when making our wine buying decisions.
2 Likes
From another thread
This makes me think of a very old ATT commercial…
“When can I be a client?”
1 Like
You misspelled “terror.”
I don’t mean to thread drift, and I know the alcohol discussion has been had many times over but labeled alcohol really doesn’t mean much because only on very rare occasions do the labeled number match what is in the bottle (at least for Napa). In my research (78 data points), there are literally only 3 producers that labeled alcohol matched the wine – (Spottswoode, Togni, Dunn) and in total only 11 were within .4% of labeled alcohol. The Avg labeled alcohol level is 14.5% (labeled) and the average real alcohol level is 15.4% with a low of 13.0% and high of 17.2%. Only 22/78 wines are below 15% alcohol.
I think even more surprising is the fact the wine that was 17.2% is labeled 14.5% and considered a darling by a critic that talks about a preference for “fresher”, terroir-driven wines. The review for the wine refers to the “purity of the fruit and sense of harmony” and states that the producer is making wines in a less extracted style than a few years prior…WOW at 17.2%!
So just want to continue to bring this up as I too was turned off by a labeled alcohol level and this research has been eye-popping to say the least. Now, I don’t care since i know very few are correct, I taste and buy what I like and projects I believe in the story, the site, the people etc.
Cheers all.
Dustin
12 Likes
There should be some kind of gentleman’s agreement, if you don’t want to update each vintage to the actual tested alcohol % then just put a flat 15%. That way we know you are playing games with us.
I wonder how many producers spec sheets match the label?
If he was already working with Kale then I can see his making a foray into the wonderful world of Andy Beckstoffer. Kale Anderson is a smart guy and a good winemaker. On the other hand, how many people are out there who buy $275 bottles from new wineries?? Lots of folks have lamented the problem of making money with Andy’s grapes and they have moved on.
1 Like
Fascinating stuff. Is there a reason you’re not sharing your results (i.e. measured alcohol vs. labeled alcohol for each wine)?
Liability.
An ITB friend did the same experiment years ago with very popular producer of Zinfandel and PS. The numbers were remarkably higher than the label ABV. When I called them out, the winemaker and the minions went apeshit.
3 Likes
I think this question was for @D_Mowe