I asked John whether I needed to pull down my recent note to a 1969 Colares, given my six references to the sea/saline:
Start from the top of that thread.
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Yes, Robert, Iâve checked the List of Approved Descriptions (you may never, ever use âdescriptorsâ) and I am afraid your note will have to be modified or deleted. Although I have never tasted (or even seen) the wine, Iâd be happy to let you know what you are actually tasting, cuz thatâs the kind of guy I am. Youâre welcome.
There is a definite graphite aroma, especially in the wines of St. Julien and Pauillac.
As has been mentioned by others, this is notjust the wood.
As for salinity, I have encountered this ins some white Burgundies to a marked degree.
There word is precise and suitable.
Therefore, as a tasting term, I think both of these are fine.
Alex R.
This is funny.
Also amusing that Nealâs 48% whole berry (which Iâm guessing is accurately transcribed) becomes Antonioâs 50% whole cluster: quite a distinction.
How is a critic to differentiate him or herself if they stick with a small set of broadly comprehensible wine descriptors? Hence the game of buzzword bullshit bingo.
Has Gilman and Jancis written a note on the 2016 Carmes Haut Brion? Curious what they say.
Here is Decanter:
Tasted by Jane Anson(at Primeur week tastings in Bordeaux, 02 Apr 2017))
Part of Bordeaux en primeur: Pessac-LĂ©ognan reds 201695
Slowly but surely, Carmes Haut-Brion is moving from being âan estate to watchâ to one that has fully arrived. This gives the appearance of effortless extraction, where the vibrant black fruits seem artfully placed along the palate, fleshed out with liquorice, dark chocolate, > graphite > and violet notes. This has the highest proportion of Cabernet Franc on the left bank, and it can be austere at en primeur, but in this vintage the fresh fruit reads as juiciness and persistency. I love it, what a stunning wine, and what a testament to the benefits of investing in terroir. Biodynamic farming also, although not certified. Tasted at the chĂąteau and again with the UGCs. Technical director Guillaume Pouthier used a good amount of whole bunch pressing, over 20%, because he felt the stalks were ripe.
Drinking Window 2027 - 2045
Dude, I keep telling you; Farr Vintners has the text of most of the major reviewersâ notes on 2016 (as they do each year). Gillman is not there but . . . .
Dark crimson. Sumptuous texture if not that much flavour at present. Very round and gorgeous with lovely Graves freshness on the finish. Very glossy and winning. Nicely managed tannins.
Drink 2024-2040
Score: 17 Jancis Robinson MW, JancisRobinson.com, April 2017
It is already the case that wine tasting notes, by paid critics or amateur ones, are written in that secret language. Thatâs why non wine geeks satirize tasting notes almost as much as non-lawyers satirize lawyersâ writing and, of course, non literary critics satirize literary theory. Whether there are justifications for some or all of these specialized vocabularies is another question. We all tend to recognize our own.
No one can actually agree on how it was made: 50% whole cluster for Galloni, >20% whole cluster (âpressingâ - but this is a red wine, not a white, so not sure what is meant by that) from Jane, and 48% whole berry but no mention of whole cluster from Neal. That to me is more significant than any of the aroma or flavor descriptions.
The wines are very plush and polished under the new regime, Robert. They show very well as EP samples.
The notes are all over the board, internally and externally inconsistent. However, I think that they are sufficiently clearly to tell me, this new style of Carmes Haut Brion may not be for me. It is a clear departure from the prior style. The increase in Cab Franc intrigues me, though. I was debating on grabbing a bottle to try, but then thought, âto what purposeâ. I like my Bdx with age on it.
Might as well toss Leveâs note into the mix:
2016 ChĂąteau Les Carmes Haut-Brion ( Pessac-LĂ©ognan. )
With a real intensity of raw material here, the nose pops with smoke, tobacco, flowers, earth, boysenberry and cassis. As time goes on, you find dark chocolate covered plums too. The texture is surreal. Pure silk and velvet fill your mouth and coat your palate. Concentrated and deep, this has a freshness, vibrancy and purity of fruit that really leaves you breathless. To understand the finish, picture eating ripe and almost over berries right off the vine, while smoking an aged Cuban cigar and you are almost there, if you just add the silky, velvet textures, rocks and stones. The finish sticks with you for over 60 seconds! The wine was made from blending 41% Cabernet Franc, 39% Merlot and 20% Cabernet Sauvignon that included 50% of the grapes being whole, bunch fermented, the wine reached 13.8% alcohol, with a pH of 3.55. The harvest took place September 21 to October 8. The wine is aging in 100% new, French oak barrels, with 5% of the production aging in clay amphora.99 points - Tasted Apr 29, 2017
Read more at:> Learn all about Les Carmes Haut Brion, The Complete Guide
Perhaps itâs familiarity, but I actually get Jeffâs note. We do not migrate to the same style of Bordeaux, but I do get what heâs saying for the most part.
It will be interesting to see where it comes out in price. The unanimous critical acclaim for the wine suggests an unheard of price for this wine, which is usually pretty fairly priced
EDIT: Never mind. Looks like ~$75 a btl, which is higher than usual but not preposterously so.
I think your intuition is correct.
Robert, this note reflects just the types of wines I think of Jeff liking. I agree that it is a very good tasting note as it describes just the type of wine being tasted. I also agree that it does not seem to be your style of wine (or my style of wine). It shows a weakness in giving points to a wine.
I missed that post originally, thanks for bringing it up, a really nice read. Though I think your worship of Franc de Pied may be more about the selection process leaving a particular plot intact because of its quality, and less about the particular fact that it is on own-rooted vines. Who knows, the cause may be impossible to separate.
Iâm a little late to this one, But I have to add a couple of things. One, it is not the points, it is the people, period. Two, almost every description or descriptor, is the description or descriptor of a perception, period. I have used graphite only once, a long time ago. I have used saline 11 times, for wines that have never been salty. There are just different perceptions that enter my mindâs eye and this descriptor seems apt to me and many times when other people use it. I have used clay ( clay mineral, dusty clay road, etc.) 19 times. I mine clay for a living, you can put it right up to your nose and it barely to never has any smell, yet, a dusty clay road, with a fresh rain, has a beautiful (petrichor) aroma, and imparts thoughts and perceptions of mineral, that I seem to perceive in wines sometime. If you have never experienced this, the description might mean nothing, so you have to know or follow the person.
As for the OP, I agree that critics overuse these buzzwords, and regurgitate, them ad infinitum. Thatâs why their reviews mean less and less to me. Heck, John, if you used graphite or saline it would mean a lot more to me, as I like your palate and the wines you drink.
Thanks for the kind words, Charlie.
This discussion made me go back and look at the first edition of Parkerâs Bordeaux book, from 1985. Perusing the tasting notes there for Pauillacs, (1) âgraphiteâ appears nowhere but (2) there are lots of references to cedar, tobacco and leather in wines like Mouton and Lafite.
Did Bordeauxs stop exhibiting cedar scents? Or did vocabulary fashions simply shift?
My sense is that âlead pencilâ came into common use for cedar over the years, and then graphite crept into the vocabulary for Bordeaux. If someone has access to WA reviews in a searchable form, would be fun to check. I bet youâd find graphite never occurred before a certain date.
The other really striking thing is that Parker used very, very few flavor descriptors in those days. He might mention one fruit (e.g., black currents), one word from the cedar/leather/tobacco family, and maybe âspicy.â The rest of the description is about structure â how fruity, how much and what sort of tannins, concentration and weight. Iâve scanned a page of his comments on Pichon-Lalande, which are very different from later WA reviews. (Iâm not sure how readable they will be here.)
I find these more honest and helpful because thereâs less hot air and those specific flavor terms are usually extremely subjective â not something Iâd necessary find myself.
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I donât know, I canât really draw any parallels between the experience of chomping on grapes while smoking a cigar and the experience of drinking wine. While being pelted with rocks and stones?
Not to mention sea spray!
Lot of those notes with graphite also seem to carry a smoke component. I always think of graphite along the lines of what you smell after using an old school pencil sharpener. The wood shavings and ground graphite and heat all produce certain smell that is different than a cedar box or even just cedar trees. Itâs its own smell.
The salinity thing is a little different. I was drinking a 2010 gigondas and thought salinity three days ago. In my opinion, itâs simply when savory notes overtake the sweet fruit notes we more frequently encounter. I find it more in Rhone reds and some syrah than in anything else. When that happens, the perception of sweet falls down and the perception of savory/salty comes to the forefront. I find it in the occasion chablis as well where the savory and minerally notes seem to overtake the sweeter chard fruit notes you find in warmer climes. Itâs not actual salinity just like a fruit forward wine isnât actually sweet (at least no residual sugar). We still say âsweet fruitâ.