CORAVIN: What Am I Doing WRONG?!

WINE TALK
21

Would plugging the spout with my finger while the bottle is sideways block the inrush of ambient air? [scratch.gif]

22

I was just told yesterday, by a guy that uses his Coravin often on very old bordeaux and other very high value wines, that the wines should never be laid down again after using the Coravin. He stated that argon is a heavy gas and that it puts a layer directly on top of the wine while the oxygen stays above the argon. He says that when the bottle is laid back down that there will not be enough of an argon layer to completely cover the wine while sideways. But if it is kept upright then there will be a thick argon layer to protect the wine due to the smaller area of wine at the exposed level. Where as laying down your are actually doubling the area thus minimizing the protection. He also said never put more than two holes in a cork and if it gets to 3/4 of a bottle left to just wait until you are ready to pull the cork.

I have no idea if this is true but it seems legit after thinking about it. We use ours a good bit for just a glass or two one evening and usually open the bottle within the next day or two. Haven’t had any problems as of yet but I’m just not sure I wanna go throwing the needle through any of our '45 Bordeaux’s.

23

load of crap that shows no knowledge of chemistry. The gases mix and don’t stay separate.

24

Ah ok. Far from a chemistry expert here. I was just listening to what he had to say.

25

But I did just read this as well:

Argon is used to displace oxygen- and moisture-containing air in packaging material to extend the shelf-lives of the contents (argon has the European food additive code of E938). Aerial oxidation, hydrolysis, and other chemical reactions which degrade the products are retarded or prevented entirely. Bottles of high-purity chemicals and certain pharmaceutical products are available in sealed bottles or ampoules packed in argon. In wine making, argon is used to top-off barrels to avoid the aerial oxidation of ethanol to acetic acid during the aging process.

26

Justin, see the explanation by Al Osterheld Review of Pungo wine preservation device/Coravin alternative - WINE TALK - WineBerserkers.

27

God bless pseudoscience bullshit.

28

displace, yes, as one can do a nitrogen or other inert gas flush–but if you add argon in place of wine and in addition to the ullage already containing oxygen, the gases mix, just like if you add milk to water and unlike oil and water.

29

I too have recently purchased a coravin and noticed a slight decline in the profile of a bottle I accessed a couple times over the course of 1.5 weeks. What I noticed is that if you pour water into the spout, the water will come out the needle whether vertical or horizontal. Does this mean that the needle needs to be removed while there is pressure in the bottle so that air does not have a chance to enter?

I have been waiting for the last few drops to come out with the goal of maximizing argon, but perhaps this is not a good practice because air can get in as the pressure goes down to nothing

30

This is interesting to read through. I’ve had a Coravin since the end of December, have tried it on several bottles and haven’t had any issues with oxidation. I’ve used it on reds and whites, vintages going back to the early '90s, and it’s been a pretty amazing product. I didn’t have a strong opinion about the product one way or another, bought one as a lark but at this point I think it’s revolutionary. I’ll keep experimenting.

31

Still happy with my Coravin. Will Pungo ever be released to the public, or will it be eternal vaporware? The website still says “Coming Soon in 2014!”

32

I left an email address where you can request a Pungo. Have you tried it?

33

now it reads “coming soon in 2015!”

34

Not vaporware - we’ve been shipping units since July. We’re still working through a large backlog while increasing capacity and throughput. We’ve been reluctant to turn on the site until we get the bulk of these orders out the door.

We recently brought in house the non-stick coating-application process, which is the one process we used to outsource. We’ve been working with our coating supplier for two years on a special formulation for cork, which has exceeded our expectations - needles with this coating go into cork with less than a third of the effort than was the case with the old formula.

If you’d like to order, you can PM me or email info@pungo.us.

35

I have not had these issues with coravin. The hiss you hear is argon going out, not air going in. We tried a blind tasting a couple of months ago 2000 Giscours one bottle coravined 3 weeks and one bottle Audouzed 1 hour. We could not see a difference.

I agree brownian motion makes it unlikely a separation of gasses (Oxygen and Argon) will occur over the short term.

36

That is not correct. it would take literally miles of “height” to see a significant separation of gas molecules based on molecular or atomic weight, and even in the atmosphere you see much less than would be predicted because of convection.

Inside the head space of a bottle all the gas is going to mix homogeneously, quite quickly after blowing in Argon.

37

Barry, maybe a step three: While there is still a bit of argon left in the bottle (and the bottle is on its side) extract the needle and seal immediately with putty. What do you think??

38

I’m going to try pulling the ‘trigger’ as I sweep the bottle upright, potentially preventing the mysterious ‘inrush’ of air? $hit.

39

I still think it is an “outrush” from the bottle, not an inrush. If you hold the device in the pouring position until the last drop comes out then turn the bottle there is no whoosh. If you turn the bottle while there is still a significant stream of wine coming out the device releases the extra pressure. Is this not right?

40

If not, why the increasing oxidation the more ‘pulls’ for the bottle one takes, ‘generally’?