removed in the spirit of positivity
Not sure I understand why Joe does not know at he’s talking about.
There does appear to have been a change in how things are fermented, and many believe that pumpovers lead to a ‘different wine’ than punch downs do.
Please explain.
Cheers 
Larry,
Look at the tanks…they are open top, not the closed top he talked about. He was incorrect about that. He mentioned that Copain picked lower to get lower alcohols…well, yes. I think we all knew that. He mentioned pumpovers…but I don’t know that that is true. I saw those tanks…they seemed to be punchdown material to me…but maybe I am wrong. Larry, you say there was a change in how things were feremented… what was that change?
Adam Lee
Siduri Wines
By the way, I’ve changed a decent amount myself in how things were fermented. I use more stems now…on Pommard especially, than I did in the early days. I used to add Barolo yeast to the lower section of Garys’ Pinot as it was so fruit filled it seemed to need more earth. Now that the vines are older they seem to have that earth so I don’t do that any longer. I kind of hope that wineries change how they make wine as they learn more and the vines get older. But perhaps that is just me.
“Pinot Noir is an easy wine to make.” - Jeffrey Patterson, Mount Eden
Joe- respectfully, I’m confused. Did Copain slow pay/not pay/become delinquent to you personally?
If they didn’t, I really don’t understand your role in exposing that. I also don’t understand “calling out” the new owners as they just announced this. I’m not a Copain list member, think their wines are just fine, but don’t buy all that often. I’m not their apologist, but am generally interested in reading about the business side of wine.
Just having trouble following what, if any issues there are.
removed in the spirit of positivity
I spoke to Wells offline and I got some clarification and we settled it out the court of the public eye. We’ve chatted and understand each others points. Negativity will not sell more wine for either of us.
Hold on there. Wells showed me (and a couple other folks) around the new facility shortly after it opened. It was all/mostly closed top tanks (the tanks I could see were closed top). Wells said he was changing to closed top tanks (and doing pump overs, of course)…he said prior to that, he had shifted to doing mostly pump overs because it was more gentle (punch downs mash the stems/skins a bit more) and he preferred closed top for pump overs. So Joe did know what he was talking about…at least for early on in the new facility.
I thought it was interesting that he went that way, but obviously he didn’t nail his foot to the floor on the issue. I asked him about the lack of blowing off alc…he said A) he’s picking earlier and B) even closed top tanks have manways/doors/thingies at the top that can be opened to provide some venting during the heat of the ferment (tho not as much as open tops).
Had a '13 Hawks Butte Syrah tonight.
Wickedly good, and will get better.
Several comments here:
I see a change in the way Jackson Family operates. I think they learned from their experience at Hartford so now they are giving much more freedom to the wineries they own. You night call it the if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it model.
They do seem to be buying everything in sight, inc Hosemaster Industries.
Wells reminds me of what Andre Tchelitcheff’s nephew Alex once said about Andre: he was always convinced that what he was doing was 100% right until he changed his mind.
Gotta run…Barbara Banke says she wants to change my office around.
There are worse ways to go through life.
WaPo on the sale of Copain & Siduri etc…
“We may wonder, with so much more wine being sold under a popular brand, can quality be sustained?”
Eric I’m curious why you picked out that quote in relation to the linked article? It seemed entirely geared towards Constellation’s purchase of Meomi and The Prisoner, and not at all directed towards the acquisitions by either Jackson Family or St. Michele Estates.
I usually like to try to put a quote form the article before the link, hopefully one that clarifies main thrust of the article.
I considered putting the article in a whole new posting, but since it seemed like the article was mostly germane to this thread, I choose to put it here.
I think the quote applies quite well to all small operations when they are purchased by a much larger operation, even if it was more closely attributed to Constellation, in this particular case.
I think the main thrust of that article is that Jackson Family is, to quote from the article:
“Both Ste. Michelle Estates and Jackson Family Wines have a reputation for buying well-regarded wineries and maintaining the quality.”
The sentence which Eric posted is the end of a paragraph about Constellation buying Meiomi and Prisoner, and the very next sentence begins “In contrast, Jackson Family Wines . . .”
Anyway, I’m not trying to attack Eric or to be overly picky, but I did want to encourage readers of this thread not to assume the writer of that article was suggesting Copain’s quality will drop because of the sale - the writer seems to be saying the opposite of that.