Cloudy Burgundy

WINE TALK
21

As mentioned by others, some older Burgs have a Very fine sediment, and in my experience it can take TWO WEEKS or more for such bottles to clear when standing up. Filtering doesn’t work either. I have a regular upright box that I have propped up against my cellar wall at about a 15 degree angle, with a small board under the front of it. I put bottles I have just received in there for at least two weeks, with the labels facing “up”, before I place them into more permanent storage in a label-up horizontal position. I also twist them by the neck before putting them in the box, to dislodge any sediment that may be stuck to the side of the bottle. When everything settles down, I can slow-O these bottles, avoid decanting altogether (which better preserves freshness and some elements of complexity imo), and I get NO sediment until the final half glass. You just have to pour gently, with the label always up, and return the bottle to upright very gently as well.

There may be a “permanent cloudiness” that is not caused by sediment like this, but by the result of some microbial action or whatever, but I haven’t encountered any bad bottles of this sort…

22

Here I was thinking this was a weather thread…it has been dreary. Last two days though have been a bit of heaven. And as far as cloudy wines from Burgundy, this may be due to large lees of sediment brought into bottle while still in suspension. Producers do still bottle by hand at times, and others simply may not let the wines settle enough to be completely clear. I’ve never worried much about it.

23

A good friend has a large stash of 1983 Echezeaux, Lucien Jayer, and I have been treated to this wonderful wine numerous times. I call it, lovingly, ‘Mud Wine.’

Stand it up and a quarter inch or more of superfine, silty sediment will settle out in a day or so - but the wine remains distinctly cloudy, even if you wait months (literally). I don’t believe it would ever fall clear. Ever.

If that’s a flaw, it’s one I wish all my burgundies shared. The first time I was served the ‘Mud Wine,’ I poured the sludge in the empty bottle over ice cream. Delicious. Absolutely delicious.

24

Though I’ve seen it in many vintages, I’ve never seen it so predominant as in the '83 reds. I wonder why?

Not that these muddy/cloudy wines seem off in any way other than visually. It might be related to the early browning, but I’ve never delved into finding out.

25

Everybody was enormously enthused when the wines were in cask, with their deep colours and concentrated fruit, unless there were signs of rot which was certainly apparent in some Gevrey-Chambertin vineyards. However, quite shortly after bottling, many wines lost their colour, leaving it in sediment at the bottom of the bottle – unstable anthocyanins, caused by either the drought, hail or rot. Wines which retained their colour still showed in their early years as hard, surly and with aggressive tannins.

One fascinating take on the vintage was that of Hubert de Montille, who decided to bottle virtually his entire crop in magnums. It was a triumphant move, though possibly frustrating for his importers and restaurant customers, sealed at the annual Clive Coates/Becky Wasserman ‘10 Years On’ tasting when his wines shone above almost all others – Hubert was present at the tasting, enthroned in a chair waiting for his colleagues to come and congratulate him.

Now, more than 26 years on, there are still some very fine bottles to be had, albeit rarer than the failures. In September 2009, after a day’s hard labour digging out the roots of a defunct birch tree in the garden, I treated us to a bottle of Clos de Vougeot 1983 from Domaine Daniel Rion – a wine full of promise in its youth, but definitely on the hard side, and now a fine, graceful, thoroughly satisfying bottle of mature Burgundy.

from Jasper Morris…

the coulour loss and the muddy/cloudy effect seem to be related, not surprisingly.

26

Stuart,
I have about a case of 1983 Trapet Chambertin that are cloudy as can be. They are wonderful, brilliant wines nonetheless. I’ve also had a good amount of Truchot 83 that were mind-numbingly delicious. I still remember a 1983 Domaine Bart Bonnes Mares a 4 years ago that seemed muddy, awful and dumb when first opened. The wine continued to open up over 2 hours and became one of my favorite wine experiences to this day.

27

Ray,

During an early (second) visit after our honeymoon there in '83, we went to Truchot in November 1985, and carried back some of the '83 grand crus. I still have one of each, I think. They were, as you say, “mind-numbingly delicious”…

In 2000 I wrote of the Clos de la Roche: “This wine is everything a mature red Burgundy from a good vintage should be: balanced, very concentrated, complex and maturing, with good structure, but not intrusive.” That says it all. In my notes, though, I didn’t note whether they were cloudy, but most '83 certainly are by this time.

You are a lucky man to have all of those '83s!!

28

Hey Stuart,
as you know, I took the 8" Truchot’s on your advice. Thank you very much by the way. The Trapets are funny in that my friend in Chassagne sold them to me at 15-20€ each since he said no one wanted them due to the labels being in bad shape. Oddly enough, tasting the wine, you wouldn’t get the impression that these had been discounted. [cheers.gif]

29

Ray,

Please stop telling these stories. I can’t take it anymore. No man should live like this. Stop or you might find myself and family on your doorstep with suitcases. How large is your Maison ?

30

Sorry Nick! Just a bit giddy…and please come on by.

gotta love the throwaway bin at a Burgundy shop. [cheers.gif]

31

ok sorry about that. I’m composed now. Please continue so I can see how life was meant to be lived.

32

[rofl.gif] you are killin me Nick! If only you saw my pitiful stash [cry.gif]

33

tag this post as another ‘different opinion’ FWIW…

I could scan it, but figure writing a quote is good enough- from Kermit Lynch’s May 1991 newsletter:

Just off the boat

1990 Beaujolais

Yes, I found a delicious Beujolais from the recent harvest. It is here now and it is ready to drink. It was not chaptalized, nor was it filtered. Drink it cooled down a bit, and don’t mind if a slight deposit forms as time goes by. Those are onoly grape parts falling out, obeying the laws of gravity. Joseph Swan used to say, “Of course I drink the sediment; that’s the best part!”

another wine ‘expert’ John Kapon in his winepr0n email missives:

My second week of work in the Golden Cellar was on the way back from Asia. I was a bit worse for wear; my trip to Asia wasn’t short on wine or late nights, and my grand finale in Singapore had me tasting about forty wines in three nights. I really needed to dry out, and I was very jet lagged as well, so I insisted on no wine for a few days.

Actually, I had had one very special bottle in Asia courtesy of the Golden Cellar, a bottle that had been halfway across the world and back. To Taiwan and back to be exact. > This 1971 DRC La Tâche with its Taiwanese strip label was gorgeous; great fill, cork branded correctly, everything about it looked heaven sent, and I was very proud of myself with the notion that I was going to bring this bottle back to Taiwan and its original resting place upon initially coming across it my first week in the Golden Cellar. When I finally opened it, this was a bottle that was definitely shaken, not stirred. Since one cannot carry a bottle of wine onto the plane anymore, this bottle went into the luggage and not only went > from New York to Shanghai, but also then from Shanghai to Hong Kong to Taipei the same day it was being drunk, and the bottle was still spectacular. > I am not sure that bottle shock is something I believe anymore! > Yes, it was a bit murky from the sediment being integrated into the wine, but it did not take away from the wine at all. The experience reminded me of a ’45 Haut-Brion that I had to ship overnight for a dinner a couple of years ago that was also phenomenal. The LT’s nose was spectacular, incredible, amazing… insert your own superlative here. > Rose and oil were first and foremost, then there was this ménage a toi of citrus, leather and cedar, you know, the tasteful kind, ha-ha. The vitamins, minerals, spice and overall depth were extraordinary. ‘This is the 71 LT I know and love,’ I wrote. The musk qualities were bringing sexy back, and the wine itself was bordering on a sexual experience. This was sheer liquid nobility, and all these observations are just describing the aromas! The palate kept pace with the nose; first and foremost, there was rust, citrus and spine galore. Its t ‘n a was enormous, searing my mouth with its laser-like precision and possessing enough acidity to go another 36 years. There was a touch of vanilla and cream soda, and a also hint of eucalyptus. Rich and rusty with great spice, the ’71 La Tâche also had a hint of tomato stew, in a good way. What a wine (98).

AS to the contention the ‘older’ Williams-Selyem wine had some sediment in it…compared to what? I’ve never had a bottle of W-S wine, Pinot Noir or Zinfandel that didn’t have a small amount of sediment in it, much like any other wine that hasn’t been filtered (much). There are countless other wines with far more sediment in them from all parts of the wine growing areas of the world. Read CT reviews of the old Swan wines, notorious for the amounts of sediment in those. On that note, I’ll post up a scan from a KL newsletter on the Beaujolais Appellation thread soon, about the fab4 of Morgon, what Kermit said about them decades ago…which is interesting given the thread on WB about problems with the S02/non-SO2 Lapierre bottlings.

teaser:

You serve it to guests who don’t know wine; they notice it is a bit cloudy; then don’t want to catch any social diseases from dirty wine so they decline graciously; you get to drink it all yourself.