Chave.

[J0hnEhrl1ng]

Thanks for the notes. I love Chave Hermitage!

[Greg_K]

I agree with Alan. Your CT notes from May trashing a whole slate of 2019 CdPs were incredibly unhelpful. You obviously don’t like the category and those slanted tasting notes add nothing for those of us who appreciate those wines (among many others) in terms of differentiating between the different offerings, deciding when they are best to drink, etc. It takes little skill or effort to just blanket dump on a whole class of wines, be it white Hermitage, CdP, or whatever. If you really dislike a whole category, you should keep your categorically negative comments to yourself (as my mother used to say, if you have nothing nice to say, it’s best to say nothing at all).

While I’m not Adrian, I suspect he’s happy to offer you your money back if you were unhappy with his reviews of 2019 CdP.

If you don’t share Adrian’s palate (and while I do generally, I don’t always - we have some notable Burgundy disagreements), you don’t have to read his reviews. My reviews (when I bother to write them) are admittedly idiosyncratic and made to suit my palate, and I’ll be frank about not liking wines I don’t. That doesn’t make the tasting notes “slanted”, just means they’re for my palate.

Obviously the comments about Hermitage blanc are tongue in cheek* - if Jean Louis wants to make those wines, who am I to stop him? Clearly some people enjoy them, even if the majority of the wine drinking community doesn’t. That’s fine - horses for courses. But it’s also true that over the last 60 years palates have changed - the rich low acid wines (like Hermitage blanc) have fallen more out of favor - who really drinks Chateau Grillet anymore? Yet 70 years ago it might have been described as one of France’s greatest wines.

*But to be clear, Gerhard does objectively had a bad palate.

[Stan_Y]

For those who don’t like good white Hermitage, do you feel the same way about Beaucastel VV?

[Greg_K]

For those who don’t like good white Hermitage, do you feel the same way about Beaucastel VV?

I would question the premise of “good” white Hermitage, but I’d expect the answer from just about everyone to be yes (it is for me).

[Stan_Y]

Thanks Greg. The reason I ask is they seem on the same side of the spectrum, with some similar flavors and something chalky in the finish, even if the Beaucastel I’ve had is more lively and engaging. Could see drinking these with the same dishes. Been some time though.

[Lee_Short]

I thought the 91 was as good as any wine I’ve ever had. I was spewing random expletives every time I smelled it.

That 1991 is a marvel, isn’t it? It was relatively available just after release, as it had gotten lackluster reviews. Mine is sadly all gone.

I’m betting it is wine that never really shut down, though I did not try any bottles to really test that theory.

[brodie_thomson]

I very much agree that the wines, even outstanding mature ones are not for everyone. I am someone who appreciates them. They are complex, contemplative, deep, rich wines that are very different than most white wines I like to drink, and even a great old white Hermitage is for me at most a two glass experience. Kind of like a dry white version of TBA, essencia or the like in sweet wines. A little can be great, a lot, not so much. YMMV

Thnx Todd , your have eloquently captured how I feel about Chave Blanc. An exceptional and singular wine that is not in the white wine mainstream. I value it for its style, interest and complexity. I don’t want all my whites to be cut from the same cloth so to speak.

I am also in Rauno’s camp; initally bought them tied to purchases of Rouge and have come to appreciate them a lot more over time

Brodie

[Alan_Rath]

I agree with Alan. Your CT notes from May trashing a whole slate of 2019 CdPs were incredibly unhelpful. You obviously don’t like the category and those slanted tasting notes add nothing for those of us who appreciate those wines (among many others) in terms of differentiating between the different offerings, deciding when they are best to drink, etc. It takes little skill or effort to just blanket dump on a whole class of wines, be it white Hermitage, CdP, or whatever. If you really dislike a whole category, you should keep your categorically negative comments to yourself (as my mother used to say, if you have nothing nice to say, it’s best to say nothing at all).

Those notes are incredibly helpful to the many more who have a similar palate. If only people who love the wines would review those wines, CT would be useless or we would live in a Suckling world.

There is little useful information to be gained from reading a note written by someone who professes his strong dislike of the wine, or class of wines across the board. As someone who loves and admires Chave Blanc (and wishes I could afford to buy and drink it more often), these notes have literally no value to me. Or to someone with no experience with the wines. They are truly pointless.

[Rauno_E_NZ]

Just as a counterpoint, I’m someone who likes Chave Blanc very much and DID find Adrian’s notes useful.

[Paul_Jaouen]

For those who don’t like good white Hermitage, do you feel the same way about Beaucastel VV?

Good question. I’m a fan of Beau VV with some age but i don’t find white hermitage appealing. Maybe I just don’t like Marsanne.

[Michael_S_Monie]

I agree with Alan. Your CT notes from May trashing a whole slate of 2019 CdPs were incredibly unhelpful. You obviously don’t like the category and those slanted tasting notes add nothing for those of us who appreciate those wines (among many others) in terms of differentiating between the different offerings, deciding when they are best to drink, etc. It takes little skill or effort to just blanket dump on a whole class of wines, be it white Hermitage, CdP, or whatever. If you really dislike a whole category, you should keep your categorically negative comments to yourself (as my mother used to say, if you have nothing nice to say, it’s best to say nothing at all).

Thou shall not doubt, Adrian!

[Matthew_King]

I agree with Alan. Your CT notes from May trashing a whole slate of 2019 CdPs were incredibly unhelpful. You obviously don’t like the category and those slanted tasting notes add nothing for those of us who appreciate those wines (among many others) in terms of differentiating between the different offerings, deciding when they are best to drink, etc. It takes little skill or effort to just blanket dump on a whole class of wines, be it white Hermitage, CdP, or whatever. If you really dislike a whole category, you should keep your categorically negative comments to yourself (as my mother used to say, if you have nothing nice to say, it’s best to say nothing at all).

Those notes are incredibly helpful to the many more who have a similar palate. If only people who love the wines would review those wines, CT would be useless or we would live in a Suckling world.

There is little useful information to be gained from reading a note written by someone who professes his strong dislike of the wine, or class of wines across the board. As someone who loves and admires Chave Blanc (and wishes I could afford to buy and drink it more often), these notes have literally no value to me. Or to someone with no experience with the wines. They are truly pointless.

Truly pointless? No way. They are all 93 points!

[Ramon_C]

Just like they should confiscate Jaboulet’s and Chapoutier’s holdings so that they can be given to someone who actually knows how to make Hermitage.

I rec. to drink Chinese wines - all from confiscated vineyards …

What does that mean?

I, too, am wondering what it means and how it relates to the topic?

[A_So]

I tried the '91 on release here, and didn’t care for it much. I thought at the time it might have been damaged, but following the '90 and to my still New World oriented tastes at the time, I don’t know. Then two years later we had it at L’Oustau de Baumanière with what was the tiniest leg of lamb I’ve ever seen, and it was my best Chave ever. Alive and popping like '97 but with more of everything. Down to my last bottle of '97 and I have no more '91, unfortunately, but plenty of '95 because that damned thing just refuses to turn the corner. Would love to see notes on 2005 in context like this because that’s the last one I cellared and have never tried it.

p.s. I sortof know what you mean about the white not being your thing, fat and waxy and not too much acid, but I dig it. Gladly ordered these in pairs when the price for both was so reasonable.

I haven’t yet had the 2005; it’s a vintage that strikes me as too similar to the 1999 to merit opening now, especially that the replacement cost is as high as it is. Wholly agreed that the best course of action is to wait on the 1995.

From my understanding, the 1990 was the better-regarded vintage for a long time, but that view has shifted to the 1991 of late. Unfortunately, while the 1990 is readily available, the 1991 seems to be very rare.

[A_So]

There is little useful information to be gained from reading a note written by someone who professes his strong dislike of the wine, or class of wines across the board. As someone who loves and admires Chave Blanc (and wishes I could afford to buy and drink it more often), these notes have literally no value to me. Or to someone with no experience with the wines. They are truly pointless.

I agree with Alan. Your CT notes from May trashing a whole slate of 2019 CdPs were incredibly unhelpful. You obviously don’t like the category and those slanted tasting notes add nothing for those of us who appreciate those wines (among many others) in terms of differentiating between the different offerings, deciding when they are best to drink, etc. It takes little skill or effort to just blanket dump on a whole class of wines, be it white Hermitage, CdP, or whatever. If you really dislike a whole category, you should keep your categorically negative comments to yourself (as my mother used to say, if you have nothing nice to say, it’s best to say nothing at all).

I read both your comments, so I guess it puts us on equal footing.

[CFu]

80s chave and tca. A match made in heaven (or hell). Dunno why that decade from chave had such a propensity for corked wine.