I love German wines. I have probably at least 30 German wine bottles in my cellar for each bottle of riesling from Alsace (maybe 50). But, when aged properly, are Trimbach’s Clos St. Hune and Cuvee Frederick Emile the best rieslings in the world (forgetting BAs, TBAs, Eisweins, etc.)?
Nice post, Howard, and welcome! Great first post.
I’m afraid I can’t stir up much controversy over this; I totally agree with you. Always partial to Alsatian rieslings, I think Clos St. Hune is one of the greatest wines of the world and one that–given its etherial nature–is fairly or even underpriced for what it is.
I’d take a Clos St. Hune any day over a German riesling; but that’s just me and my taste. I can fully understand German wine lovers feeling differently.
PS Twice in the last 6 weeks or so I’ve had the 01 Cuvee Frederic Emile. What a terrific wine!
The few Spatlese and Auslese (well stored of course) rieslings from the 1971 vintage I’ve had the pleasure of having have been nothing less than stellar wines and better than anything I’ve had from Alsace. I do love Alsatian wines, but my tastes lean more towards German wines.
Welcome Howard! Trimbach all the way…give a CFE or Clos St Hune any day, any vintage. Have a sizable stash in my cellar and clients have to beg for those…and I rarely say yes. Been drinking half bottles of CFE 2000…beautiful stuff!
Had '73 Hune and '71 Prum Wehlener Sonnenuhr Auslese and Prum every day of the week. The finesse is what brings it to the next level.
Hey buddy; its really great to be posting with you again. Missed that!
It was with you that I had the 01 CFE at Szchuan Gourmet. Wasn’t it good with the food? Each took the other to a higher level.
My preference is for German riesling, but I wouldn’t claim to have enough experience either way.
With the food it was great but Riesling with all food tends to be good.
It’s great and I love it but its churned out in huge quantities with cultured yeasts so calling it the best ever is tough for me as I think the wine could be better, in fact much better if they cut production and used native yeasts. Not sure of the yeast situation on Hune but probably the same although Hune is in smaller quantites but I am sure they don’t spontaneously ferment with natural yeasts. I love Hune and like Emile.
I look at Freddie Emile as like the Dom Perignon of Riesling, for its recognizabiity and consistency and ability to be good to excellent to sometimes profound wine. Rarely is Freddy Emile profound but always pushes that excellent level. Great vintages like '90 and '83 help as does FE VT designate wines. It’s good, and I love it, don’t get me wrong, but there’s just something not there. Maybe it’s the yeast? I drink so much naturally fermented Riesling these days I could be the one who has changed. Hune is like Oenotech (sp?). But for me there has never been the emotional attachment I attach to other Rieslings. I have never become invested in the wines as say a Prum, Haag, Hirtzberger, Schafer-Frohlich, Keller, etc.
I digress and it is good to be posting on a board with my old friends. I almost forgot what it was like.
Hi Howard, great to see you over here!
The answer to your question is no.
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I have had some haunting Spatlese and Auselse from the 70s that surpass my experiences with FE and ClSt.H. Not that they are not great wines, but the depths of mature German Riesling are without compare.
I attended an amazing CSH dinner a few months back…26 vintages of CSH…That stuff sure can age well!
Hi, Howard.
No heresy for me. I don’t compare the two. They are two different creatures, and they’re not in competition with each other for my affection.
I prize the best German Riesling for what it is, and the best Alsatian for what it is.
I also love Aussie Riesling—like the Grosset and Wakefield/Taylors from Clare Valley, specifically—for what they are, which is different from either German or Alsatian.
Also crazy about Austrian Riesling.
It’s not a competition. No one wins. Except me.
I haven’t drunk anywhere near enough of either to have any kind of definitive opinion, but I am only rarely a drinker of sweet wines, no matter how good, and when I do it is predominantly Madeira. Perhaps that is the reason that I have a lot of CFE and other dry Alsatian Rieslings (and Pinot Gris) in the cellar and very few German Rieslings.
[1928_middle_finger.gif] .
I don’t have enough experience to say anything definitive…but a 2001 Hirtzberger Singerriedel was a ‘collection changing’ wine for me. Austria in general has become a much larger focus for me.
Hirtzberger Singerriedel is an amazing wine, but I don’t think it will be long before it’s in the same league as CSH for price. ![[shrug.gif]](/uploads/db3686/original/2X/4/48636ebda2a440a43ad8d24c83be20ac20c53420.gif "shrug"){kind=small}
Rebholz Kastanienbusch
Knebel Winninger Uhlen Spatlese Trocken
Schafer-Frohlich Felseneck, Kupfergrube and Halenberg
Boxler Sommerberg
Hirtzberger Singerriedel
FX Pichler Steinertal (although most people say Durnsteiner Kellerberg)
Keller Abtserde, Kirchspiel, Hubacker, Morstein
Wittman Morstein
Prager Achletien
the list goes on and on for german, austrian great dry Rieslings…I even stuck an Alsace one in there for posterity. Haven’t even gotten into the germs that have a kiss of sugar yet (feinherb Halbtrocken etc.) and the sweeter versions…maybe I’ll start a new thread. All of these can hand for waaay under the price of Hune and for a bit more money you can have wine way more interesting than the very good but nothing more than “solid” Freddie Emile. It is the brand for dry Riesling for people who don’t normally drink a lot of dry Riesling as DP is the brand for people who don’t generally drink a lot of tete de cuvee champgane.
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Buekes,
It would not be as much fun if we agreed.