Anybody invested with Cadman Capital in Toronto? Used to be Venulum?

John_Morris · September 12, 2019, 6:57pm

Yes.

Jason_Shopra · September 12, 2019, 7:50pm

Here’s a thread on such funds in general:
Are wine investment funds good investments?

The costs are killers – 7.5% going in, 5% redemption charge, management fee. Uggh. And your money is locked up for five years.

Oh, and the returns have sucked.

What are the costs and fees like for Cadman and Venulum?

The argument the funds make is that they’re not correlated with other markets, but even that turns out to be not so true.

I’m not sure what the costs were with them. He seemed hesitant to tell me (my colleague). It’s probably to the costs as what you mentioned above. What he did say was that they got him to transfer his wine contracts into physical wine. I guess they were doing some sort of futures situation?

What were the returns like for you?

Not that (the bolded part) is funny!

What do you mean “they got him to transfer his wine contracts into physical wine”?

I haven’t invested.

My thoughts exactly. And I’m not sure. I’m not an expert at all on wine investment (I only like to drink it), but he made it seem like they told him he had two choices: he could transfer his investment into physical wine holdings, or he’d lose all his money. So I guess he “transferred it.” And like I said this was ten years ago and he hasn’t seen any money since. Which is presumably why he was hesitant to talk about it…

John_Morris · September 12, 2019, 8:25pm

I think one of those UK funds allowed you to redeem in wine, though I’m sure they controlled which wines!

Evan_L_Klein · September 24, 2019, 2:12am

Interesting to see this thread. I’m new here. But I’m a writer currently doing an investigative piece on wine investment, and in particular the company you mentioned above. They’re a group of U.K. guys based in Toronto and they only solicit American medical professionals – I know a few MDs who have invested with them. Like Jason mentioned above, they tried to get the clients to transfer wine futures into physical holdings around 2012/2013 I believe.

https://www.gofundme.com/f/doctor039s-advocate-documentary?sharetype=teams&member=2843804&rcid=r01-156929051691-43e9615e94534231&pc=ot_co_campmgmt_w

If anybody has experience with wine investment or wine futures, please contact me.

John_Morris · September 24, 2019, 2:15am

Thanks for the clarification. You should put the same post in the “speculators” thread, too.

I’ve posted some very skeptical comments about these funds in other threads, so I’m with you, though I know nothing about the people – just the concept and the published returns.

What’s the Times article to which you referred? And is that the UK Times or the NY Times?

Evan_L_Klein · September 24, 2019, 4:37am

It was the UK Times. I posted the link in the other thread but it’s here https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dentist-sues-wine-merchant-for-fraud-lswwhpdq2

I know there have been a few other forums online where employees and clients have expressed concerns as well. 800notes is one of them https://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-877-836-8586

It’s a fairly old thread. I haven’t seen anybody mention them online in more recent years but to my knowledge they’re still very much active in the wine business.