I wasn’t really convinced by the young bottles I opened which were all good but not exceptional but I now get it and for me at any rate, you are on the right track with Bel Air! I just wish I could fast forward another five years as I’d really like to try a 20 year old one.
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As much as I enjoyed many Cab Francs while living in Argentina, it’s nice to return to the real thing. 2017 Guillot. As usual with Baudry, air is your friend. Not much pyrazine, plenty of minerally accents. A tasty drink with plenty of life ahead.
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A couple more Roches Neuves, both from 2017:
2017 Domaine des Roches Neuves Saumur-Champigny
Blackberry, dark cherry, leather and something meaty and savoury, then much the same sensations on the palate, quite silky and elegant, with only hints of the crunchy fruit of the top cuvées. Very enjoyable, very classic in style, just a little coarseness to the finish knocking off a point or two. Good value at 16 euros. 89 pts
2017 Domaine des Roches Neuves Saumur-Champigny - Terres Chaudes
Quite similar to the Domaine wine, in that it has blackberries, dark cherry, some savoury notes and leather on the nose, but here there is some blackcurrant too and it is just a little more refined. Likewise, the palate has the silky elegance of the Domaine wine, but with more refinement and class. There is no trace of any coarseness on the finish, it’s simply a better wine. I can see this improving further. Great value at 18 euros. 91 pts
I tasted them together over two evenings and really enjoyed them both, but the Terres Chaudes was clearly the better wine, and the 2 euro difference was, well, ridiculous. I would recommend them both but especially the Terres Chaudes, obviously. However, I wouldn’t recommend them to someone not familiar with Roches-Neuves’ wines, since the style is so different from that of the top wines and neither really gives an indication of what to expect from them. OTOH for those who dislike the crunchy, crisp fruit of the FDP, preferring a more classically styled S-C with darker fruit, either would be worth trying.
Roches Neuves did particularly well with their reds in 2017: they’re all very successful, even Clos de L’Echélier (which I usually dislike).
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I’v been exploring the RN wines over the past couple of years, but don’t have enough experience yet to understand their differences. Are you able to sketch what you think are the highlights of each cuvee?
Hi Julian, any chance you can update your initial post with this information? Yes, it is very personal, but for someone discovering this thread and wanting to try out the wines, it’s excellent information.
I can confirm this. A couple years ago one French retailer offered the wines pre arrivage at a discount. It didn’t sit well with the winemaker, the offer was withdrawn.
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That’s a tough one Alan but I’ll do my best!
Domaine: I’ve only tasted three vintages, 16, 17 and 21, so this is just an impression. Classic in style, focusing on black rather than red fruit, quite forward as one would expect from an entry-level wine, but with a silky elegance that belies its position in the RN range of wines. It has the fresh acidity of the other wines but savoury rather than crunchy fruit. An excellent restaurant wine.
Terres Chaudes: Quite similar to the Domaine wine, but more refined, with more substance and more class. So savoury black fruit again rather than crunchy red fruit, classically styled with more tannins on display in its youth, but still very accessible young.
La Marginale: For me the first of the range to display red crunchy, sappy fruit. I find it quite similar in profile to the Franc de Pied, but not quite as good. The fruit is vibrant and intense, not at all sweet, and although with age it mellows into something more classically orientated, it never loses the crunchiness. I love it but perhaps not for classicists.
Clos de L’Echélier: So far for me, the least convincing of the range. Midway in style between Terres Chaudes and La Marginale, with a fruit profile that can be either savoury or crunchy, or both at the same time. I’ve tried bottles from 14, 15, 16 and 17 and only enjoyed the latter vintage. So judgement reserved as I may have just been unlucky. Probably at around the same level as La Marginale.
Franc de Pied: My favourite and the one I’ve tried from the most vintages. Very bright, sappy and crunchy fruit, but well-rounded and without the hollowness that La Marginale sometimes shows. Great refinement and elegance, light on its feet but persistent. Great young but which gains complexity as it ages. It doesn’t have the weight or substance of other wines in the range but it makes up for it with its charm and vitality.
Outre Terre: Limited experience with this one. Made using amphorae, the fruit profile is denser, darker, more like that of Terres Chaudes, with more substance and depth than the FDP. It started off as a “natural” wine, but I think sulphur is now added. So bright fruit, but quite traditional in profile. One to try for the classicists.
Les Mémoires: Top of the range in price and top of the range in quality, judging by what I have tasted so far. Like a blend of the crunchiness of the FDP cuvée and the weight of the Outre Terre one. So whilst tasting sappy and fresh, it has great depth and intensity. My only proviso is that it’s still a little early to know just how well it ages, since the first vintage by RN was 2012 (although the vines are over a century old). It is very accessible young, but I’m guessing that it really needs fifteen years to show its true character.
There is one other red wine made: Roches. I’ve got a couple but haven’t tried it yet. It’s made using fruit from other domains.
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Have you had many 21s? I’m curious to get your take, as I found them quite austere and hard to drink.
Was there a white/Chenin version of this thread?
Could not find with “search”.
Thanks very much
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tysm @Yule_Kim
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My sentiments as well on the Franc de Pied and the Les Memoires. I think the latter wine may take the cake with time. It’s been a bit since I have bought any of these wines, in my market they were pricing themselves at a place that I did not want to reach, when I was buying some of my perennial favorites for much cheaper. Maybe I need to check back in.
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OK, I’ll do that!
Do you mean Roches Neuves 21s? I’ve only had the Domaine wine so far which I found rather good, fresh and crisp like a 2014. The wines I’ve tried from other addresses have been similar - I enjoy that sort of vintage!
I quite understand - I gave up buying these at retail a long time ago. I’m lucky to be close to iDealwine, so I get what I want from them at lower rates than any shops. There have to be some perks you don’t have in Florida!
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Now that really is below the belt!!
Well, we may not have your lovely sea, but we do have our lovely river at the bottom of the garden where we can go paddle-boarding and canoeing too! So there!
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Just received my latest shipment of Guion – a mix of Candide, Authentique, Deux Monts, and the (new to me) Grand Mont (2020 vintage). My initial assumption is that I should treat Grand Mont similar to Deux Monts; that is, stash it, forget about it for a while, and let it age. Just curious is anyone else has succumbed to temptation, and opened a Grand Mont already. And, if so, what your feedback is.
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