2015 Burgundy

[James_Billy]

So what are your all time and how were they when they like when they were young? Probably difficult to answer if you haven’t been buying and consuming Burgundy for decades!

[alan_weinberg]

@James Billy

So what are your all time and how were they when they like when they were young? Probably difficult to answer if you haven’t been buying and consuming Burgundy for decades!

99 La Tâche out of barrel at DRC was my life’s vinous highlight. Magic couple hours with B. Noblet. Still the best young red Burg I have tasted in 30 years.

[Robert_Pavlovich]

To give another viewpoint to any fence sitters, Aubert de Villain described 2015 as a hypothetical blend of 2005 and 2003, and from what I’ve tasted so far I tend to agree.

If you like the idea of just a little fatter 2005, which many will, myself included, there is some of that out there and I’ve been trying to hunt some down. Had a gorgeous 2015 Nathalie Vigot Bourgogne the other night that was brilliant. But have also had a Leroy that tasted pruney and alcoholic, a pretty nice Hubert Lignier, and an overblown Morey Coffinet.

As a few of us pragmatists have pointed out, there are sure to be stellar wines this vintage, but if you like elevated acids along with concentrated fruit, a bit of dectective work should be amply rewarded, and is always fun.

[Martin_Steinley]

@Gerhard P.

2015 is easily the best vintage since 2009/10 or even 2005 … one may not like it now, which is simply a matter of taste, but to deny the obvious qualities is … well, no sign of real deep knowledge …

Fine wine is made from perfectly ripe fruit …

How can you not see that this is all a matter of opinion? If you don’t want push back, couch what you say with “IMO” or the like. What is one person’s “perfectly ripe fruit” is another’s “too ripe.” I have tasted enough 2015s to know that they are ripe and they are dense. Many will love them and I expect that they will be particularly good after they have many years to stretch out and unfurl. However, better than 2011-2014? Depends what you like and for what. As for me, I am with Alan. And, that is a matter of my OPINION.

[Pau1_M3nk3s]

@Robert Pavlovich

To give another viewpoint to any fence sitters, Aubert de Villain described 2015 as a hypothetical blend of 2005 and 2003, and from what I’ve tasted so far I tend to agree.

If you like the idea of just a little fatter 2005, which many will, myself included, there is some of that out there and I’ve been trying to hunt some down. Had a gorgeous 2015 Nathalie Vigot Bourgogne the other night that was brilliant. But have also had a Leroy that tasted pruney and alcoholic, a pretty nice Hubert Lignier, and an overblown Morey Coffinet.

As a few of us pragmatists have pointed out, there are sure to be stellar wines this vintage, but if you like elevated acids along with concentrated fruit, a bit of dectective work should be amply rewarded, and is always fun.

From the minute sampling I’ve had so far of 2015s, 2003x2005 is a pretty good description! At this point I’m liking 2010 more.

[James_Billy]

@alan weinberg

99 La Tâche out of barrel at DRC was my life’s vinous highlight. Magic couple hours with B. Noblet. Still the best young red Burg I have tasted in 30 years.

I meant best mature red Burgundy. Second part was how much fruit? How ripe? How much tannin? Acid?

I wanted to determine what was the starting point for your all time favourite mature RB. Sorry for not being clear.

[Gerhard_P]

@Martin Steinley

@Gerhard P.

2015 is easily the best vintage since 2009/10 or even 2005 … one may not like it now, which is simply a matter of taste, but to deny the obvious qualities is … well, no sign of real deep knowledge …

Fine wine is made from perfectly ripe fruit …

How can you not see that this is all a matter of opinion? If you don’t want push back, couch what you say with “IMO” or the like. What is one person’s “perfectly ripe fruit” is another’s “too ripe.” I have tasted enough 2015s to know that they are ripe and they are dense. Many will love them and I expect that they will be particularly good after they have many years to stretch out and unfurl. However, better than 2011-2014? Depends what you like and for what. As for me, I am with Alan. And, that is a matter of my OPINION.

Yes, IMHO 2015 is “better” than 2011-2014 …

How can you not see that this is all a matter of opinion?

Well, not everything in life is a matter of personal opinion …
Was Mozart a better composer than Salieri?
Beethoven better than Bob Dylan?



(one may still prefer Dylan - and hate Beethoven … THAT´s personal preference)

[James_Billy]

Gerhart,

Dylan and Beethoven. Apples and oranges.

[Ralph_George]

@James Billy

Gerhart,

Dylan and Beethoven. Apples and oranges.

Dylan and Beethoven were both songwriters. Apples and oranges are both fruit.

[Markus_S]

@Martin Steinley

How can you not see that this is all a matter of opinion? If you don’t want push back, couch what you say with “IMO” or the like.

I don’t think you need to couch opinions here. People know this is an internet board and know that people are speaking their own mind.

@Martin Steinley

… However, better than 2011-2014? …

Gee, you’re one of the first people I’ve seen standing up for 2011. I’ve been reading nothing but knocks on that vintage here for years. Nice to see a voice of reason!

[Ralph_George]

How did we switch from wine to furniture? Who cares about how anyone feels about a sofa?

[Craig_G]

Oranges are better than apples. If you don’t agree, we have nothing more to talk about.

[k_s_h_i_n]

@Markus S

Gee, you’re one of the first people I’ve seen standing up for 2011. I’ve been reading nothing but knocks on that vintage here for years. Nice to see a voice of reason!

Markus,
As you may recall, I got grilled for my take on the 11 vintage. I am not quite sure whether your statement is quite accurate. Do you still believe that the 11s have no issue?

[Martin_Steinley]

@k s h i n

@Markus S

Gee, you’re one of the first people I’ve seen standing up for 2011. I’ve been reading nothing but knocks on that vintage here for years. Nice to see a voice of reason!

Markus,
As you may recall, I got grilled for my take on the 11 vintage. I am not quite sure whether your statement is quite accurate. Do you still believe that the 11s have no issue?

You did and you continue to be. 2011 has less ripeness and low alcohol. 2015 has plenty of ripeness and high alcohol. Some will find some 2011s to be underripe with a green aspect. Some will find some 2015s to be overripe with a jammy or pruney character. Neither vintage is flawed or “tainted” as you like to say. You are unlikely to find support for your theory from Markus as I don’t believe that he is a run, don’t walk for the biggest and best sort of guy. I also get the impression that he generally enjoys a bottle at a time at the dinner table versus the big taste off events and write ups which is the sole focus of some here. Wines from “lesser” vintages do really well in the former context.

[k_s_h_i_n]

@Martin Steinley

@k s h i n

@Markus S

Gee, you’re one of the first people I’ve seen standing up for 2011. I’ve been reading nothing but knocks on that vintage here for years. Nice to see a voice of reason!

Markus,
As you may recall, I got grilled for my take on the 11 vintage. I am not quite sure whether your statement is quite accurate. Do you still believe that the 11s have no issue?

You did and you continue to be. 2011 has less ripeness and low alcohol. 2015 has plenty of ripeness and high alcohol. Some will find some 2011s to be underripe with a green aspect. Some will find some 2015s to be overripe with a jammy or pruney character. Neither vintage is flawed or “tainted” as you like to say. You are unlikely to find support for your theory from Markus as I don’t believe that he is a run, don’t walk for the biggest and best sort of guy. I also get the impression that he generally enjoys a bottle at a time at the dinner table versus the big taste off events and write ups which is the sole focus of some here. Wines from “lesser” vintages do really well in the former context.

Martin,
I am not saying anything about the 15 vintage. My point is not about the ripeness as I love the 07s and 08s as well as the 14s. Can you just address two questions?

Have you found any of the 11s having the 04 like taint?

When the 11 was originally released, was there a good reason to buy them, in lieu of the high prices?

[Ian_Fitzsimmons]

@Marcus Dean

2015 is going to need time to shed some baby fat and come around. I believe that most wines will shut down pretty hard and need longer to come around. Say around 15 years for Borgogne and 17+ for Village,20+ for premier cru and Grand Crus could be misunderstood for a long long time. The great thing about 2015 is the lesser terriors really performed and I have loaded up on good value (IMHO) borgogne, village and lesser premier cru that I feel have outperformed their origins in this vintage.
Yes I like the edgy nature of 2013 and I like the relaxed balance of 2014 and I like the sunshine in a bottle that is 2015, at certain times in the future each of these vintages will drink better than the others, but if I make it to my 75th birthday in 2046 I will be drinking 2015 Burgundy

I recall something from Meadows on the 2005 vintager, extolling the quality of the regional and village bottlings. Whom have you favored with your purchases at these levels so far?

[Ian_Fitzsimmons]

@Ralph George

@James Billy

Gerhart,

Dylan and Beethoven. Apples and oranges.

Dylan and Beethoven were both songwriters. Apples and oranges are both fruit.

Did Beethoven write many songs?

[Ralph_George]

@Ian Fitzsimmons

@Ralph George

@James Billy

Gerhart,

Dylan and Beethoven. Apples and oranges.

Dylan and Beethoven were both songwriters. Apples and oranges are both fruit.

Did Beethoven write many songs?

Yes, he did Mr. Pedant - he composed (wrote) quite a few symphonies (songs).

[Marcus_Dean]

@Ian Fitzsimmons

@Marcus Dean

2015 is going to need time to shed some baby fat and come around. I believe that most wines will shut down pretty hard and need longer to come around. Say around 15 years for Borgogne and 17+ for Village,20+ for premier cru and Grand Crus could be misunderstood for a long long time. The great thing about 2015 is the lesser terriors really performed and I have loaded up on good value (IMHO) borgogne, village and lesser premier cru that I feel have outperformed their origins in this vintage.
Yes I like the edgy nature of 2013 and I like the relaxed balance of 2014 and I like the sunshine in a bottle that is 2015, at certain times in the future each of these vintages will drink better than the others, but if I make it to my 75th birthday in 2046 I will be drinking 2015 Burgundy

I recall something from Meadows on the 2005 vintager, extolling the quality of the regional and village bottlings. Whom have you favored with your purchases at these levels so far?

Hudelot, Arnoux Lachaux,Labet, all of these for Borgogne and village
Benjamin Leroux, De Vogue, Roumier, and these for village only.
I opened a 2005 Borgogne from Dugat-py the other day, not quite ready but very very good for its level, but this producer has now priced me out of the market

[Mark_Golodetz]

@Ian Fitzsimmons

@Ralph George

@James Billy

Gerhart,

Dylan and Beethoven. Apples and oranges.

Dylan and Beethoven were both songwriters. Apples and oranges are both fruit.

Did Beethoven write many songs?

You may have missed the opera, Fidelio. Plenty of songs.