N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

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N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#1 Post by William Gladstone » November 3rd, 2019, 12:11 pm

I am aware that I am an ol' timer, and I live so far from the center of so much - in the Hawaiian Islands - we certainly are removed, but this entire article makes numerous references to how important and influential this Mr. Cailan is. Throughout the article each touch stone referred to - every wine shop is referred to as influential (shops I've never heard of and every restaurant he has worked is significant, style making.
I understand that the era we live in there is a goal for "Fame" and "Celebrity". so many young people when asked what they want to be, 'they want to be famous'.

My problem is not that Anthony Cailan considers himself self important, or that his groupies all trying to matter in the wine industry have placed Anthony on a vaulted position, but is the N.Y. Times really that out of touch to give the credibility to this millennial as being so influential in the wine industry?

if you are selling wine or trying to get your wine placed on fine restaurant lists it is not uncommon to have immature young men who quickly think all the attention paid them is because it is something about them. They forget it is merely the job they are holding, hired by a restaurant and the moment they abuse that job of purchasing wine - no one cares about their opinion or B.S. That i've seen over and again, I've never seen a front page article from "The Paper of Record" anoint one of these immature and mistaken - inexperienced fools affirm their standing.

"Anthony Cailan, a rising star sommelier, " the headline of the article "A celebrity Sommelier", Really?

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#2 Post by ybarselah » November 3rd, 2019, 12:15 pm

seems you completely missed the point of the story.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/01/dini ... sault.html
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#3 Post by Neal.Mollen » November 3rd, 2019, 12:27 pm

Never heard of him
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#4 Post by William Gladstone » November 3rd, 2019, 12:34 pm

Neal.Mollen wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 12:27 pm
Never heard of him
Exactly, so Neal, then you - like I - are not in the know of the influential stars of the wine world.

If you thought - that the Rothschilds, or Mondavi's, or Ernest and Julio, or Terlato's, or COSTCO, or K & L, or Zachy's and so on, are influential then we need to meet Mr. Cailan to learn what is what.

rudy kurniawan and Mr. Acker, they are influential... Even John Fox now in jail... but Anothy Cailan?

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#5 Post by William Gladstone » November 3rd, 2019, 12:39 pm

William Gladstone wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 12:34 pm
Neal.Mollen wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 12:27 pm
Never heard of him
Exactly, so Neal, then you - like I - are not in the know of the influential stars of the wine world.

If you thought - that the Rothschilds, or Mondavi's, or Ernest and Julio, or Terlato's, or COSTCO, or K & L, or Zachy's or Total Wine and More and so on, are influential then we need to meet Mr. Cailan to learn what is what.

rudy kurniawan and Mr. Acker, they are influential... Even John Fox now in jail... but Anothy Cailan?

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#6 Post by Kris Patten » November 3rd, 2019, 1:31 pm

ybarselah wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 12:15 pm
seems you completely missed the point of the story.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/01/dini ... sault.html
+1, this was about abuse of power/influence or perceived power/influence. Sickening.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#7 Post by William Gladstone » November 3rd, 2019, 1:37 pm

Kris Patten wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 1:31 pm
ybarselah wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 12:15 pm
seems you completely missed the point of the story.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/01/dini ... sault.html
+1, this was about abuse of power/influence or perceived power/influence. Sickening.
of course it is, that is obvious..

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#8 Post by Victor Hong » November 3rd, 2019, 2:45 pm

Self-created social media stars sometimes forget that fame can expose, but not excuse, questionable behavior.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#9 Post by William Gladstone » November 3rd, 2019, 2:50 pm

Victor Hong wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 2:45 pm
Self-created social media stars sometimes forget that fame can expose, but not excuse, questionable behavior.
that's what it is at this time - "self created social media " fame.. not fame from real accomplishment or achievement - but just as you state "self-created".
I feel terrible for the young people of today..

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#10 Post by GregT » November 3rd, 2019, 3:12 pm

Me too.

Poor souls.

[cry.gif]
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#11 Post by jgreco » November 3rd, 2019, 3:20 pm

ybarselah wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 12:15 pm
seems you completely missed the point of the story.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/01/dini ... sault.html
Remarkable how one can read a story with repeated instances of sexual assault and come away with the opinion that it is the NYTimes that is out of touch.
Last edited by jgreco on November 3rd, 2019, 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#12 Post by Victor Hong » November 3rd, 2019, 3:21 pm

The internet is forever, let us not forget, at least, outside of the EU.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#13 Post by DanielP » November 3rd, 2019, 3:31 pm

Another classic Gladstone post whining about young people
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#14 Post by Jason T » November 3rd, 2019, 3:43 pm

jgreco wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 3:20 pm
ybarselah wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 12:15 pm
seems you completely missed the point of the story.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/01/dini ... sault.html
Remarkable how one can read a story with repeated instances of sexual assault and come away with the opinion that it is the NYTimes that is out of touch.
Shockingly so. It’s like he read a different article. Except he didn’t.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#15 Post by Victor Hong » November 3rd, 2019, 3:56 pm

He may have read and understood the article, but wanted to discuss an additional aspect. Make no false dilemmas.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#16 Post by William Gladstone » November 3rd, 2019, 4:30 pm

Victor Hong wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 3:56 pm
He may have read and understood the article, but wanted to discuss an additional aspect. Make no false dilemmas.
Obviously - I need to state the obvious - is that it? or some people just feel better attacking on the internet.
This young man's behavior is absolutely awful, sickening to me. You do not know me or my history - however, how quickly you judge.

The accusations about this young man abusing his role is terrible, hopefully now that I've stated this - we can stop raising this questio
So many people in power have abused that power -

Simply - I am a member of a wine focused social wine community through this web site and did not realize I would have to face such attacks by pointing out another aspect that so alarmed me
The N.Y. Times prides itself on being the paper of Record, to put this idiot on the Front page and over and again state what a power figure and star he is, and some wine shop is also top of the heap (which I've never heard of0 and all of his past employee restaurant sites - I also found shocking and offensive of a differnet kind

I thought that was an appropriate topic for wine focused social community discussion.
Why several people want to assume I entirely missed that and attack me that - "I missed the point" - really?
what's missing in your life that you need to come on the internet and attack?

and the comment something as if you know me, what a chicken shit person you are... if the topic is of no interest, pass it by..
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#17 Post by William Gladstone » November 3rd, 2019, 4:33 pm

DanielP wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 3:31 pm
Another classic Gladstone post whining about young people
And you have a view in to the validity and use of my posts? You who won't even show your full name?
You know how many few hundred people I've had respectful, professional dealings with through this site in the real world?
who are you? beside hiding with some little chicken shit comment like this?
is this your thing to go on the internet and be a bully?

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#18 Post by William Gladstone » November 3rd, 2019, 4:38 pm

William Gladstone wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 12:11 pm
I am aware that I am an ol' timer, and I live so far from the center of so much - in the Hawaiian Islands - we certainly are removed, but this entire article makes numerous references to how important and influential this Mr. Cailan is. Throughout the article each touch stone referred to - every wine shop is referred to as influential (shops I've never heard of and every restaurant he has worked is significant, style making.

(BTW, not that it needed to be said, but it is an awful abuse of his role - if it is true that he did the acts accused of which damaged these young woman. This obvious comment needed to be added to end the thought that I did not comprehend that point.)

I understand that the era we live in there is a goal for "Fame" and "Celebrity". so many young people when asked what they want to be, 'they want to be famous'.

My problem is not that Anthony Cailan considers himself self important, or that his groupies all trying to matter in the wine industry have placed Anthony on a vaulted position, but is the N.Y. Times really that out of touch to give the credibility to this millennial as being so influential in the wine industry?

if you are selling wine or trying to get your wine placed on fine restaurant lists it is not uncommon to have immature young men who quickly think all the attention paid them is because it is something about them. They forget it is merely the job they are holding, hired by a restaurant and the moment they abuse that job of purchasing wine - no one cares about their opinion or B.S. That i've seen over and again, I've never seen a front page article from "The Paper of Record" anoint one of these immature and mistaken - inexperienced fools affirm their standing.

"Anthony Cailan, a rising star sommelier, " the headline of the article "A celebrity Sommelier", Really?
Of course I feel awful about what these woman have experienced.

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#19 Post by jgreco » November 3rd, 2019, 4:41 pm

ok boomer
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#20 Post by Victor Hong » November 3rd, 2019, 4:51 pm

I am an Eisenhower baby boomer too.
Some readers confuse people versus their facts.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#21 Post by DanielP » November 3rd, 2019, 4:56 pm

William Gladstone wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 4:33 pm
And you have a view in to the validity and use of my posts? You who won't even show your full name?
You know how many few hundred people I've had respectful, professional dealings with through this site in the real world?
who are you? beside hiding with some little chicken shit comment like this?
is this your thing to go on the internet and be a bully?
William,

I really don't care about your real world dealings. You insult and talk down to entire generations, and then you feign ignorance and wonder why people will call you out? Really, who's the chicken shit? Who's the bully? Maybe it's better that you consider your own lack of self-awareness.
William Gladstone wrote:
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I do not enjoy [Neal Martin's] writing style, he is a millennial and that generation tends to look at the world placing themselves in the center of the universe and the world they write about revolves around their past and present.
I find that view of the world annoying.
William Gladstone wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 12:11 pm
I understand that the era we live in there is a goal for "Fame" and "Celebrity". so many young people when asked what they want to be, 'they want to be famous'.

My problem is not that Anthony Cailan considers himself self important, or that his groupies all trying to matter in the wine industry have placed Anthony on a vaulted position, but is the N.Y. Times really that out of touch to give the credibility to this millennial as being so influential in the wine industry?

if you are selling wine or trying to get your wine placed on fine restaurant lists it is not uncommon to have immature young men who quickly think all the attention paid them is because it is something about them. They forget it is merely the job they are holding, hired by a restaurant and the moment they abuse that job of purchasing wine - no one cares about their opinion or B.S. That i've seen over and again, I've never seen a front page article from "The Paper of Record" anoint one of these immature and mistaken - inexperienced fools affirm their standing.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#22 Post by Victor Hong » November 3rd, 2019, 4:58 pm

This is becoming an open letter.....with the letter opener.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#23 Post by Victor Hong » November 3rd, 2019, 6:28 pm

GregT wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 3:12 pm
Me too.

Poor souls.

[cry.gif]
The younger generations have much greater burdens than how to gain social media fame.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#24 Post by D@vid Bu3ker » November 3rd, 2019, 6:53 pm

Rather thinly veiled complaint from William that young wine buyers don’t want what he’s selling.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#25 Post by Hal Blumberg » November 3rd, 2019, 7:21 pm

Damn, I was just about to sell you a sh*tload of Screaming Eagle so you could gouge your customers. Guess I'll pass.

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#26 Post by Ian Dorin » November 4th, 2019, 6:20 am

First off, an article very much worth talking about for it's intended purpose. I've been following this on social media via Marissa Ross as her initial posts caused quite the stir, and it obviously rose to the level of noteworthiness that it made the NY Times. It's good that it got out there in short order (relatively speaking) as there was rampant speculation as to who it was, and names were being thrown around based on the "bi-coastal Somm" factoid and there being a very limited number of people fitting that point.

To Mr. Gladstone's point, the only reason I know how Mr. Cailan is was from my time working for Heritage Auction and being in LA frequently enough to know the names being thrown around out there. I have literally no idea what his wine trade skills are, and probably won't ever have the pleasure now. I think the point of trying to paint him as a celebrity somm is a reach. Whether or not they paint him that way, what he did was horrible.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#27 Post by Doug Schulman » November 4th, 2019, 11:42 am

Ian Dorin wrote:
November 4th, 2019, 6:20 am
First off, an article very much worth talking about for it's intended purpose.
I agree. The wine business is very male dominated (this fortunately seems to be changing, but slowly), and it's sad to think that this sort of thing might be common. As disgusted as I am by Cailan's actions, I am also disgusted by Alice Feiring's response to one of the victims:
Ms. Feiring responded the next day, offering some sympathy but discouraging Ms. Makler from going public, and chiding her for not resisting more strenuously. “It is up to us to learn to say no to unwanted sexual advances,” she wrote.

“Remember, he is not much older than you,” she added. “He has more wine knowledge sure. But he was still just a kid who has some growing up to do. You may have perceived him as a powerful person in the industry, but he was/is not.”
Then for Feiring to try to excuse herself for this atrocious message because she has "personal experience with abuse" (and I don't mean to belittle whatever experience(s) she has had) is also terrible. In fact, I think that makes it even more outrageous.

I hope Cailan gets prosecuted.
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Agree...

#28 Post by TomHill » November 4th, 2019, 12:48 pm

Agree, Doug....I thought the response from Alice was pretty tone-deaf. That sorta jumped out at me.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#29 Post by Brian G r a f s t r o m » November 4th, 2019, 1:20 pm

William,

You *did* malign an entire generation. That is not likely to go over well with members of said generation, many of whom participate here. The age-old trope of deriding members of (the) younger generation(s) is just that: old. Old, and devoid of nearly any meaning. Trafficking in said tropes, however, does say a lot about *you.*

So, Yes ... people *will* judge. That's what people do. All day, every day. We are all constantly judging others ---- sometimes the judgment is positive, sometimes negative, and sometimes neutral. Deal with it. You obviously care, given your reaction. If you care so much, try to be more reasonable.

Finally, seeing as how you are a "Berserker Business," I have to say it is monumentally moronic for you to be putting-down an entire generation, as many folks from said generation are ---- wait for it ---- exactly the folks your business would love to have as customers!

And, Yes, we've never met. We don't know each other beyond what we post here. I am sitting here at my keyboard judging you, just as you sit at your keyboard and judge others about whom you write personal opinions. That's all neither here, or there.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#30 Post by Ian Dorin » November 5th, 2019, 4:48 pm

Doug Schulman wrote:
November 4th, 2019, 11:42 am
I agree. The wine business is very male dominated (this fortunately seems to be changing, but slowly), and it's sad to think that this sort of thing might be common.
Yes, it's changing in the right direction for sure, but female business ownership is still pretty rare. Not that Cailan owns anything, but the top jobs still seem to be mostly men.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#31 Post by Yao C » November 5th, 2019, 4:58 pm

Brian G r a f s t r o m wrote:
November 4th, 2019, 1:20 pm
You *did* malign an entire generation. That is not likely to go over well with members of said generation, many of whom participate here. The age-old trope of deriding members of (the) younger generation(s) is just that: old. Old, and devoid of nearly any meaning. Trafficking in said tropes, however, does say a lot about *you.*
Hi Brian, my English comprehension skills might be subpar but I fail to see where William "malign[ed] an entire generation"

As far as I can tell he's pointing out a situation where someone who's been given too much power (by social media) ended up abusing that power, this state of affairs being a not entirely flattering reflection on the times (ha!) we live in. What seems clear is that a very large number of people from many different generations are collectively culpable (I include myself in this). What's less clear is that millennials have been singled out in any way

Can you please enlighten me? I'm a millennial and would like to know if I should be outraged

[snort.gif]
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#32 Post by William Gladstone » November 5th, 2019, 5:23 pm

Yao C wrote:
November 5th, 2019, 4:58 pm
Brian G r a f s t r o m wrote:
November 4th, 2019, 1:20 pm
You *did* malign an entire generation. That is not likely to go over well with members of said generation, many of whom participate here. The age-old trope of deriding members of (the) younger generation(s) is just that: old. Old, and devoid of nearly any meaning. Trafficking in said tropes, however, does say a lot about *you.*
Hi Brian, my English comprehension skills might be subpar but I fail to see where William "malign[ed] an entire generation"

As far as I can tell he's pointing out a situation where someone who's been given too much power (by social media) ended up abusing that power, this state of affairs being a not entirely flattering reflection on the times (ha!) we live in. What seems clear is that a very large number of people from many different generations are collectively culpable (I include myself in this). What's less clear is that millennials have been singled out in any way

Can you please enlighten me? I'm a millennial and would like to know if I should be outraged

[snort.gif]
I hope you are not outraged, that is not my intent or my experience, I have a tendency to write and respond with open emotions and a false impression can be easily grasped , we've cut back on importing so many excellent Red Burgundy's and only import - 1. The wine maker is a Millennial, my attorney is a super Millennial. The Champagne we have been a loyal supporter of - which is the largest privately owned Champagne producer, is now having the reigns in the hands of a Millennials woman I cheer regularly. The changes and innovations these young people have brought is so exciting to me.

Whatever anger I was pointing out was not a put down of an entire generation, rather a characteristic I am seeing as a result of how some-one like this gentlemen is able to move into the wine world as if he is a star. Someone else stated it far more clearly about the illusion created in social media. Not from true accomplishment, knowledge, its like the Kardashian's, do they have any high level of talent, achievement or skill? Do they really add anything to this world?
I know a few people who have jobs and for 3 decades have been traveling around teaching, tutoring and administrating the information for people serious of gaining the skills of Somm's and whatever that world is.

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Nuther Article...

#33 Post by TomHill » November 6th, 2019, 7:44 am


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Re: Nuther Article...

#34 Post by JG Salazar » November 6th, 2019, 8:55 am

TomHill wrote:
November 6th, 2019, 7:44 am
As reported in BonApetit:
https://www.bonappetit.com/story/wine-industry-culture
Tom
Thanks for sharing, Marissa is doing good work.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#35 Post by Brady Daniels » November 6th, 2019, 9:02 am

Image
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#36 Post by Michae1 P0wers » November 6th, 2019, 9:33 am

Yao C wrote:
November 5th, 2019, 4:58 pm
Brian G r a f s t r o m wrote:
November 4th, 2019, 1:20 pm
You *did* malign an entire generation. That is not likely to go over well with members of said generation, many of whom participate here. The age-old trope of deriding members of (the) younger generation(s) is just that: old. Old, and devoid of nearly any meaning. Trafficking in said tropes, however, does say a lot about *you.*
Hi Brian, my English comprehension skills might be subpar but I fail to see where William "malign[ed] an entire generation"

As far as I can tell he's pointing out a situation where someone who's been given too much power (by social media) ended up abusing that power, this state of affairs being a not entirely flattering reflection on the times (ha!) we live in. What seems clear is that a very large number of people from many different generations are collectively culpable (I include myself in this). What's less clear is that millennials have been singled out in any way

Can you please enlighten me? I'm a millennial and would like to know if I should be outraged

[snort.gif]
I read it as a toothless attack on the NYT, with a backhand blow at young people generally. YMMV.

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#37 Post by Greg K » November 6th, 2019, 9:40 am

William Gladstone wrote:
November 5th, 2019, 5:23 pm
Yao C wrote:
November 5th, 2019, 4:58 pm
Brian G r a f s t r o m wrote:
November 4th, 2019, 1:20 pm
You *did* malign an entire generation. That is not likely to go over well with members of said generation, many of whom participate here. The age-old trope of deriding members of (the) younger generation(s) is just that: old. Old, and devoid of nearly any meaning. Trafficking in said tropes, however, does say a lot about *you.*
Hi Brian, my English comprehension skills might be subpar but I fail to see where William "malign[ed] an entire generation"

As far as I can tell he's pointing out a situation where someone who's been given too much power (by social media) ended up abusing that power, this state of affairs being a not entirely flattering reflection on the times (ha!) we live in. What seems clear is that a very large number of people from many different generations are collectively culpable (I include myself in this). What's less clear is that millennials have been singled out in any way

Can you please enlighten me? I'm a millennial and would like to know if I should be outraged

[snort.gif]
I hope you are not outraged, that is not my intent or my experience, I have a tendency to write and respond with open emotions and a false impression can be easily grasped , we've cut back on importing so many excellent Red Burgundy's and only import - 1. The wine maker is a Millennial, my attorney is a super Millennial. The Champagne we have been a loyal supporter of - which is the largest privately owned Champagne producer, is now having the reigns in the hands of a Millennials woman I cheer regularly. The changes and innovations these young people have brought is so exciting to me.

Whatever anger I was pointing out was not a put down of an entire generation, rather a characteristic I am seeing as a result of how some-one like this gentlemen is able to move into the wine world as if he is a star. Someone else stated it far more clearly about the illusion created in social media. Not from true accomplishment, knowledge, its like the Kardashian's, do they have any high level of talent, achievement or skill? Do they really add anything to this world?
I know a few people who have jobs and for 3 decades have been traveling around teaching, tutoring and administrating the information for people serious of gaining the skills of Somm's and whatever that world is.
Every generation throughout time has complained that the youts are becoming famous on nothing more than flash and pizazz with no substance, whereas older folks did it all with hard work. Today it's social media that's the culprit, yesterday it was radio, and I'm sure Pliny probably complained about the younger generation of Roman vintners growing beards and pushing their "natural" Falernian to seem hip.

"there is nothing new under the sun" is attributed to Solomon, and even if he wrote it, he undoubtedly borrowed it from someone else.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#38 Post by Hank Victor » November 6th, 2019, 9:41 am

Pretty bad allegations for Mr. Cailan....


But back to Will Gladstone's original post I don't see anywhere Mr. Cailan self-proclaimed himself a star. All the praise seems to be from people established in the industry. He has worked at some notable establishments and apparently has a done a good job. Wine Enthusiast gives him a nod, so does Alice Fering. His employers have obviously given him a nod for hiring him and trusting a young kid for big time wine roles.


Maybe I missed a sentence where Mr. Cailan does call himself "the best" or "rising star" but who really cares? Shouldn't everyone strive to be the best? You need to believe in yourself before anyone else does.

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#39 Post by Bryan Carr » November 6th, 2019, 11:29 am

William Gladstone wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 2:50 pm
Victor Hong wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 2:45 pm
Self-created social media stars sometimes forget that fame can expose, but not excuse, questionable behavior.
that's what it is at this time - "self created social media " fame.. not fame from real accomplishment or achievement - but just as you state "self-created".
I feel terrible for the young people of today..
I'm not sure if fame has ever in its entirety come from accomplishment or achievement, many many famous people are famous for being famous or because their fame has been created by image-doctors. For every Beatles there are dozens of Monkees, for every DeNiro and Sinatra there are dozens of Frankie Avalons and Fabians, I think time tends to let the pretenders and poseurs fall by the wayside of memory such that we only remember the true auteurs and craftspeople, when every generation was filled to the brim with hacks, also-rans, bloodless popstars and idols, vapid hunks and forgettable it-girls. The current crop is no better or worse than has ever been. There's plenty of reasons to feel terrible for the young people of today, but how they come by their celebrity and what they do with it is pretty far down a very long list.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#40 Post by Michae1 P0wers » November 6th, 2019, 11:42 am

Bryan Carr wrote:
November 6th, 2019, 11:29 am
William Gladstone wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 2:50 pm
Victor Hong wrote:
November 3rd, 2019, 2:45 pm
Self-created social media stars sometimes forget that fame can expose, but not excuse, questionable behavior.
that's what it is at this time - "self created social media " fame.. not fame from real accomplishment or achievement - but just as you state "self-created".
I feel terrible for the young people of today..
I'm not sure if fame has ever in its entirety come from accomplishment or achievement, many many famous people are famous for being famous or because their fame has been created by image-doctors. For every Beatles there are dozens of Monkees, for every DeNiro and Sinatra there are dozens of Frankie Avalons and Fabians, I think time tends to let the pretenders and poseurs fall by the wayside of memory such that we only remember the true auteurs and craftspeople, when every generation was filled to the brim with hacks, also-rans, bloodless popstars and idols, vapid hunks and forgettable it-girls. The current crop is no better or worse than has ever been. There's plenty of reasons to feel terrible for the young people of today, but how they come by their celebrity and what they do with it is pretty far down a very long list.
Very well said Bryan.

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#41 Post by Nick Christie » November 6th, 2019, 1:06 pm

This post already has incredible thread drift, but that Draymond Green quote (which I highly recommend watching and remember watching the night it was given) has inspired me to participate...

On the one hand, I envy and truly admire people who have the capacity for self-belief and hard work to push their achievement in ways rare and magnificent. We see this in sports, especially, with so many athletes around the globe growing up in poverty before making it as a World Class Professional. And as a human being who every so often tries to write and finish a creative project or two (and is nagged by self-doubt) I envy those people on a personal level even more.

On the other, in every single field in which I have been around (Private Equity, Law, politics, wine, et al.) the amount of people willing to break/ignore rule upon rule because they have "self-belief" or are convinced of their own righteous competitive instinct is just breathtaking... I live in a state (North Carolina) where there literally are no rules, sometimes. We just became (as of last week) the very last state to finally, legally allow a person to revoke consent during a sexual encounter. The very last. And there is no act, frankly in all human capacity, like sexual activity with another where we witness, as a species, the sheer terror of how "self-belief" or self-competitive instinct can often manifest itself.

Woody Allen is the all-time work-a-holic creative person who made art with a real determination... and ultimately also groomed an adopted teenager for a sexual relationship. And is alleged to have done other specific assaults, too. Who knows whatever else he did in his sexual life as a adult.

Jean-Jacque Rousseau was a prolific writer of the moral principles of human philosophy (and currently frequent high school yearbook quote) who literally abandoned his own children in orphanages over and over again. He kept having sex, kept having children, and put child after child in a foundling home rather than deal with societal or financial pressures of children... 5 children in 8 years. And this a-hole spent YEARS of his life writing books about how to raise children!

(exhales)...

These stories make me sad. It has always been hard to be a young person and avoid being preyed upon by the powerful. I wish each generation truly got better at such protection. In theory we're getting better, but it's hard to get worse than the 20th century.

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#42 Post by Mel Knox » November 6th, 2019, 6:11 pm

Purchasing agents have always exerted inappropriate power. A relative of my wife's was a chicken and egg man in New Jersey. Nothing helped sales like a c note in somebody's pocket.
There was a store owner here who chased a salesman out the door, shoved him against a wall and sucker punched him. The poor guy's boss said, don't do anything..he buys a lot of wine and liquor. I've heard lots of stories of women reps asked for quid pro quos.

In Las Vegas stories like this abound...mostly involving higher denominations than one hundred dollar bills.

I don't know what to say about this sommelier except that he seems like a pathetic loser who needs help. Maybe this moment will force him into turning his life around. I'm happy for women who have exposed him.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#43 Post by Mich@el Ch@ng » November 6th, 2019, 7:48 pm

TLDR

Honestly I saw this guy at domaine LA a couple years ago and he was talking to some west side basic about rose in a can, I had no idea he was even a somm.

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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#44 Post by Matthew King » November 6th, 2019, 8:46 pm

Mich@el Ch@ng wrote:
November 6th, 2019, 7:48 pm
TLDR

Honestly I saw this guy at domaine LA a couple years ago and he was talking to some west side basic about rose in a can, I had no idea he was even a somm.
Ah, these young kids today. Can't even be bothered to read something longer than a tweet ... [wink.gif]
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#45 Post by Randy Bowman » November 6th, 2019, 9:01 pm

This is not an anomaly. It exists across the entire spectrum of professions where men and women interact in a work environment. Position or perceived importance is a tool for sexual relations in the eyes of many. I've seen it in my profession, the professions I worked with both closely and casually. If you haven't seen it, you are blind or in solitary confinement. He just got bad press for being so obnoxious about it or got too big for his britches. If you want to discuss WHY then you have consider all the factors. Was there a prosecutable criminal offense? Why didn't the victim file a complaint? Did the victims come out because he got media attention? How far will men take advantage by position? I personally think the article is enlightening, appropriate and hopefully reaching those who could find themselves in similar situations and take the appropriate actions immediately.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#46 Post by Ian Dorin » November 7th, 2019, 7:36 am

Hank Victor wrote:
November 6th, 2019, 9:41 am
Pretty bad allegations for Mr. Cailan....


But back to Will Gladstone's original post I don't see anywhere Mr. Cailan self-proclaimed himself a star. All the praise seems to be from people established in the industry. He has worked at some notable establishments and apparently has a done a good job. Wine Enthusiast gives him a nod, so does Alice Fering. His employers have obviously given him a nod for hiring him and trusting a young kid for big time wine roles.


Maybe I missed a sentence where Mr. Cailan does call himself "the best" or "rising star" but who really cares? Shouldn't everyone strive to be the best? You need to believe in yourself before anyone else does.
As I like to say, I'm famous in my own head, and that's good enough for me champagne.gif
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He's Out

#48 Post by TomHill » November 8th, 2019, 9:20 am


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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#49 Post by Jason T » November 8th, 2019, 10:39 am

for those impacted by him, hopefully this brings some level of healing.
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Re: N.Y. Times article on " the rising star sommelier" - Anthony Cailan

#50 Post by Markus S » November 8th, 2019, 11:40 am

Michae1 P0wers wrote:
November 6th, 2019, 9:33 am
I read it as a toothless attack on the NYT, with a backhand blow at young people generally. YMMV.
At least he called it "the paper of record" instead of "fake news" or the "failing NYTimes"!
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