3 days in the Rhone

A couple friends and I are headed down to the Rhone region in a couple months. We’re not complete newbies, and have done wine trips before – Napa, Piedmont, Burgundy – but are rather ignorant when it comes to the Rhone region. I took a look back on the forum and it doesn’t seem as if there is too much up-to-date info (and yes, I know that not too much will have changed over the past couple years), but we were even just looking for some basic structure / logistics to get started.

We will have 3 days in the Rhone (arrive in Paris on a Thursday morning, take the TGV to/from Lyon, head back to Paris Sunday afternoon to stay there for a Monday morning flight). So here are some basic questions:

1a) We were thinking the trip can take 2 directions – either split time between the northern Rhone and Beaujolais, or spend a full 3 days in the Rhone. Given the fact we are there for just 3 days, what makes the most sense? Tackling the whole Rhone might be difficult – and moreover, our tastes lean more towards northern Rhone and Beaujolais wines – but at the same time it would be a missed opportunity to not see the geographic/landscape and production/varietal diversity of the full Rhone.

1b) If we decide on N. Rhone and Beaujolais, I’d assume staying in Lyon would make the most sense. But if we decide to do the full Rhone in 3 days, what are some centrally located towns in which we can stay? Or are we better off staying a night or two each someplace in the south and then in the north?

2. Does anyone have recommendations for good car services in the Northern and Southern Rhone that could pick us up every day, take us where we want to go, and drop us off in the evening? (I can get by in French so that is not an issue.) We don’t really need anyone to tailor a full itinerary for us as we like to be hands-on, just someone who can drive so we can drink is perfect.

3. Wine! As I mentioned, we don’t know a whole lot about the Rhone but some of the producers that would be on our list are: Chave, Texier, Souhaut, Calek and Gonon. But it would be great to get some of your suggestions in terms of what visits have the best combination of experience and wine quality…and we definitely prefer more rustic, intimate ones than big shiny expensive chateaux. (Although one of those is fine.)

I think that’s it – look forward to your input.

Brandon

I haven’t been there for many years, but you might find some useful information here, or here.

Definitely do Tain-l’Hermitage I caught a train from Lyon with no problems. Pretty easy to walk around the town and then jump on the Tourist Train.

There are a few private type tour operators for the Rhone in general but they are quite exxy and very hard to pin down. I did a mini-bus type basic tour in the end with Lyon Tours which was OK. (Cote-Rotie, a medieval town, etc) but it is not flexible.

Seconding Tain-l’Hermitage. Maybe consider a hike up the hill to the chapel with a picnic lunch. I highly recommend Les Mangevins for dinner. The Valrhona ‘museum’ is a nice change from wine and is but a short walk away. If you stay the night consider the Hotel de la Villeon; it’s excellent

Nothing specific to offer but I’m very jealous and I’m sure you’ll have an amazing time! I spent a long weekend in Lyon and loved every minute of it and then on another drop stayed a few days in a little farmhouse near Beaune and then drove south through the Rhone into Provence. Stunningly beautiful country all the way.

Have a GREAT trip!

Thanks very much, everyone. That’s a good start for now.

What have you guys found to be the most effective way of getting in touch with the producers? Reply rates via email (after 4 days) have been much lower than I’ve found typical.

Thought I’d recap my trip for everyone’s benefit. We ended up focusing on the Northern Rhone – essentially Cote-Rotie down to Cornas.

We visited 6 producers, and also had dinner at Anne-Sophie Pic and Daniel et Denise (in Lyon). Anne-Sophie Pic was spectacular, we had a 6-hour meal there that didn’t drag at all, and toured the kitchen and wine cellar. We also appreciated that the sommelier had some fun with us, as he did a blind tasting to accompany the meal.

By far the best visits we had were at Balthazar, Gonon and Souhaut.

Producer visits

Clusel Roch: This was our first stop. Guillaume introduced himself to us but otherwise the tasting was run by a younger woman working at the domaine. We tried a number of their “Traboules” wines (from the Coteaux de Lyonnais) as well as their Condrieu and three Cote-Roties – the Classique, the Viallieres and the Grandes Places. I enjoyed their Traboules rosé (Gamay) as well as the Classique Cote-Rotie the best. Overall it was a nice visit but pretty perfunctory, and the only visit we had where the winemaker was not present at the tasting.

René Rostaing: Exceptional wines. We had the opportunity to try his 2009 La Landonne, along with his 2015 Ampodium, a Condrieu and some of his non-appellation wines (including one from the Languedoc). His wines are exceptional, though I enjoyed his Condrieu the least out of the ones we drank on the trip (with my favorite being a 2015 Andre Perret Chery). Once the tasting was over, it seemed like he wanted us out ASAP, basically telling us “Thank you, the tasting is over.” It was a bit abrupt, especially since he did not do the same to a more formally dressed, older French crowd — we are probably some of his younger visitors, 25-30 years old, and were casually dressed. Again, not a particularly memorable visit aside from his Cote-Roties.

Jean-Michel Stephan: We thoroughly enjoyed this visit, even though we only tasted one of his wines. JM is a passionate guy with a good sense of humour and took us on a walk through his (very steep) vineyards, explaining his philosophy and work there. We then tried his 2016 Cote-Rotie, which was (in contrast to everything I’ve read) very approachable so young, with a lot of depth and purity. We ended up buying 2 cases from him, although we were disappointed to later see the same wine offered for EUR 8 less in a local shop…

Franck Balthazar: He is a super guy, very easygoing and always smiling and laughing. He also has some exceptional wines. Due to traffic we were 30 minutes late (we called to give a heads up), and he wasn’t miffed at all. He was quite generous with the tasting; we had his Cuvee Casimir (2016), Sans Soufre (2016) and Chaillot (2016 and 2010). All were fantastic, but I enjoyed the 2016 Casimir and 2010 Chaillot the most.

Pierre Gonon: Coming in, we knew the wines would be excellent but we were very surprised at how great the overall visit was. We had assumed, possibly unfairly, that because the wines are so serious and the domaine so well-established that they would have a similar going-through-the-motions feel we got at Rostaing. Nothing could be further from the truth. Jean, who ran the tasting, is a super guy (it helps that he’s the only winemaker we met who spoke English, and he is fluent). He had some fun with us as well, pouring a 2007 VV and a red 2001 St. Joseph red. We also tried the 2015 and 2016 St. Jo reds, 2016 Iles Feray, Chasselas and St. Jo whites. Just a generous, genuine and gregarious — yet introspective — guy.

Hervé Souhaut: We had to pull a couple strings to make this happen but it was well worth it. They don’t typically take visitors who are not wine professionals. The drive from Mauves to Arlesbosc is stunning (drive carefully if you do it!), carving through steep forested mountains overlooking deep river gorges. Hervé, Béatrice, Béatrice’s mom and their dog, Winnie, all greeted us at the gate of their home, a hundreds-year-old fort. We tasted through pretty much everything in his barrel room, including each of the individual parcels that make up his Souteronne and Ardeche Syrah (both are a blend of grapes from three different parcels that are vinified separately then blended – we tasted them before blending). He clearly saw we were enjoying ourselves and fans of his wines, and ended up pulling out a 2001 Souteronne and 2003 DRD (Marsanne / Rousanne) for us to just sit and share with him and Béatrice at a stone table in his front yard. Super, super people with delicious wines. They even gave us each a bottle of their Clos des Cessieux as a parting gift.

My wife and I did both the Northern and Southern Rhone a year and a half ago. For the first part of your question, I would think its completely up to you on what wine regions to explore, however I would say if you are doing Southern Rhone to spend a night in Avignon or vicinity, it will make your tasting experience so much better than trying to make it back up to Lyon every night. Obviously with Beaujolais staying in Lyon would be fine.

We had a rental car and only tasted at a couple places so we just drove so can’t help you there. For the Northern Rhone we really enjoyed our tasting at Yves Cuilleron, and in the Southern Rhone at Domaine Santa Duc

Sounds like a fun trip! Make sure you save time to enjoy Lyon especially the bouchons and there less serious take on local wine.

Thanks for the report! If you do not mind me asking how were the prices at the two addresses above (especially for the top wines)?

Brandon, I am curious about how your group got between producers. Did you rent a car or take the train from Lyon each day? We are heading to the Northern Rhone in the fall and your recap has been helpful.

Enjoy reading this. I will be in Tain l’Hermitage for 2 nights in June, so this is timely info for me.

Interested to see your experience on non-response from wineries. I have had a little of that both in Rhone and Barolo and I have only contacted places with websites that imply they take visitors.

How did you get in contact with Gonon? I haven’t found a website or contact info for them. Didn’t know if you had to have a referral from a retailer or importer to get in touch with them.

So far, I have appointments with Coursodon in St Joseph and Voge in Cornas. Am looking for 2 or maybe 3 additional places to make appointments. Ideally, would like one in Hermitage area, Cote Rotie and Condrieu, but am somewhat flexible.

One that I am considering is Guigal. Anyone have experience with visits there? Would definitely like to visit someone in Cote Rotie and didn’t know if they would be a good choice. I assume they probably don’t pour the La La Cote Rotie’s for visitors unless you are someone pretty connected in the industry, but that isn’t really a problem to me.

As I mentioned, we are staying in Tain and our apartment is within easy walking distance from both Jaboulet and Chapoutier. I get the impression that they both have open tasting rooms/wine bars that you can go to without appointment. Is that correct? For Hermitage/Crozes, was also thinking about trying to get an appointment at Yann Chave. Just read IlkkaL’s 2017 post on that visit and that sounds intriguing.

Have made one reservation request in Condrieu, but that is one where I haven’t received a response back.

Rostaing said he had no wines to sell. (Now, I don’t know if that was just because he decided he didn’t like us – as alluded to in my report – or if that was truly the case.) At Balthazar, the 2016 Chaillot was EUR 35 and the 2016 Cuvee Casimir was EUR 30. Those prices struck me as very attractive.

Note that a couple of the producers from whom we did buy – Balthazar and Stephan – only took cash. We would’ve bought way more than 3 bottles each from Balthazar had we had time to withdraw more Euros!

We ended up staying one night in Vienne, at La Pyramide, to cover Cote-Rotie, and one night in Tain, at Hotel les 2 Coteaux to cover Cornas/St. Jo/Hermitage. Two very different hotels, but I would recommend either in a second. Hotel les 2 Coteaux is not fancy, but it has a spectacular location and the proprietor, Pascal, is just so incredibly hospitable.

In terms of getting between producers, two people in our group of six sacrificed themselves to act as DDs. At night we arranged for taxis to take us to/from dinner.

I would say the total response rate was only about 50%. (And I contacted all in French; I am relatively fluent writing it.) There were even a few I nudged twice and didn’t hear back from, with the exception of JL Chave, from which I got a relatively surly response in English that basically said “We don’t take visitors and don’t even think of trying to buy wine from us, either.”

I can PM you Gonon’s email if you remind me but I simply found it via Google. Pretty much every producer we wanted to visit, save for Souhaut and Dard+Ribo, had an email address listed somewhere. (The one on Souhaut’s website doesn’t actually work.) You just need to be a bit resourceful…

For the rest of your questions I’m far from the right guy to help out. This trip was more of an education on / intro to N. Rhone for me since we get very few wines from there here in Ontario…

Thanks! This is super helpful and has me looking forward to visiting in the fall.

Such a shame to hear that about your Rostaing visit, being how great many have commented the wines to be. That being said the Balthazar prices are pretty wow. Thank you very much for the heads up, although in general I never travel in Central Europe without at least dinner money with me in cash, having learned my lessons in the past.

I will be returning from the region myself the first week of May - there will be some new recommendations likely