First/business class

The thread in the Asylum about Emirates Airline’s new first class suites got me thinking about the value of being at the front of the plane. A free upgrade feels like a jackpot. It feels like Christmas morning. The seats are bigger, the food is better, the flight attendants are friendlier, and there are rarely screaming children or obese old ladies who request window seats and then get up every ten minutes to use the bathroom.

Every time Steve and I travel, particularly when we travel abroad, I look into the cost of business class tickets. And every time, without exception, I laugh and book economy seats instead. It’s not the absolute dollar amount that bothers me, but as with so many things, it’s the marginal QPR. Most international carriers offer reasonable comfort in economy class, with free booze and personal entertainment systems. Northwest/KLM’s flight from Portland to Amsterdam now starts at about $750 coach… or $4500 business class… I just can’t fathom paying that much more to arrive at the same place in the same amount of time. I don’t even like to use my miles for upgrades. I’d much rather save them for actual tickets!

As much as I like the big seats, they remind me of overpriced “expense account” steakhouses. So I’m curious about how others feel. Will you pay for upgrades out of your own pocket, or suck it up in the back of the plane unless it’s on someone else’s (your company’s, your dad’s (Zach), the airline’s, a client’s) dime?

I have never paid to ride up front, but have been upgraded or had the company pay for it. Granted I have never flown internationally, but a twenty hour flight might make me consider spending the extra cash for a lie flat seat and all the goodies on real airline such as Emirates, Singapore or Etihad.

I LOVE Business Class for international flights (or First, but I never get it), but would never pay for it. I use miles and upgrade, or get a ‘special’ if offered (when they don’t sell out the Business Class section, sometimes they offer it for a couple hundred dollars, and then it is worth it. There is no question that for a more comfortable seat, slightly better food, and perhaps better booze, the premium should only be fractionally more than coach, but then again, they don’t have as many seats in Business Class, and let’s assume the real cost for space in the plane is about that of 2 seats, in overall space usage. Fractional cost increases for food/drink value, of perhaps $40.00 maximum. All together, that makes a Business Class seat worth about 2X an Economy seat - that’s about all I’d be willing to pay, and all I ever have (actually less).

I don’t have the luxury of spending a company’s money, as my company’s money is my own, and I’m not paying $4500 for a Business Class seat…

Good post to bookmark, for later reference.

I would definitely never upgrade for leisure–I can hardly imagine a worse way to waste money. For double the price I could understand it, for 5x or 6x the price it’s just ridiculous, especially since cost cutting effort have also hit the business/first class pretty hard.

For business it’s a bit different. Most of the time the convenience is linked to the open ticket, not the seat, and the difference between an open economy and open business isn’t that high any more. I know that when I was flying business for work I didn’t worry–just show up at the airport and grab the next plane, more or less. Comfort can also be good, but here there’s no general rule (for company policy) that I could come up with. Sometimes it was definitely overkill, other times it was a life saver during tough/long weeks. Still most of the time economy would be good enough for me in terms of comfort (especially for short flights) and I resented the fact that we would fly business for a short flight on taxpayer money (in my case). Rules have changed since then–it was the good old times

I have never paid for first/business class. I always use miles and certificates to upgrade to the next level from coach. If you book far enough in advance you can usually always get an upgrade. Miles have saved me from flying coach over the last few years.


I agree though, the prices are crazy. My dad just got back from a business trip to Singapore. He flew AA from BOS-ORD-SIN. The first class ticket was upwards of 12K RT.

And that was for a shitty product.

Prety much. He said it was better than AA domestic which sucks big time. He wanted to take Singaport or BA but it wouldnt fit with his schedule. Plus he is liftime platinum on AA 2mil+ miles lifetime so he really wanted the extra miles credit.

I’ve never been “up front” on my own dime!

I’ve never paid for regular Business Class. However, I did fly l’Avion several times (MUCH cheaper than normal Business Class) and it was quite worth it (about $1200 all-in) to Paris. I’ve been upgraded for free a few times, but not lately (grrr…).

If ever I go to Asia, I’m using my 300K miles to go First/Biz, you can be assured.

The only time my employer paid for business class was on a trip from Frankfurt to Ekaterinburg. It was only $20 or $30 more than a regular ticket and I’m not even sure the regular fare was available to us.

As far as the usual pricing difference, it’s not set by the value considerations but rather by rationing considerations.

-Al

When I had lots of miles. i used to use miles to upgrade to business of first, especially for international travel. The company would pay for coach or business and I’d upgrade to business or first.

All that being said, I haven’t flown since early '04, and probably won’t fly until Homeland Security and their policies go away.

Same here. And sometimes flying another airline, they will offer an upgrade for $70 - $150, and I usually jump on it. Coach is miserable when you fly all the time, so upgrades are mandatory, and it really sucks when you don’t get them.

I think this is the point you’re missing. First Class is in the front of the plane, so you always get to your destination sooner in First Class.

AA domestic first is rancid. Why anyone would pay for it is beyond me.

I used to fly more on biz, and would haul in from the other coast and often would be able to pay 50 bucks or so for an upgrade (hell, me and the other guys could each drink that much free booze on the flight). Sadly, those days seem to be gone.

Used to get bumped on BA to London all the time to their biz class which was very nice.

Domestically I always get upgraded on Delta to first class. Buy coach, get free first class. Easy. Me and a travel companion is the deal. NICE.

Internationally I upgrade using my miles or certificates. I’ve never paid the premium but buy the normal coach well in advance, and use my miles. Here any travel companion does cost me an extra certificate or more miles, but when I’m lucky enough to have a SO to travel with , I don’t hesitate at all.

The best use of miles is overseas upgrades. Cost per mile is the QPR here. Plus you get some miles back as you get the “coach mileage” credit for purchasing.

Do the math. $18,000 first class to Tokyo is a 50,000 mile upgrade. Coach to Tokyo is normally about $1,500 when I fly (Thanksgiving time). So those 50,000 miles are worth $16,500. Actually as I get 25,000 miles for making the trip, my upgrade only costs me 25,000 miles.

Using only miles to be in first class to Tokyo: 300,000 miles. WTF?

A ticket to Southern Calif is about $600 last minute. Or 40,000 miles if I wanted to just fly for free.

The math is obvious. Pay for domestic travel, use miles to upgrade internationally.

Don’t like to pay the freight, but it makes a huge difference when you are flying long distance, particularly to Asia, which I do for business at least once a year. The ability to sleep on the plane gets you at least started to be in sync with local time and can make the first few days a lot easier. International upgrades are the best value to use miles for, but some airlines have started to charge singificant fees to allow you to use your miles for international upgrades.

I use miles to upgrade to Europe and Asia. That way you get more miles, too

We flew business class on Lufthansa this summer on an A340-600 from the States through Munich. Most definately worth it. Full flat seats, on demand movies, etc. Best business class I’ve been on.

In this economy it is so much easier to get upgraded. I’ve come to expect it this year.

The ORD-SIN segment wouldn’t have been operated by AA, even though it might have been an AA codeshare.

The first class “suite” on AA’s int’l 3-class 777 airplane is pretty decent… Five years ago it was still good, but now international competitors have installed better seats/suites. Of course the serivce, food, and liquor/wine generally lags behind.

I’m at AA’s top frequent flier status level, so that gives me free, unlimited domestic upgrades, and six one-way systemwide upgrades (including international for most purchased tickets). For personal travel, I’ve never wanted to pay for domestic business (or first) as I almost always get upgraded. I would consider purchasing a discounted biz ticket for a 10+ hour flight, but have not yet. I accrue a lot of miles each year so I typically don’t mind burning miles for “free” biz/first class international tickets.