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P. Willenberg
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#501 Post by P. Willenberg » August 15th, 2016, 1:35 pm

Ethan Abraham wrote:On a related note, anyone have a good rec for a set of stones to sharpen with? Ordering online is confusing to say the least, as it seems like a lot of what is on amazon is not properly labelled.
http://www.chefknivestogo.com/edgeproapex4.html
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#502 Post by D@v1dZ » August 15th, 2016, 1:48 pm

Ncmussell wrote:
DavidZ wrote:My recommendation would be to focus on steel, rather than producer. If you get the right steel, and you get a decent producer, you can always deal with fit and finish issues by tweaking the knife once it arrives.
I think thats exactly what I was hoping to get at. What steel should I expect at those different price points or even what steel would be recommended if you are spending in those dollar figures.
Steel is less a matter of "better or worse" than "pros and cons". Do you want stainless or carbon? Do you want a knife that can be sharpened to a sharper edge or a knife that will hold a reasonably sharp edge longer? Etc.

I picked ginsan steel for my knife because I was OK with merely stain-resistant (as opposed to true stainless, which requires 20%+ Cr in the alloy), and I wanted a knife that behaved more like a carbon steel. I don't think ginsan steel is available for $100 though - probably more like $175+ for a gyuto. 19C27 is also a nice steel, that should be in your price range. VG-10 is also really nice, definitely in your price range - my mom had a set of VG-10 knives that took a shitton of abuse. I've never used AEB-L which some folks love, and though I know there are value AEB-L knives out there I don't know whether they have good heat treatment and such.

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#503 Post by Ncmussell » August 15th, 2016, 4:12 pm

Thanks David! I am curious to try something more like carbon steel since I have worked with Wusthof and the like for several years so I could go away from straight stainless.
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#504 Post by mike pobega » August 15th, 2016, 4:16 pm

Great read. I have a few knives of mixed nature. The best knife I have used in a long is is this $60 Shun. It holds its sharpness and feels great in hand. Outshines my Shun Classic 8 inch Chefs by a Kilometer.
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#505 Post by Lee Short » August 15th, 2016, 5:44 pm

DavidZ wrote:My recommendation would be to focus on steel, rather than producer. If you get the right steel, and you get a decent producer, you can always deal with fit and finish issues by tweaking the knife once it arrives.
Except that producer and steel are inseparable, because heat treatment affects the steel. I've used other AEB-L knives that are nothing like the Devin Thomas that I used to own. Plenty of other examples, there's a real wide range in what to expect from a VG-10 knife.

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#506 Post by Lee Short » August 15th, 2016, 7:13 pm

This "cleaver" is a great bargain if you want to try a chinese chef's knife without the maintenance of carbon. I put cleaver in quotes because it's not a cleaver, it's chinese chef's knife. The fruit knives from the same line are great little knives. Haven't tried any of the other knives, but no reason they shouldn't be good values.

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#507 Post by CWun » August 15th, 2016, 10:58 pm

I was going to recommend my "old faithful" which is a Hiromoto Aogami Super Gyuto in whatever length you like or the Santoku size, but unfortunately, the line is discontinued.

The following lineup is pretty good and on amazon. My coworker got one and I tried it out:


if you are willing to spend more for a gyuto shape and aogami super steel:


It's high carbon steel cutting edge, clad with (essentially) pre-patina'd other steel.
If you really want a stainless-type blade, then I'd recommend AEB-L steel. I never had much luck with VG10 et al steels.
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#508 Post by D@v1dZ » August 16th, 2016, 6:37 am

Lee Short wrote:
DavidZ wrote:My recommendation would be to focus on steel, rather than producer. If you get the right steel, and you get a decent producer, you can always deal with fit and finish issues by tweaking the knife once it arrives.
Except that producer and steel are inseparable, because heat treatment affects the steel. I've used other AEB-L knives that are nothing like the Devin Thomas that I used to own. Plenty of other examples, there's a real wide range in what to expect from a VG-10 knife.
Sure. But steels behave in a certain way, and you need to figure out what kind of behavior you want. Do you want something durable? Something easy to sharpen? Something that holds an edge well? That is all highly steel-dependent.

Then, I agree, there is a difference b/w the best and the worst because of heat-treatment, stamped v. forged, etc.

For me, I don't love stainless b/c I grew up using carbon in my mom's kitchen, but she and I have (independently!) found high-carbon stain-resistant steel to work for us.

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#509 Post by Jay Miller » August 16th, 2016, 7:46 am

I've been very happy with my Masanobu VG10 knives but I'm someone who doesn't want to be sharpening my knives all the time. Also, after buying them I read some knife forums which seem to feel that while the quality is very good they are a bit overpriced.

I know Suzanne likes Misono and our blind tasting group has given them as presents for some hosts who have liked them a lot.
Ripe fruit isn't necessarily a flaw.

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#510 Post by Lee Short » August 16th, 2016, 8:44 am

DavidZ wrote:
Lee Short wrote:
DavidZ wrote:My recommendation would be to focus on steel, rather than producer. If you get the right steel, and you get a decent producer, you can always deal with fit and finish issues by tweaking the knife once it arrives.
Except that producer and steel are inseparable, because heat treatment affects the steel. I've used other AEB-L knives that are nothing like the Devin Thomas that I used to own. Plenty of other examples, there's a real wide range in what to expect from a VG-10 knife.
Sure. But steels behave in a certain way, and you need to figure out what kind of behavior you want. Do you want something durable? Something easy to sharpen? Something that holds an edge well? That is all highly steel-dependent.

Then, I agree, there is a difference b/w the best and the worst because of heat-treatment, stamped v. forged, etc.

For me, I don't love stainless b/c I grew up using carbon in my mom's kitchen, but she and I have (independently!) found high-carbon stain-resistant steel to work for us.
It sounds like you'd really like the "semi-stainless" knives of Nakaya Heiji. They sharpen easily and hold an edge a really long time. You can Google for the website. The 240mm wa-gyuto is 26,000 yen plus shipping.

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#511 Post by D@v1dZ » August 16th, 2016, 9:13 am

Lee Short wrote:
It sounds like you'd really like the "semi-stainless" knives of Nakaya Heiji. They sharpen easily and hold an edge a really long time. You can Google for the website. The 240mm wa-gyuto is 26,000 yen plus shipping.
Those look awesome - thanks for the tip.

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#512 Post by Ncmussell » August 19th, 2016, 7:27 pm

So I'm curious whether people have opinions on something like a Miyabi Kaiven II made of VG10 would be worth $100 or whether I would be better off with any of the cheaper chef knives from like chefknivestogo.com or like the tojiro dp series. I tried the Miyabi and it felt very nice so would be interested in something like that. I see plenty of different things on EBay from places like hanonbam (sp?) but not sure of their quality relative to others.
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#513 Post by Craig G » January 13th, 2017, 11:36 am

I was looking for a paring knife for my bar and found this:
IMG_1351.JPG
IMG_1351.JPG (43.76 KiB) Viewed 3172 times
IMG_1354.JPG
IMG_1354.JPG (36.05 KiB) Viewed 3172 times
It's from here:
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#514 Post by Colby Scott » January 13th, 2017, 12:19 pm

What knife do you pros recommend for cutting onions?

Weep almost every time regardless of how sharp my Victorinox or Wusthof is. Just not thin enough I guess. A specific knife just for cutting onions instead of a chef's knife?

I don't know. Help please!

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#515 Post by Betty C » January 13th, 2017, 3:51 pm

Colby Scott wrote:What knife do you pros recommend for cutting onions?

Weep almost every time regardless of how sharp my Victorinox or Wusthof is. Just not thin enough I guess. A specific knife just for cutting onions instead of a chef's knife?

I don't know. Help please!
It's not your knives. The trick is to make someone else cut it. If you don't have a rube handy, then wear some lab goggles. Chilling the onion in the fridge first also makes it less potent.
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#516 Post by Todd F r e n c h » January 13th, 2017, 4:03 pm

Betty C wrote:
Colby Scott wrote:What knife do you pros recommend for cutting onions?

Weep almost every time regardless of how sharp my Victorinox or Wusthof is. Just not thin enough I guess. A specific knife just for cutting onions instead of a chef's knife?

I don't know. Help please!
It's not your knives. The trick is to make someone else cut it. If you don't have a rube handy, then wear some lab goggles. Chilling the onion in the fridge first also makes it less potent.
He's not asking about the teary eyes - it's just hard to cut onions! I agree, you need a pretty thin blade, it seems, as nearly anything else seems difficult to pass through the onion. I've had success with a Santoku style blade, as I think the indentations help a lot
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#517 Post by Betty C » January 13th, 2017, 4:54 pm

Todd F r e n c h wrote:
Colby Scott wrote: Weep almost every time regardless of how sharp my Victorinox or Wusthof is.
He's not asking about the teary eyes - it's just hard to cut onions! I agree, you need a pretty thin blade, it seems, as nearly anything else seems difficult to pass through the onion. I've had success with a Santoku style blade, as I think the indentations help a lot
So he weeps over having the wrong knife?
Ch00

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#518 Post by Colby Scott » January 13th, 2017, 5:14 pm

Betty C wrote:
Todd F r e n c h wrote:
Colby Scott wrote: Weep almost every time regardless of how sharp my Victorinox or Wusthof is.
He's not asking about the teary eyes - it's just hard to cut onions! I agree, you need a pretty thin blade, it seems, as nearly anything else seems difficult to pass through the onion. I've had success with a Santoku style blade, as I think the indentations help a lot
So he weeps over having the wrong knife?
Ironic that I was asking about tears but Todd French is right also -- it IS hard to get through an onion quickly.

Once knew a guy that used this style knife:

Image

to slice his half-onions in a few seconds and he never shed a tear. What is this style of knife called? "Chop" knife? That doesn't seem right.

He was fearless so perhaps I just need to work on getting through the onion faster.

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#519 Post by Colby Scott » January 13th, 2017, 5:19 pm

Cleaver maybe?

OK I answered my own question it seems. Can anyone recommend a very thin Japanese or German cleaver?

This one would match with the rest of my set:



Judging from the reviews I answered my own question for the second time.

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#520 Post by Betty C » January 13th, 2017, 6:03 pm

Colby Scott wrote:Cleaver maybe?

OK I answered my own question it seems. Can anyone recommend a very thin Japanese or German cleaver?

This one would match with the rest of my set:



Judging from the reviews I answered my own question for the second time.
Lol, glad it's settled.

I volunteer doing kitchen prep like chopping fruits and veggies, and 99% of the time when volunteers cut themselves, it's over onions.
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#521 Post by Robert Pollard-Smith » January 13th, 2017, 7:47 pm

You need a proper sharp knife and an onion...

[youtube]lBp8-79LIA8[/youtube]

[cheers.gif]
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#522 Post by Todd F r e n c h » January 13th, 2017, 7:49 pm

Betty C wrote:
Todd F r e n c h wrote:
Colby Scott wrote: Weep almost every time regardless of how sharp my Victorinox or Wusthof is.
He's not asking about the teary eyes - it's just hard to cut onions! I agree, you need a pretty thin blade, it seems, as nearly anything else seems difficult to pass through the onion. I've had success with a Santoku style blade, as I think the indentations help a lot
So he weeps over having the wrong knife?
Indeed, missed 'weep', apparently...but I do notice that my incredibly sharp Japanese knife struggles through onions, like there's extra resistance...however, the weeping issue is apparently solved (via my daughter, who saw/heard it on YouTube, apparently) by chewing gum while cutting! Never tried it..
Apparently I'm lazy, have a narrow agenda, and offer little in the way of content and substance (RMP) (and have a "penchant for gossip" -KBI)

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#523 Post by Robert Pollard-Smith » January 13th, 2017, 7:53 pm

[youtube]QGvvFehZei0[/youtube]
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#524 Post by Betty C » January 13th, 2017, 11:06 pm

Todd F r e n c h wrote: Indeed, missed 'weep', apparently...but I do notice that my incredibly sharp Japanese knife struggles through onions, like there's extra resistance...however, the weeping issue is apparently solved (via my daughter, who saw/heard it on YouTube, apparently) by chewing gum while cutting! Never tried it..
I think I will try chewing gum the next time I tell my husband to cut the onions. He cuts, I chew! :)
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#525 Post by Colby Scott » January 14th, 2017, 4:35 am

Robert Pollard-Smith wrote:You need a proper sharp knife and an onion...

[youtube]lBp8-79LIA8[/youtube]

[cheers.gif]
Is that you?

Definitely faster than me but way slower than the guy I used to watch with the cleaver. Literally 1-2 seconds. It drove me crazy. Now I wish I would of caught it on video. He was such an arrogant prick though...

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#526 Post by Robert Pollard-Smith » January 14th, 2017, 7:05 am

Not me, not even close to my turtle-rate.
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#527 Post by Jason Hagen » January 14th, 2017, 10:44 am

mike pobega wrote:Great read. I have a few knives of mixed nature. The best knife I have used in a long is is this $60 Shun. It holds its sharpness and feels great in hand. Outshines my Shun Classic 8 inch Chefs by a Kilometer.
I grabbed one of these from Home Goods. Thought I might give it away at that price but then I tried and was shocked by how great it was. Beyond bang for your buck with this knife.

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#528 Post by RichardFlack » January 14th, 2017, 1:46 pm

Betty C wrote:
Todd F r e n c h wrote: Indeed, missed 'weep', apparently...but I do notice that my incredibly sharp Japanese knife struggles through onions, like there's extra resistance...however, the weeping issue is apparently solved (via my daughter, who saw/heard it on YouTube, apparently) by chewing gum while cutting! Never tried it..
I think I will try chewing gum the next time I tell my husband to cut the onions. He cuts, I chew! :)
Or just hold your breath.

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#529 Post by David J » April 2nd, 2017, 1:27 pm

I hunt a lot and just ordered a murray carter boning knife. Pretty stoked to try it out on the next pig I shoot.
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#530 Post by M Hoose » April 2nd, 2017, 2:58 pm

David J wrote:I hunt a lot and just ordered a murray carter boning knife. Pretty stoked to try it out on the next pig I shoot.
Be interested to hear your thoughts on the knife - I use Dozier. And also where you hunt!

Thanks
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#531 Post by David J » April 2nd, 2017, 5:29 pm

M Hoose wrote:
David J wrote:I hunt a lot and just ordered a murray carter boning knife. Pretty stoked to try it out on the next pig I shoot.
Be interested to hear your thoughts on the knife - I use Dozier. And also where you hunt!

Thanks

Texas and Louisiana mostly but also some on the east coast and Midwest. Mostly deer, duck and pig but I will throw in turkey and other birds at times
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#532 Post by Nick Gangas » April 19th, 2017, 9:49 am

Anyone try Takeda ? thoughts ?

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#533 Post by Kevin Porter » April 19th, 2017, 1:15 pm

Colby Scott wrote:Cleaver maybe?

OK I answered my own question it seems. Can anyone recommend a very thin Japanese or German cleaver?

This one would match with the rest of my set:



Judging from the reviews I answered my own question for the second time.
I was fascinated by Japanese vegetable cleavers (Nakiri, I think, or perhaps a sub-set of Nakiri?). I went cheap because I wasn't sure. I got this around Christmas and have used it almost exclusively for vegetables since then - https://www.amazon.com/Mercer-Culinary- ... able+knife. Obviously, I'm not in the high-end market. My standard chef's knife is the Victorinox/Fibrox.

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#534 Post by Carlos Delpin » April 19th, 2017, 1:57 pm

Nick Gangas wrote:Anyone try Takeda ? thoughts ?
Love Takeda in both carbon and stainless. Great edge retention and love the fit and finish.

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#535 Post by Nick Gangas » April 20th, 2017, 7:48 pm

thanks Carlos.

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#536 Post by Rob_S » April 21st, 2017, 7:27 am

Kevin Porter wrote:
Colby Scott wrote:Cleaver maybe?

OK I answered my own question it seems. Can anyone recommend a very thin Japanese or German cleaver?

This one would match with the rest of my set:



Judging from the reviews I answered my own question for the second time.
I was fascinated by Japanese vegetable cleavers (Nakiri, I think, or perhaps a sub-set of Nakiri?). I went cheap because I wasn't sure. I got this around Christmas and have used it almost exclusively for vegetables since then - https://www.amazon.com/Mercer-Culinary- ... able+knife. Obviously, I'm not in the high-end market. My standard chef's knife is the Victorinox/Fibrox.
I bought one of thesehttps://knifewear.com/collections/fujim ... kiri-150mm and love it. Great site for Japanese knives as well.
utherland

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#537 Post by CJ Beazley » April 24th, 2017, 12:46 pm

Rob_S wrote:
Kevin Porter wrote:
Colby Scott wrote:Cleaver maybe?

OK I answered my own question it seems. Can anyone recommend a very thin Japanese or German cleaver?

This one would match with the rest of my set:



Judging from the reviews I answered my own question for the second time.
I was fascinated by Japanese vegetable cleavers (Nakiri, I think, or perhaps a sub-set of Nakiri?). I went cheap because I wasn't sure. I got this around Christmas and have used it almost exclusively for vegetables since then - https://www.amazon.com/Mercer-Culinary- ... able+knife. Obviously, I'm not in the high-end market. My standard chef's knife is the Victorinox/Fibrox.
I bought one of thesehttps://knifewear.com/collections/fujim ... kiri-150mm and love it. Great site for Japanese knives as well.
Great, thanks now I HAVE to get one of those, perfect size if you don't want to go the full on cleaver.
I know this sounds lazy, but I'd like to find that knife in all stainless just for ease of care.
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#538 Post by Rob_S » April 24th, 2017, 1:37 pm

Rob_S wrote:
Kevin Porter wrote:
Colby Scott wrote:Cleaver maybe?

I was fascinated by Japanese vegetable cleavers (Nakiri, I think, or perhaps a sub-set of Nakiri?). I went cheap because I wasn't sure. I got this around Christmas and have used it almost exclusively for vegetables since then - https://www.amazon.com/Mercer-Culinary- ... able+knife. Obviously, I'm not in the high-end market. My standard chef's knife is the Victorinox/Fibrox.
I bought one of thesehttps://knifewear.com/collections/fujim ... kiri-150mm and love it. Great site for Japanese knives as well.
Great, thanks now I HAVE to get one of those, perfect size if you don't want to go the full on cleaver.
I know this sounds lazy, but I'd like to find that knife in all stainless just for ease of care.
Ask and you shall recieve: https://knifewear.com/collections/nakir ... less-steel
From cheapest to more expensive (Four of many):
https://knifewear.com/collections/nakir ... 5mm-f-171r
https://knifewear.com/collections/nakir ... 65mm-f-502
https://knifewear.com/collections/nakir ... kiri-165mm
https://knifewear.com/collections/nakir ... kiri-165mm
utherland

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#539 Post by CJ Beazley » April 24th, 2017, 2:21 pm

BOOM! SOLD!
Love the stainless, love the stamping.
https://knifewear.com/collections/nakir ... kiri-165mm
Don't you have to stay after these stainless ones a little extra to keep the edge?

I owe you a favor Rob, thanks a mil.
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#540 Post by Tom G l a s g o w » April 25th, 2017, 7:08 pm

CJ Beazley wrote:BOOM! SOLD!
Love the stainless, love the stamping.
https://knifewear.com/collections/nakir ... kiri-165mm
Don't you have to stay after these stainless ones a little extra to keep the edge?

I owe you a favor Rob, thanks a mil.
Read the care instructions on the website, you're supposed to use a ceramic rod

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#541 Post by Jay $$ Winton » April 26th, 2017, 8:02 am

Need some help. A Japanese knife (Shun??) I bought is rusting. What's the best way to get rid of the rust?
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#542 Post by Robert Pollard-Smith » April 26th, 2017, 8:36 am

Rust eraser 'medium'
https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/co ... ser-medium

Rust eraser, 'fine'
https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/co ... raser-fine

Or, at the same site, get a new knife. flirtysmile
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#543 Post by Jay $$ Winton » April 26th, 2017, 8:50 am

Robert Pollard-Smith wrote:Rust eraser 'medium'
https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/co ... ser-medium

Rust eraser, 'fine'
https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/co ... raser-fine

Or, at the same site, get a new knife. flirtysmile
Thanks but do I need medium or fine? I bought the knife locally so may take it back to them and get a pro to take care of it.
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#544 Post by Robert Pollard-Smith » April 26th, 2017, 9:10 am

J a y W i n t % n wrote:
Robert Pollard-Smith wrote:Rust eraser 'medium'
https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/co ... ser-medium

Rust eraser, 'fine'
https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/co ... raser-fine

Or, at the same site, get a new knife. flirtysmile
Thanks but do I need medium or fine? I bought the knife locally so may take it back to them and get a pro to take care of it.
Call JKI, ask for Jon, tell him what your problem is, and he will get you situated.
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When you think he's near, he's far away

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#545 Post by Joe Chanley » April 26th, 2017, 12:38 pm

in a similar vein, I was breaking down a chicken and chipped my 210 gyuto pretty significantly....assuming I need professional assistance to help, but any other advice would be appreciated.

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#546 Post by M Hudson » May 16th, 2017, 6:32 pm

Where is the chip?
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#547 Post by Scott Butler » May 17th, 2017, 7:30 am

I just read this article and found it to be useful. it's more for the person just getting into knives who needs some general knowledge on steel and which knife for specific uses. The experts here probably won't get anything out of it.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/foodanddrink/t ... 7Kz#page=1
WOTY:61 Chateau Verdignan

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#548 Post by Barry Paul Price » May 17th, 2017, 1:17 pm

Scott Butler wrote:I just read this article and found it to be useful. it's more for the person just getting into knives who needs some general knowledge on steel and which knife for specific uses. The experts here probably won't get anything out of it.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/foodanddrink/t ... 7Kz#page=1
Useful for someone like me! Thanks!
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#549 Post by dcornutt » May 17th, 2017, 3:12 pm

For the money, my Misono UX10 is hard to beat. I have a ton of different knives but this is the best I have owned.
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#550 Post by Scott Butler » May 17th, 2017, 5:06 pm

[quote="Barry Paul Price"][quote="Scott Butler"]I just read this article and found it to be useful. it's more for the person just getting into knives who needs some general knowledge on steel and which knife for specific uses. The experts here probably won't get anything out of it.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/foodanddrink/t ... 7Kz#page=1[/quote]

Useful for someone like me! Thanks![/quote]
Glad I could help!

My in-laws gave me a set of Shun classic knives, reviews were so so but I like them so far. I added a Shun Premier 6.5 utility knife, so beautiful! My first ever "good" knives, though we have some good workhorse Wusthof knives, and some nice Henckels steak knives.
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